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Thread: Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    Alright i live in north Carolina and open carry every day with no issues at all. Tomorrow ill be visiting Marion Michigan for one day now i know Michigan is an open carry state but it is also a pistol registration state, so should i be worried about open carrying while there or what? any help is appreciated

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    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    You don't have to worry about registration, it doesn't apply to you. However, if you do not have a NC carry license, you cannot carry (open or concealed) in your car and you will need to avoid our pistol free zones, such as anyplace that has a liquor license. This includes most grocery stores and restaurants. Do you have a NC carry license?
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
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    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
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    These are what the laws say regarding having a pistol in Michigan being a non-resident.
    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure; forging application; implementation during business hours.
    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.
    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the
    Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency
    in this state.

    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; amendatory act as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by
    another state.
    I'd recommend looking up MCL 750.234d and 28.425o. as well. If you have a licensed to carry a concealed weapon by North Carolina or another state 750.234d. really isn't an issue.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

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    ok let me give a little bit of info as to why im even having to open carry in Michigan, im from florida my residency is in florida i have a florida CWL, ive been in the army for the past few years and recently got out and came to north Carolina. a few weeks ago my car was stolen along with my wallet (i know how dumb i left it in the car) in it was just about every identification i have including my CWL ive managed to get a new driver license and debit card and etc but the process to get a replacement CWL from Florida is LENGTHY to say the least. So until i get a replacement CWL my only legal mode of carrying my pistol has been open carry which works great i dont mind it i actually like OC. But brings me to my issue now of traveling to michigan to see a house my family is interested in buying. Even though i have a CWL its useless because i need the physical in hand license on me to conceal a handgun. So what are my options? its looking like michigan is not so gun friendly i might have to just leave my pistol at home.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    Marion!?!?

    My family lives there. 700 ppl, wow. Not much in 49665! Don't get bored...
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    In order to open carry in Michigan, it is best you have a concealed pistol license issued from the state you are a resident of. You must have this license and your driver's license on you at all times.

    If you are not in physical possession of these items, it becomes complicated at best. Illegal at worst.

    As much as it sucks and I hate to say it, you are probably best to leave your handgun at home. don't even have it in your luggage.

    You can technically OC if you have a non-resident license in your possession...that's where it gets "complicated.
    Last edited by TheQ; 11-12-2012 at 03:57 PM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    The less people the better imo lol besides with things like atvs,snowmobiles,fishing and of course target shooting and hunting i dont think well get bored. can you shed any light on this for me "The Q"

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    sigh.. i dont leave my pistol anywhere much less a few states away this is going to be the first time were separated. crap

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    Quote Originally Posted by xmilitary View Post
    sigh.. i dont leave my pistol anywhere much less a few states away this is going to be the first time were separated. crap
    Sorry

    Going hunting...?
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    I think Q is just saying it's probably wise if you don't carry without your license in hand. You can bring your gun, but just leave it in your suitcase/trunk.

    What Q is talking about as being "complicated" is that, the way the law is written, you SHOULD be able to OC in the PFZs using a non-resident license (and by that I mean your NC carry license with your FL driver's license), but if you get in a bad situation you may have to prove that in court. A strict reading of the law says it's okay.
    Last edited by griffin; 11-12-2012 at 04:12 PM.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
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    well if we like this house as much in person as we do through pictures.. which i have a feeling we will, then i plan on doing all of the above, its got 75 acres so it gives me a little room to work with we want horses and cows as well. pistol registration is new to me and to be honest i dont like it, being a former service member i hold my constitution near and dear to my heart

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    ok thanks griffin, and its a florida cwl and driver license. so leaving unloaded and locked up should be ok from my interpretation of the 28.422 but carrying on person openly gets complicated correct?

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    wow small world my in laws have property in marion. They have owned for at least 20 yrs nice little town

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    From what i have seen through photos its beautiful. ill check it out in person tomorrow

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    Quote Originally Posted by griffin View Post
    I think Q is just saying it's probably wise if you don't carry without your license in hand. You can bring your gun, but just leave it in your suitcase/trunk.

    No you can't leave it in your suitcase. You can't have a gun in Michigan unless you have Registered it via the permit to purchase process class till pistol license Or you have a license from another state granting you permission to possess a firearm.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    Quote Originally Posted by xmilitary View Post
    ok thanks griffin, and its a florida cwl and driver license. so leaving unloaded and locked up should be ok from my interpretation of the 28.422 but carrying on person openly gets complicated correct?
    Don't bring your pistol to Michigan unless you have a permit from your state that allows you to have a gun
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Help will be visiting michigan tommorrow

    MCL 28.422:

    (1) Except as otherwise provided in this section, a person shall not purchase, carry, possess, or transport a pistol in this state without first having obtained a license for the pistol as prescribed in this section.


    This seems crystal clear to me.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure; forging application; implementation during business hours.
    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.
    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the
    Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency
    in this state.

    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; amendatory act as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by
    another state

    I believe i fall in to the except do i not?

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmilitary View Post
    28.422 License to purchase, carry, possess, or transport pistol; issuance; qualifications; applications; sale of pistol; exemptions; nonresidents; basic pistol safety brochure; forging application; implementation during business hours.
    (8) An individual who is not a resident of this state is not required to obtain a license under this section if all of the following conditions apply:
    (a) The individual is licensed in his or her state of residence to purchase, carry, or transport a pistol.
    (b) The individual is in possession of the license described in subdivision (a).
    (c) The individual is the owner of the pistol he or she possesses, carries, or transports.
    (d) The individual possesses the pistol for a lawful purpose as that term is defined in section 231a of the
    Michigan penal code, 1931 PA 328, MCL 750.231a.
    (e) The individual is in this state for a period of 180 days or less and does not intend to establish residency
    in this state.

    28.432 Inapplicability of MCL 28.422; amendatory act as “Janet Kukuk act”.
    (f) A United States citizen holding a license to carry a pistol concealed upon his or her person issued by
    another state

    I believe i fall in to the except do i not?
    Note the law says you have to meet all of the criteria. Are you in possession of the license? (See "b")
    Last edited by TheQ; 11-12-2012 at 05:48 PM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    nope, so i could face the 90 days in jail or a 100.00 fine or both for failure to present the license to the officer, and that goes for either open or cc, so by this even transporting unloaded and locked would be illegal. so for people from free states that do not have a chl that just purchase a pistol and open carry its illegal to bring there handgun to Michigan because there state does not issue a license to purchase or own a firearm? for example Alaska there is no need for any license to purchase or conceal its illegal for an Alaskan to bring there gun to Michigan?

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmilitary View Post
    nope, so i could face the 90 days in jail or a 100.00 fine or both for failure to present the license to the officer, and that goes for either open or cc, so by this even transporting unloaded and locked would be illegal. so for people from free states that do not have a chl that just purchase a pistol and open carry its illegal to bring there handgun to Michigan because there state does not issue a license to purchase or own a firearm? for example Alaska there is no need for any license to purchase or conceal its illegal for an Alaskan to bring there gun to Michigan?
    Alaska issues an optional license, iirc. The person would need to have said license with them. People who live in the Con Carry state of Vermont that issues no license are screwed in Michigan.

    I'm sorry, but as much as the law sucks it is crystal clear. I've pointed you to the law, now it's up to you to do as you will.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    I may have to reread this thread, but I thought the poster said he DOES have a NC gun permit, but he just lost his wallet with his FL gun permit and driver's license.

    If you do NOT have a permit from ANY state, then Q is correct, you should not bring your pistol.

    Edit: reread post, nothing about a NC gun permit. Sorry, I don't know where I got that. My bad. Don't bring your pistol without a license.
    Last edited by griffin; 11-12-2012 at 06:05 PM.
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    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
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    i understand, i appreciate the clarification, it just amazes me how states can create laws that conflict with our constitutional rights. thanks again

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xmilitary View Post
    i understand, i appreciate the clarification, it just amazes me how states can create laws that conflict with our constitutional rights. thanks again
    The Michigan Constitution which protects the individual right to keep and bear arms is sadly just a piece of paper. It can't defend itself.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    i have a florida cwl that was in a vehicle that was stolen while in north carolina. i most definitely have a cwl but not carrying the physical license on person means i cant conceal although in some states its just a fine for not having it with you.

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