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Thread: Secession madness! Now 40 states join petition fray

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    Secession madness! Now 40 states join petition fray

    http://www.wnd.com/2012/11/secession...petition-fray/

    If any of the hundreds of thousands of people petitioning the White House in the blossoming battle over secession get their way, somebody is going to leave the union, either voluntarily or involuntarily.

    Ever since WND first reported that residents in the state of Louisiana had filed an online petition with the White House to secede from the U.S., residents in at least 39 additional states have filed similar requests with the White House to peaceably break from the union.

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    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    I don't think your allowed to leave the US.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    I wouldn't get all hot and bothered over these secession stories. The federal government would never allow it and Id be willing to bet everything I own that if these states did try and break off the federal nipple, they would send troops in AND even fire on American citizens. The federal troops would gladly shoot as well since the people of those states would quickly be labeled as "terrorists" giving the troops peace of mine and steady aim.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Looks like a Tuesday meeting coming up in the whitehouse on secession.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    I wouldn't get all hot and bothered over these secession stories. The federal government would never allow it and Id be willing to bet everything I own that if these states did try and break off the federal nipple, they would send troops in AND even fire on American citizens. The federal troops would gladly shoot as well since the people of those states would quickly be labeled as "terrorists" giving the troops peace of mine and steady aim.
    I think that they are not talking about leaving the union using unlawful methods....if one were to use lawful methods, the feds would do nothing.

    If I recall, only Texas can break away without a vote in federal jurisdiction. All that Texas needs is the vote of Texans.

    All others would need votes from all over the country to leave. Not impossible but highly improbable. But even if one did wish to leave illegally, no civil war would occur. The world is smaller now and relatives are scattered all over ... nobody is going to want to shoot their brother. If the state votes internally to leave, the other states would say "awww, thats too bad".

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix David
    I don't think you're allowed to leave the US.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229
    I wouldn't get all hot and bothered over these secession stories.
    The federal government would never allow it and I'd be willing to bet everything I own that if these states did try and break off the federal nipple, they would send troops in AND even fire on American citizens.
    Since the USA is a voluntary association, of course states are "allowed" to leave.
    And I have no doubt that, just as with England in 1776, it will not be a peaceful process...
    IF it happens, it'll be a messy divorce.

    I'd have to research the % vote needed to withdraw, but I'm betting it's at least 51%, maybe even 67%.
    There are states where that could happen, and there are states (like TX) that could do just fine on their own, TYVM, but other than as a symbolic gesture I don't think this will go anywhere.

    Now... if our elected leaders would take the hint (applied with a clue by four) that there are lots of people unhappy with the way things are now & the way they look to be heading, maybe things would get better.
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    I would love to be a fly on the wall when Obama is told, somehow with his ego I don't think he will be laughing.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    I would love to be a fly on the wall when Obama is told, somehow with his ego I don't think he will be laughing.
    "Well its only 40 outta 57 even thinking about leaving"...Obamalama

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    "Well its only 40 outta 57 even thinking about leaving"...Obamalama
    +1
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
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    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
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    Regular Member paramedic70002's Avatar
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    At the rate of exponential growth of this movement, pretty soon the only folks who won't be petitioning to leave the USA are the White House occupants.
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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I think that they are not talking about leaving the union using unlawful methods....if one were to use lawful methods, the feds would do nothing.

    If I recall, only Texas can break away without a vote in federal jurisdiction. All that Texas needs is the vote of Texans.

    All others would need votes from all over the country to leave. Not impossible but highly improbable. But even if one did wish to leave illegally, no civil war would occur. The world is smaller now and relatives are scattered all over ... nobody is going to want to shoot their brother. If the state votes internally to leave, the other states would say "awww, thats too bad".
    Even if one state did get the necessary votes to secede and began to proactively distance itself from the federal government,you think the WH and the military are just going to stand idly by and let it happen?
    Im not talking about a Civil War either, because frankly I dont think most of the American people have the backbone to actually fight in the streets for something they believe in.
    Im talking about martial law being declared in those states that decide to secede.

    The federal government KNOWS that if one states does leave, and is successful governing itself, it would be a complete domino effect over time. They will NOT let that even begin to happen.
    "Let your gun be your constant companion during your walks" ~Thomas Jefferson

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    Even if one state did get the necessary votes to secede and began to proactively distance itself from the federal government,you think the WH and the military are just going to stand idly by and let it happen?
    Im not talking about a Civil War either, because frankly I dont think most of the American people have the backbone to actually fight in the streets for something they believe in.
    Im talking about martial law being declared in those states that decide to secede.

    The federal government KNOWS that if one states does leave, and is successful governing itself, it would be a complete domino effect over time. They will NOT let that even begin to happen.
    I somewhat agree with you, BUT how would the UN handle this, Israel considering how Obama has been pushing for breaking her up. How about Russia when we were largely responsible for her break up. You think these countries will not say anything when we have stuck our nose in the very same matters in other sovereign states. Where would Obama's credibility be with these countries.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    I somewhat agree with you, BUT how would the UN handle this,
    I dont thin the UN would even get involved to tell you the truth. Look, lets be honest. Most of the American people are soft. Once federal troops started patrolling your neighborhood with infantry, armor and in control of the air. What is anyone going to do? Not to mention, all of the food stamps, welfare and SSI payments to everyone in that state will cease.
    Then on top of that, all of the federal funding for your local police and fire departments will no longer be paid. This will in turn mean that not only will you have federal troops occupying your state, but the police officers and even the EMT's and fireman will be against you, the John Q Public if you will.

    Where would Obama's credibility be with these countries.
    Obama's credibility would probably go up. Russian, China and all of Europe would vote in favor of Obama for doing whats necessary to control these "rouge states" and the "domestic terrorists" that reside there. Just look at how Russian reacted to Chechnya only 12 years ago when they wanted to break away from Russia. That was a bloodbath.

    I may be a pessimist, but Im also a realist. And as much as I would love to see some of the states go ahead and become self reliant and detach from the union, I dont think it will happen.
    Last edited by Sig229; 11-14-2012 at 01:46 AM.
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    I dont thin the UN would even get involved to tell you the truth. Look, lets be honest. Most of the American people are soft. Once federal troops started patrolling your neighborhood with infantry, armor and in control of the air. What is anyone going to do? Not to mention, all of the food stamps, welfare and SSI payments to everyone in that state will cease.
    Then on top of that, all of the federal funding for your local police and fire departments will no longer be paid. This will in turn mean that not only will you have federal troops occupying your state, but the police officers and even the EMT's and fireman will be against you, the John Q Public if you will.



    Obama's credibility would probably go up. Russian, China and all of Europe would vote in favor of Obama for doing whats necessary to control these "rouge states" and the "domestic terrorists" that reside there. Just look at how Russian reacted to Chechnya only 12 years ago when they wanted to break away from Russia. That was a bloodbath.

    I may be a pessimist, but Im also a realist. And as much as I would love to see some of the states go ahead and become self reliant and detach from the union, I dont think it will happen.
    Police and fire are not paid by Obama, they are paid with property taxes, and we don't need no stinkin police. I suggest you listen to Russian news, they do broadcast in english.
    Last edited by WalkingWolf; 11-14-2012 at 02:03 AM.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
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    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
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    There must be some irony here. Lincoln, black president, secession.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    There must be some irony here. Lincoln, black president, secession.
    Yea it is kinda funny, I doubt Obama thinks so...
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

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    Regular Member Sig229's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Police and fire are not paid by Obama, they are paid with property taxes, and we don't need no stinkin police. I suggest you listen to Russian news, they do broadcast in english.
    Indeed they are paid by local and state taxes. But do you have any idea how much local LE and Fire rely on federal grants? A lot!
    My mother lives in a town with one stop light, one gas station and about 200 residents. But her local FD have been getting FEDERAL grants over the last ten years and have some off the most expensive equipment that money can buy. And guess what? They really never even use it.

    The two part time cops in that town also recently got a K-9 dog and all of the training that goes with a K9. AND a brand new SUV so that the K9 has more room in the vehicle while on patrol. All federal money. Dont kid yourself, federal grants are huge even in the smallest communities.

    In my home town of Baltimore, federal money flew out of the treasury for new officers, overtime, and even police cameras that went up throughout the city.

    When the district commander of your local PD comes in and tells the officers at a patrol briefing that "due to losing our federal grants, we have to make some cuts in equipment and man power. Only half of you are going to get paid this month".
    What exactly do you think those police are going to do? Help your/our cause?
    Last edited by Sig229; 11-14-2012 at 02:15 AM.
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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sig229 View Post
    Indeed they are paid by local and state taxes. But do you have any idea how much local LE and Fire rely on federal grants? A lot!
    My mother lives in a town with one stop light, one gas station and about 200 residents. But her local FD have been getting FEDERAL grants over the last ten years and have some off the most expensive equipment that money can buy. And guess what? They really never even use it.

    The two part time cops in that town also recently got a K-9 dog and all of the training that goes with a K9. AND a brand new SUV so that the K9 has more room in the vehicle while on patrol. All federal money. Dont kid yourself, federal grants are huge even in the smallest communities.

    In my home town of Baltimore, federal money flew out of the treasury for new officers, overtime, and even police cameras that went up throughout the city.

    When the district commander of your local PD comes in and tells the officers at a patrol briefing that "due to losing our federal grants, we have to make some cuts in equipment and man power. Only half of you are going to get paid this month".
    What exactly do you think those police are going to do? Help your/our cause?
    Do you know where federal money comes from? It is not a money tree in DC, and it does not grow out of Obama's ears.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

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    Regular Member david.ross's Avatar
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    People who sign the petition of secession should be charged with treason.

    I signed this petition instead:
    Deport Everyone That Signed A Petition To Withdraw Their State From The United States Of America.
    http://wh.gov/9FAY
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    Activist Member carsontech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by david.ross View Post
    People who sign the petition of secession should be charged with treason.

    I signed this petition instead:
    Deport Everyone That Signed A Petition To Withdraw Their State From The United States Of America.
    http://wh.gov/9FAY
    Why is it that you think signers of the petition should be charged with treason?

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by david.ross View Post
    People who sign the petition of secession should be charged with treason.

    I signed this petition instead:
    Deport Everyone That Signed A Petition To Withdraw Their State From The United States Of America.
    http://wh.gov/9FAY
    Ah, the tolerance of the intolerant left.
    I expel anti-gay people off my teams. Tolerance is key to team cohesion and team building.
    Thanks for throwing out the "treason card."......R/Big Sis.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
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    Activist Member JamesCanby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by david.ross View Post
    People who sign the petition of secession should be charged with treason.

    I signed this petition instead:
    Deport Everyone That Signed A Petition To Withdraw Their State From The United States Of America.
    http://wh.gov/9FAY
    How absurd! Deport an American Citizen ... To where? A government can deport a non-citizen back to their country of origin ... But for an American citizen, the U.S. *is* their country of origin. And to suggest sanctions against an American citizen for exercising his/her Constitutional right of petitioning his/her government for redress bespeaks a woeful disregard or understanding of our Constitutional rights.

    The tolerance you seek (based on your avatar) and the tolerance you deny to other's opinions (based on your signature notes and your comments in this thread) say more about you than your opinion on what actions should be taken on petition signers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I think that they are not talking about leaving the union using unlawful methods....if one were to use lawful methods, the feds would do nothing.

    If I recall, only Texas can break away without a vote in federal jurisdiction. All that Texas needs is the vote of Texans.

    All others would need votes from all over the country to leave. Not impossible but highly improbable. But even if one did wish to leave illegally, no civil war would occur. The world is smaller now and relatives are scattered all over ... nobody is going to want to shoot their brother. If the state votes internally to leave, the other states would say "awww, thats too bad".
    Actually, all Texas can do is split up into a few more territories. I think they have 5 now, and can split into 4 more?

    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Do you know where federal money comes from? It is not a money tree in DC, and it does not grow out of Obama's ears.
    I heard Ben Bernake has some magic markers and an unlimited supply of toliet paper...

    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Ah, the tolerance of the intolerant left.


    Thanks for throwing out the "treason card."......R/Big Sis.
    +1.
    What was that quote of Lincoln's about secession again?

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    I wonder in how many of these 40 states the vote totals were for Obama.

    Seems the vote for secession should have occured on election day. Would have been a lot easier just to throw them out.

    I wonder if all these folks voted.

    Many people talk about revolution but if they can not fight to vote them out. They will not fight when things get bloody.
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