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Thread: Philadelphia oc video - negative encounter

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    Philadelphia oc video - negative encounter

    I didn't see this one on here and thought it should be added. This video was recorded on 11-8-12 and posted to youtube 11-14-12



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agWde2tpfx4
    Last edited by Slidell Jim; 11-15-2012 at 03:00 PM.

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    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    What a ... hmmm...
    See You Next Tuesday

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    I couldn't understand a word that cop said ... and it was not due to bad audio quality ... Philly...


    I was in their airport and asked a cop (who was sitting on like a tall lifeguard chair) if I could smoke my e-cig ... he said there was no law prohibiting it but he wouldn't allow it....so I whipped it out and started puffing away. He just looked at me like I killed his dog. hahaha

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    Regular Member okiebryan's Avatar
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    I had to stop watching the video because it made me so angry.

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    Quote Originally Posted by okiebryan View Post
    I had to stop watching the video because it made me so angry.
    i know exactly what you mean. my pulse starts racing when i view this kind of ignorance. this guy needs to sue. the officer admitted they had no RAS
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    Regular Member fjpro2a's Avatar
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    Keep us informed

    Please let us know if a law suit is filed, and the outcome. A different negative encounter happened a few years ago in Philly, and I believe the Police Dept had to admit it was wrong.

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    Regular Member Curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fjpro2a View Post
    Please let us know if a law suit is filed, and the outcome. A different negative encounter happened a few years ago in Philly, and I believe the Police Dept had to admit it was wrong.
    If you are referring to Mark Fiorino, the outcome was an Offer of Judgement, and the Philly PD admitted no wrongdoing. It was the attorney's suggestion that this Offer, along with all the publicity and the changes the PPD were implementing was about the best resolution they could hope for in this case.

    Changing the Philly mindset, from the beat cop all the way to the Mayor's office, is going to take much more than a single incident (and payout), and the fight continues. Some folks think small progress is being made, and anecdotal evidence supports that notion.

    The law-abiding citizen in the video is still considering his options here, and supportive folks stand ready to back him up. There is already another open carry event being planned for the area.

    Good article... http://www.philly.com/philly/news/20...rying_gun.html

    Here are a couple threads about the incident...

    http://forum.pafoa.org/open-carry-14...-disarmed.html

    http://www.pa2a.org/thread-ppd-at-it-again

    Thanks to the OP (Slidell Jim) for posting this thread.
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    Did I see the cop follow him into the barber shop and try to get him trespassed?

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    Regular Member Curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    Did I see the cop follow him into the barber shop and try to get him trespassed?
    That is correct. Pathetic, isn't it?

    Fiorino stopped in to the same barber shop yesterday to thank the barber for not reacting to the cop, and it seems they had
    a nice conversation. Seems the barber is a stand-up guy!
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    Captain Frances Healy, a police lawyer... said that openly carrying a gun is dangerous - someone could grab it - but that most open-carry advocates are law-abiding.
    He tells cops to consider thinking of it this way: "If something would go wrong on the street and you were getting your butt kicked, I would venture to guess it'd be one of these individuals that would come to help you.
    "Make a friend," he said. "You might need them one day."
    Well, he's almost got his head on straight. At least he's better than the officers on the street.
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    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    you are right , i didn't understand a word the cop said. what languish is that?

    he really should shut up when dealing with the cops
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    Quote Originally Posted by papa bear View Post
    you are right , i didn't understand a word the cop said. what languish is that?
    he really should shut up when dealing with the cops
    For what it's worth, it's my contention that the cop in yellow was frightened. I've seen frightened men talk like that before. Almost from the begining it's my guess he knew he messed up but rather than admit it and back off, he just continued to dig himelf in deeper - and I suggest that frightened men with guns are dangerous men.

    As for "he really should shut up when dealing with the cops", I agree and if any of you are interested go over to YouTube and search for the video which goes by the title "Why you shouldn't talk to the Cops" or a title very similar to that. If you're going to engage in OC that video is worth down loading and reviewed a half dozen or more times - until all of it sinks in. The actual video consists of two (2) videos; the first by a fast talking law professor from Virginia Beach VA, followed by what appears to be a very competent police detective, also from Virginia Beach VA.

    By the way, who has the web site address which offers Firotino's complaint as recently filed, I believe in the U.S. Third District but I could be wrong about that.

    tyc

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    Regular Member Curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyc View Post
    For what it's worth, it's my contention that the cop in yellow was frightened. I've seen frightened men talk like that before. Almost from the begining it's my guess he knew he messed up but rather than admit it and back off, he just continued to dig himelf in deeper - and I suggest that frightened men with guns are dangerous men.

    As for "he really should shut up when dealing with the cops", I agree and if any of you are interested go over to YouTube and search for the video which goes by the title "Why you shouldn't talk to the Cops" or a title very similar to that. If you're going to engage in OC that video is worth down loading and reviewed a half dozen or more times - until all of it sinks in. The actual video consists of two (2) videos; the first by a fast talking law professor from Virginia Beach VA, followed by what appears to be a very competent police detective, also from Virginia Beach VA.

    By the way, who has the web site address which offers Firotino's complaint as recently filed, I believe in the U.S. Third District but I could be wrong about that.

    tyc

    Fiorino (pdf): http://forum.pafoa.org/attachment.ph...4&d=1329236479

    "Don't talk to cops, part 1": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i8z7NC5sgik

    "Don't talk to cops, part 2": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08fZQ...feature=relmfu

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    I watched the video and those two "officers" are an embarrassment to officers that actually know the law.

    Open carry is legal in PA and even in Philly (with ltcf), no limit on the number of magazines, no law against hollow point ammunition or how many you can carry. The person that was stopped should have asked these two for the statutes concerning the bogus laws they were trying to enforce!

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    the whole hollow point issue is just plain ignorant too. they are a better choice than FMJ if you don't want collateral damage from over-penetration. and as a marine veteran, i'm ashamed that the one cop seems to have forgotten his oath (if he ever was a marine in the first place).
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    Wow

    Oh my GOD!!!

    These two guys were cops???? They looked and carried themselves like gangbangers between their Ebonics and ending every other sentence with"you know what I'm sayin'"... What an embarrassment on Pennsylvania.

    Mark Fiorino tried his best. Maybe more OC marches are needed in Philly. If I lived near by I would be doing so.

    Maybe if some people carried long arms in such a march, that would get these rogue cops past handguns in the open.

    The gangbanger had serious trouble looking up a license number. What would happen if someone was carrying on a New Hampshire non-resident license?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
    I want to thank Curmudgeon for posting the web sites as noted above and as indidivuals who actually do or who simply claim an interest in OC, if you haven't already, I strongly encourage you to go over to those web sites and down load the contents of all three. I say this as, in my opinion, as I understand and know OC to be, to protect your rights, it just won't get much better than what these three have to offer.

    As a firm advocate of the practice of law - as a pro se individual - the complaint as filed by legal counsel for Mr. Fiorino is a classic. Simple, straight forward. it appears to "hit the nail on the head." Assuming it is true, all of it ...and by law the judge(s) who will review the complaint is/are required to do just that, as presented the complaint is an excellent study of how to do it. Not only is the "city" and the "PPD" being sued as institutions but the action ALSO addresses the insanity of the individuals involved. It specifically seeks to hold each and everyone of the individuals involved accountable as well.

    States and lessor government do misbehave - and they do it often. Those engaged in OC are not the only victims of incompetence when it comes to law and law enforcement and If you're a victim take the time to review "the law page" at the beginning of these forms ("Practicing Pro Se"), along with a copy of the complaint as filed by Mr. Fiorino, you'll get an idea as to just how easy it is to compel government agents when "acting under color of law" to behave.

    Just my opinion anyway ...

    tyc


    "At the federal level, along with Massachusetts, from the views of law and law enforcement, Pennsylvania is the laughing stock of the Union." DHC
    Last edited by tyc; 11-22-2012 at 07:58 AM.

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    Wow! I just read the complaint filed on behalf of Fiorino and I am stunned!

    As a PA police officer myself (not anywhere near Philly), the actions of those officers and their department are truly an embarrassment to not only PA police officers, but to police officers anywhere!

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    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    Did I see the cop follow him into the barber shop and try to get him trespassed?
    Yes he did. The arrogance, the insolence and the stupidity is something which if you hear about something like that means far less I suspect than actually seeing and hearing it.

    As for for the "barbershop incident", I have briefly reviewed the complaint filed in the US 3rd Circuit and I don't recall seeing anything about defamation ...

    "Defamatory" communication is defined as communication that tends to harm the reputation of another so "as to lower him [or her] in the estimation of the community or to deter third persons from associating or dealing with him [or her]."

    Actual harm to reputation is not necessary for a statement to be defamatory, and the statement need not actually result in a third person's refusal to deal with the object of the statement; rather the words used must merely be likely to have such an effect.

    For this reason, if the person defamed already looks so bad in the eyes of the community that his or her reputation could not be made worse, or if the statements are made by someone who has no credibility, there will not be a strong case for defamation.

    "Community" does not refer to the entire community, but rather to a "substantial and respectable minority" of the community.

    Even more specifically, the community is not necessarily seen as the community at large, but rather as the "relevant" community.

    ... but as I understand it, should the court allow, the plaintiff has time to amend the complaint, adding a charge of defamation against one or more of the defendants.

    As I see it and have known it to be, PPD leadership is slow to learn but as repeat defendants in a federal forum, starting with Nutter, some of those people might actually begin to wise up before they themselves are personally bankrupted and/or jailed.

    tyc
    Last edited by tyc; 11-23-2012 at 05:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carracer View Post
    Did I see the cop follow him into the barber shop and try to get him trespassed?
    Bin ladin was going to attack philly but his scouts said the city was already a POS and attacking it? Nobody would notice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tyc View Post
    ... the complaint as filed by legal counsel for Mr. Fiorino is ... Simple, straight forward. it appears to "hit the nail on the head."
    ... It specifically seeks to hold each and everyone of the individuals involved accountable as well.

    States and lessor government do misbehave ... often. Those engaged in OC are not the only victims of incompetence when it comes to law and law enforcement and If you're a victim take the time to review "the law page" at the beginning of these forms ("Practicing Pro Se"), ... you'll get an idea as to just how easy it is to compel government agents when "acting under color of law" to behave.
    Has anyone heard how well or not at this point the litigation by Mr. Fiorino is going?

    tyc

  22. #22
    Regular Member Curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Re: Philadelphia oc video - negative encounter

    If you are referring to Mr. Fiorino's case, see post #7 in this thread.

    If you are referring to the incident in the original post of this thread, I will have to dig that out, but the video posted at the beginning here was not Fiorino, in case that needed clarifying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
    If you are referring to Mr. Fiorino's case, see post #7 in this thread.
    If you are referring to the incident in the original post of this thread, I will have to dig that out, but the video posted at the beginning here was not Fiorino, in case that needed clarifying.

    Yes, some clarifying is desired.

    I was under the impression that the video at the begining of this tread was one in which Mr. Fiorino was involved, which resulted in him filing an action in the US 3rd District. I have a copy of that filing.

    If it is the case that another individual was involved in the vido which started this thread, I have to ask, did that individual file an action against the LEO(s) involved?

    tyc

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    Regular Member Curmudgeon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tyc View Post
    Yes, some clarifying is desired.

    I was under the impression that the video at the begining of this tread was one in which Mr. Fiorino was involved, which resulted in him filing an action in the US 3rd District. I have a copy of that filing.

    If it is the case that another individual was involved in the vido which started this thread, I have to ask, did that individual file an action against the LEO(s) involved?

    tyc


    Short answer: yes.

    Perhaps some of the confusion is that he (Mr. Rodriguez) and Mr. Fiorino have since met, and Fiorino is helping him with this, as a citizen.

    Here is his post about what he is doing about it:

    So Viper (Fiorino) and I went to The PPD's IA office on Thursday 12-6-12. I filed my report and my statement of what happened. They gave me a copy for my records and said that I should hear from someone within 2 weeks. The officer who took my report asked if this was recently on the news. I guess they were already aware of the incident.
    And:

    So I missed a piece of certified mail from the PPD yesterday. I'll update y'all's on it's contents when I pick it up later...
    ~
    ...The letter was just stating that they received my IA complaint and it has been assigned a control number. It also stated that i would hear back from the IA division 10 business days from Dec 17th.
    ^And this brings the incident up to the current day.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
    Short answer: yes.
    Perhaps some of the confusion is that he (Mr. Rodriguez) and Mr. Fiorino have since met, and Fiorino is helping him with this, as a citizen.
    Thanks for the comeback ... but the type of "action" I'm talking about is a civil action in either the Commonwealth Court or the federal 3rd district. Filing a complaint with PPD IA has an excellent chance of being a waste of time for the plaintiff and odds are the LEO(s) and their superiors will learn little or nothing from the encounter.

    tyc

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