OT: Unmanned Aerial Drones for SPD - Public meeting

massivedesign · Oct 25, 2012

Waste of $$

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2012/10/seattle_police_will_use_drones.html

It is operated with a handheld controller and joysticks. It carries cameras that can take still pictures, videos and infrared shots. It is limited by a battery life of less than 10 minutes and an inability to carry more than 35 ounces — a little more than 2 pounds, police said.

BigDave · Oct 25, 2012

massivedesign said:
Waste of $$

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2012/10/seattle_police_will_use_drones.html

Seems the associated press is only partially reporting as the battery power is available up to 30 minutes but still seems to short for an effective use.

From the article on oregonlive.com

Seattle police plan to use the mini-helicopter Draganflyer X6 made by the Draganfly Innovations company of Saskatoon, Canada,

http://www.draganfly.com/uav-helicopter/draganflyer-x6/features/advanced-power-system.php

The Draganflyer X6 helicopter battery stores enough power for flights approximately 20 minutes long with out payload in optimum conditions. Using lithium polymer cell technology, the Draganflyer X6 battery is significantly lighter and higher capacity than an equivalently shaped conventional rechargeable battery. With its integrated power and balancer connectors, recharging is simple and takes only 30 minutes. A spare battery installs easily so you can continue flying while the used one charges.

Does not seem to be the same model pictured??

mlr · Oct 25, 2012

BigDave said:
Get the tin hats out, oh my god the sky is falling!!! Were on the verge of total collapse and annihilation.

Unmanned hmmm I guess this can be said about an R.C. Car, Boat, Plane, Helicopter though the use of unmanned tends one to think of the drones being used as weapons by the military and there is no indication of such type of weaponized versions.

View attachment 9442

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...f/2012/10/seattle_police_will_use_drones.html

There is a bit of the tin foil hat thing that pops up when these types of proposals are brought up. The other extreme are those that will say the Government is doing this for a reason. That they are here solely to help make life better for me.

Both extremes are wrong, hopefully. The thing is if we sit back and do nothing and nothing bad happens we will all have a good laugh at the expense of the tin foil hat folks. But if we sit idly by and these toys are abused who will we laugh at then?
It is the job of the American citizen to watch over his Government at all times to ensure that it is constantly held in check. People need to realize that you cannot and must not depend on the Courts to keep the Government in check. The Courts are the government!
We the people must be the ones who watch over them. It is our rights in the balance.

Michael

gogodawgs · Oct 25, 2012

Christmas

For Christmas I am getting my own drone....

http://store.apple.com/us/product/H8859ZM/A/parrot-ardrone-20

http://ardrone2.parrot.com/i-want-it/

davidmcbeth · Oct 25, 2012

All you folks who think the drones are nothing will be changing your mind when police swat teams are knocking down your doors because the drones photographed what a cop thinks is a single pot plant in your backyard.

Jeff Hayes · Oct 25, 2012

I agree with Triggerdr.

BigDave · Oct 25, 2012

davidmcbeth said:
All you folks who think the drones are nothing will be changing your mind when police swat teams are knocking down your doors because the drones photographed what a cop thinks is a single pot plant in your backyard.

Thanks I needed a good laugh, oh hmm you were joking right?

badkarma · Oct 25, 2012

53oz and 15 minutes of battery life? I thought they were talking actual drones not my son's christmas present. i bet they spent 10 times what it is actually worth.

davidmcbeth · Oct 25, 2012

BigDave said:
Thanks I needed a good laugh, oh hmm you were joking right?

Of course once they get drones today, tomorrow's drones will be over your backyard. And always in the skies. You will be slaves to these drones.

SeattleWingsfan · Oct 26, 2012

badkarma said:
53oz and 15 minutes of battery life? I thought they were talking actual drones not my son's christmas present. i bet they spent 10 times what it is actually worth.

Seattle paid 40K a piece for the carbon fiber ones they bought.

Trigger Dr · Oct 26, 2012

How resistant will these be to spurious signals? Remember the CB radio signals that could possibly set off electric blasting caps? Hmmmmmmm

EMNofSeattle · Oct 26, 2012

Trigger Dr said:
How resistant will these be to spurious signals? Remember the CB radio signals that could possibly set off electric blasting caps? Hmmmmmmm

Didn't CBs also interfere with analog TVs and AM radio if I remeber correctly?

I have a CB, fun little thing.

do these drones use analog radio frequencies in a band that ham radio equipment could be modified to disrupt?

Citizen · Oct 26, 2012

DocWalker said:
I guess we can take the goverments word that they won't fly more than approved, or that they won't put anything on them, or they won't record anyone......

Dam almost typed that with a straight face. Just kidding they shouldn't be using them at all.

Agreed. We've seen it time and time again. If the government has the technology it will abuse it, even if it is illegal.

How many thousands of times did that No Such Agency intercept the communications of US citizens? 4K? 7K?

Remember the collusion between FBI and the telecom companies over their subscriber info a few years ago? It was illegal for telecoms to give out info without a warrant or subpoena. Then Congress came along and retroactively made it legal. Despite the constitutional prohibition on ex post facto laws.

Remember the surveillance with FLIR (forward looking infra-red) where cops were going around neighborhoods aiming FLIR at houses for heat from MJ growing operations?

GPS cell phone tracking and car tracking is still in the controversy stage.

Drones will be abused. Guaranteed.

1245A Defender · Oct 26, 2012

Well,,,

Trigger Dr said:
Pull!!!!!!

A couple of years ago on a TV show called Harry's Law, the cops had a drone outside her house,
spying in the window of her neighbor,,,
Harry didnt know who it was looking at, or what IT really was...
She brought out her shotgun,,,yelled "PULL" and shot it out of the sky!!
Cops tried to prosicute her for destruction of police property,,, and lost...

Tacitus42 · Oct 26, 2012

EMNofSeattle said:
Well Police have been flying Helicopters and fixed wing aircraft for some time now, the State Patrol owns 5 cessnas and King County sheriff has three helicopters.

I'm willing to compromise with the police department.

You can fly drones, but only one drone per 100,000 people with a cap of 4 (which means seattle could have a maximum of 4) Drones could not be equipped with any device allowing them to see inside a house or structure, and if you're department is running helicopters or fixed wing air craft that counts against your drone total. (for instance, if have a city of 600,000 people and operate one helicopter that's only 3 drones.

I think such a policy would be reasonable and beneficial for all involved. IMHO

* A Corollary, you can fly drones over the maximum if used for a specific police operation such as a search warrant signed by a judge the drone may only be used for that op and must head straight back with cameras used only to fly and not observe, or if you're in an active chase, but a limit of 4 for general patrol at all times and must use "a birds eye view" only, no FLIR or electro magnetic type sensors to look in buildings.

4 to patrol at all times?? WTF? Time to grow up son. The police are not your friends. Somebody once said something about security,freedom and deserving. Oh well he's dead now. Now we have you.

Democide

gogodawgs · Oct 26, 2012

EMNofSeattle said:
<snip>I'm willing to compromise with the police department. <snip>

NO compromise. According to the Constitution of the United States they need a warrant issued by a judge. I do not see any other option.

Here is what SPD says:

The police department's proposed guidelines state that the department's unmanned aerial systems will be authorized in the following types of investigations and responses: homicide and traffic, hazardous material, search and rescue, barricaded persons and natural disasters.

And we all know that they follow their own guidelines

They never beat the "mexican piss" out of any citizens. They never shoot unarmed Native American woodcarvers.

A warrant from a judge for each and every use. That is the only acceptable usage.

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2019526462_drones26m.html

PistolPackingMomma · Oct 26, 2012

EMNofSeattle said:
Well Police have been flying Helicopters and fixed wing aircraft for some time now, the State Patrol owns 5 cessnas and King County sheriff has three helicopters.

I'm willing to compromise with the police department.

You can fly drones, but only one drone per 100,000 people with a cap of 4 (which means seattle could have a maximum of 4) Drones could not be equipped with any device allowing them to see inside a house or structure, and if you're department is running helicopters or fixed wing air craft that counts against your drone total. (for instance, if have a city of 600,000 people and operate one helicopter that's only 3 drones.

I think such a policy would be reasonable and beneficial for all involved. IMHO

* A Corollary, you can fly drones over the maximum if used for a specific police operation such as a search warrant signed by a judge the drone may only be used for that op and must head straight back with cameras used only to fly and not observe, or if you're in an active chase, but a limit of 4 for general patrol at all times and must use "a birds eye view" only, no FLIR or electro magnetic type sensors to look in buildings.

.

Jeff Hayes · Oct 26, 2012

gogodawgs said:
NO compromise. According to the Constitution of the United States they need a warrant issued by a judge. I do not see any other option.

Here is what SPD says:

And we all know that they follow their own guidelines They never beat the "mexican piss" out of any citizens. They never shoot unarmed Native American woodcarvers.

A warrant from a judge for each and every use. That is the only acceptable usage.

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2019526462_drones26m.html

+1000

Ajetpilot · Oct 26, 2012

http://www.judgenap.com/index.php?post=lawmakers-mull-restrictions-on-domestic-drones

House Judiciary Committee lawmakers discussed legislation to restrict the use of drones in domestic airspace during a field forum at Rice University in Texas on Thursday. Rep. Ted Poe (R-Texas), who chaired the forum of the Subcommittee on Crime, urged Congress to take up his Preserving American Privacy Act, which would only allow police to use drones with a warrant and to investigate a felony...

sudden valley gunner · Oct 26, 2012

EMNofSeattle said:
I guess we can just take your word that you're not going to shoot people up while you're OCing too, If we make my idea a law and make it subject to the exclusionary rule then any evidence gathered would be suppressed

Fallacy strawman argument. He has a fundamental right to bear arms, government and their street warriors have no fundamental rights only powers granted to them by the people. People who are continually willing to compromise their liberties for an illusion of "safety".

davidmcbeth said:
All you folks who think the drones are nothing will be changing your mind when police swat teams are knocking down your doors because the drones photographed what a cop thinks is a single pot plant in your backyard.

Some people are just too trusting or actually like government tracking our every move. Technology will always be used to abuse or surpass our fundamental right to be secure in our private affairs by those pretending it's about safety.

http://news.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474978510195

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