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Thread: examiner.com - Presidential debate question: Will you sign a UN gun ban treaty?

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    examiner.com - Presidential debate question: Will you sign a UN gun ban treaty?

    http://www.examiner.com/article/mond...gun-ban-treaty

    SNIP

    The last of three Presidential debates will be held on Monday, October 22. The topic: Foreign Policy.

    Why is this foreign policy debate the perfect forum to ask the Presidential candidates – point blank – will you sign a UN gun ban treaty? Because a major component of any nation’s “foreign policy” is participation in international treaties.

    And another reason. According to National Rifle Association (NRA) board member David Keane:

    “Gun control advocates from this country have joined literally hundreds of like-minded Non-Governmental Organizations (NGOS) to work with international anti-gun delegates to develop a treaty that could destroy private gun ownership in this country.”

    . . .

    A state law beats a federal law enacted outside the constitutional power of the federal government like paper beats rock. But that same federal law, if enacted pursuant to a treaty, beats state law like rock beats scissors. . . .

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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    A treaty cannot violate the constitution otherwise it is not a valid treaty.
    The treaty they cited though is a gray area because migratory birds affect multiple countries and states.

    The UN Gun ban treaty cannot be used against citizens who are within this country.
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

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    There are a lot of things that the Constitution does not allow that the present government does. Until we can gain confidence again that the words of the Constitution have real meaning to our elected officials, a treaty can do anything to us that the signatories and those in power wish.

    BTW, under the obamacare ruling, all of our rights are subordinate to the government's taxing power under the 16A! They simply need to dictate behaviors for which they can raise/lower our taxes depending on our participation in that behavior. Repeal the 16A! It shredded the rest of the Constitution.

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    Regular Member Jack House's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom1Man View Post
    A treaty cannot violate the constitution otherwise it is not a valid treaty.
    The treaty they cited though is a gray area because migratory birds affect multiple countries and states.

    The UN Gun ban treaty cannot be used against citizens who are within this country.
    Let's pretend the UN does ban guns for civilian use. Now let's also pretend this ban has no effect within the borders of America.

    Now, if I recall correctly, part of the proposed ban was a ban on export/import. While the ban may not be able to ban American gun dealers/owners/whatevers from importing guns, it could very well ban other nations from exporting to America.

    So what? So most of our favorite guns were either wholly manufactured or partially manufactured in European nations. A UN gun ban treaty would stop or significantly reduce the flow of weapons and ammunition from manufacturers like Walther, Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal, Glock(puke ), Accuracy International, Beretta, Benelli, Browning Arms, Heckler & Koch, Para-Ordnance, Sellier & Bellot, Steyr Mannlicher, SIG Sauer GmbH, Winchester Repeating Arms Company and about a billion others I can't think of at the moment.

    No, the UN treaty may not confiscate our guns, but it could cripple our supply.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom1Man View Post
    A treaty cannot violate the constitution otherwise it is not a valid treaty.
    The treaty they cited though is a gray area because migratory birds affect multiple countries and states.
    You are right in a sense - the constitution itself provides that a treaty can authorize federal conduct, or invalidate otherwise valid state powers, that the constitution itslef, does not contemplate. In ohter words, the Treaty power can work as a back door way to amend the constitution. See Missouri v. Holland.

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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    BTW, under the obamacare ruling, all of our rights are subordinate to the government's taxing power under the 16A! They simply need to dictate behaviors for which they can raise/lower our taxes depending on our participation in that behavior. Repeal the 16A! It shredded the rest of the Constitution.
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

    the Sixteenth Amendment "conferred no new power of taxation." Stanton v. Baltic Mining Co., 240 U.S. 103 (1916); see also Brushaber v. Union Pac. R. Co., 240 U.S. 1 (1916).


    You just need to understand that the tax issues are 'my thing' on this site. So don't even start to blow smoke with that 16th Amendment is evil thing.
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

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    examiner.com - Presidential debate question: Will you sign a UN gun ban treaty?

    I suggest you read Robert's opinion, then. He ruled that the individual mandate is constitutional because it is a tax. If the Feds can force us to buy health care "insurance" by making it a tax, what behavior can't they control using the tax code made possible by the 16A?????

    The question is rhetorical and aimed at others reading my post. Reply if you wish, but I will move on to discussing this with others. Your post was quite disinviting of further discussion with you.


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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    I suggest you read Robert's opinion, then. He ruled that the individual mandate is constitutional because it is a tax. If the Feds can force us to buy health care "insurance" by making it a tax, what behavior can't they control using the tax code made possible by the 16A?????

    The question is rhetorical and aimed at others reading my post. Reply if you wish, but I will move on to discussing this with others. Your post was quite disinviting of further discussion with you.


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    The individual in question would not be a citizen then.

    I have looked through the Obamacare and where it would fit into the law books. It would be placed under Subtitle C of the IRC. All taxes in Subtitle C are voluntary.

    Again you are speaking on a subject that you're not as well versed in as I am.
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

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    Regular Member 1911er's Avatar
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    United Nothings

    I wrote Maria Cantwell and asked her why she voted to let the UN overturn our Constitution and this is the reply I got back




    Dear Mr. XXXXXXX,



    Thank you for contacting me regarding the United Nations. I appreciate hearing your views on this important matter.



    The U.S was one of the original four countries, along with China, the United Kingdom and the Soviet Union, to design the structure and purpose of the UN in 1944. The UN officially came into being on October 24, 1945 with 51 original member states and has now grown to include 189 countries. The main purpose of the United Nations is to provide a forum in which world leaders can peacefully resolve disputes and collectively address global challenges, such as environmental conservation, global poverty, and the spread of disease.



    The United Nations is composed of two bodies, the General Assembly and the Security Council, and the U.S. is a permanent member of both. The General Assembly is the main deliberative organ of the United Nations. It is composed of representatives of all member states, each of which has one vote.



    Although decisions by this body have important symbolic importance, as they are representative of world opinion, no decision of the General Assembly is legally binding on any government.



    The Security Council has primary responsibility for the maintenance of international peace and security in accordance with the principles and purposes of the UN. Under the UN Charter, the functions and powers of the Security Council include: investigating disputes, which might lead to international friction, recommending action to deal with an international threat to peace, calling on member nations to apply economic sanctions and other non-military actions to prevent or stop aggression, recommending military action, and recommending to the General Assembly the appointment of the Secretary-General. There are fifteen members of the Security Council – ten rotating members and five permanent members – the five permanent members, including the United States, have veto power over any decision made by the Security Council.



    The U.S. veto means that no action can be taken without U.S. agreement. I am confident that U.S. sovereignty remains assured and undiluted by our participation in the United Nations. That said , it is important to note that our prominent position in the institution provides a valuable forum through which the United States can work multilaterally to peacefully affect positive global change and encourage stability through around the world.



    I support efforts to ensure a continued active and productive role for the United States in the United Nations. Since October 24, 1945, America has served the United Nations with honor and distinction, and will continue to do so in the years to come.



    Thank you again for contacting me to share your thoughts on this matter. Please do not hesitate to contact me in the future if I can be of further assistance.



    Sincerely,
    Maria Cantwell
    United States Senator
    I truly Love my Country, But the government scares the he!! out of me.

    DEMAND IT
    Congress SHALL NOT receive A salary greater than any service member and will be given EQUIVELANT insurance as any service member

    I came into this world kicking and screaming covered in someone else's blood. And if necessary to protect the Constitution of The United States of AMERICA. I will go out the same way

    All hail the Domain of Neptunus Rex

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    Uhh... did she answer the question?

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    examiner.com - Presidential debate question: Will you sign a UN gun ban treaty?

    I am sorry. What was the question?


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    Regular Member 1911er's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    I am sorry. What was the question?


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    I read it 3 times just to make sure I didn't miss the answer. But nope it wasn't there.
    I truly Love my Country, But the government scares the he!! out of me.

    DEMAND IT
    Congress SHALL NOT receive A salary greater than any service member and will be given EQUIVELANT insurance as any service member

    I came into this world kicking and screaming covered in someone else's blood. And if necessary to protect the Constitution of The United States of AMERICA. I will go out the same way

    All hail the Domain of Neptunus Rex

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    Regular Member 1911er's Avatar
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    I sent this back:

    I am not college educated but I can tell when someone is avoiding answering A question.

    I assume the answer you sent in reply to my question was from so many years doing the political tap-dance in order to keep making A paycheck on the taxpayers expense. How about A straight answer" why did you vote to give control of the of the Constitution United States Of America to the united nations " after you swore an oath to protect said Constitution. end of question "

    I am awaiting your reply How about A straight answer"





    Loren C.Burruss

    clay.burruss@yahoo.com
    I truly Love my Country, But the government scares the he!! out of me.

    DEMAND IT
    Congress SHALL NOT receive A salary greater than any service member and will be given EQUIVELANT insurance as any service member

    I came into this world kicking and screaming covered in someone else's blood. And if necessary to protect the Constitution of The United States of AMERICA. I will go out the same way

    All hail the Domain of Neptunus Rex

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