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Thread: CC In Meijers...wait..what?

  1. #1
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Exclamation CC In Meijers...wait..what?

    I stopped at Meijers to get some donuts (I know, Imma be a great cop) and I saw someone clearly concealing a gun..and not very well, it was pretty obvious. But..with the knowledge of CC/OC that I have (Which isn't a ton) That's VERY illegal isnt it? I was under the impression that with a CPL you can only OC in places that sold booze.

    Am I right, or am I an idiot?

    I wasn't sure if I should have said something to the guy.
    Molon Labe

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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    I stopped at Meijers to get some donuts (I know, Imma be a great cop) and I saw someone clearly concealing a gun..and not very well, it was pretty obvious. But..with the knowledge of CC/OC that I have (Which isn't a ton) That's VERY illegal isnt it? I was under the impression that with a CPL you can only OC in places that sold booze.

    Am I right, or am I an idiot?

    I wasn't sure if I should have said something to the guy.
    MCL 28.425o provides that a person with a valid
    CPL shall not carry a concealed pistol in a pistolfree zone. First offense is a state civil infraction.
    The following is a list of the premises (excluding
    parking lots) included in the statute:
     School or school property, except a parent or
    legal guardian who is dropping off or picking up a
    child and the pistol is kept in the vehicle
     Public or private day care center
     Sports arena or stadium
    A bar or tavern where sale and consumption of
    liquor by the glass is the primary source of
    income (does not apply to owner or employee of
    the business).
     Any property or facility owned or operated by a
    church, synagogue, mosque, temple, or other
    place of worship, unless authorized by the
    presiding official
     An entertainment facility that has a seating
    capacity of 2,500 or more
     A hospital
     A dormitory or classroom of a community college,
    college, or university
     A casino (R 432.1212, MCL 432.202)


    The actual law: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(fgt...cl-28-425o.pdf
    Last edited by DrTodd; 11-19-2012 at 06:10 PM.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  3. #3
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    <edit out moronic post here>
    Last edited by MikeTheGreek; 11-19-2012 at 06:16 PM.
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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Hah! I knew it. I've seen multiple people carry there in the past, I'm going to start warning people. Would hate to see some guy get arrested and charged for running to Meijers to get something for his kids.

    I hope you are kidding?? A CPL holder can conceal carry at Meijer... you saw that, right??
    Last edited by DrTodd; 11-19-2012 at 06:13 PM.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  5. #5
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    I hope you are kidding?? A CPL holder can conceal carry at Meijers... you saw that, right??
    Kidding about which part 0.o
    Molon Labe

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  6. #6
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    I hope you are kidding?? A CPL holder can conceal carry at Meijer... you saw that, right??
    Oh..haha. I misread your post. Nevermind. See...I don't know much about this stuff, so it's always better to ask
    Molon Labe

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    Regular Member MI_XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Hah! I knew it. I've seen multiple people carry there in the past, I'm going to start warning people. Would hate to see some guy get arrested and charged for running to Meijers to get something for his kids.
    Whoa, Mike! Slow down! Stop! Back up! Re-read the BOLDED part of the message above.

    It is talking about a Bar or Tavern that makes the majority of its income selling liquor by the glass.. To Be Consumed on the premises.
    Meijers does NOT allow you to Drink the stuff you buy there!! (Until you get it home , or at least to your car )
    Therefore, CCing at a Meijers WITH a CPL is perfectly legal! OCing there with a CPL is also legal.
    Last edited by MI_XD; 11-19-2012 at 06:21 PM.

  8. #8
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MI_XD View Post
    Whoa, Mike! Slow down! Stop! Back up! Re-read the BOLDED part of the message above.

    It is talking about a Bar or Tavern that makes the majority of its income selling liquor by the glass.. To Be Consumed on the premises.
    Meijers does NOT allow you to Drink the stuff you buy there!! (Until you get it home , or at least to your car )
    Therefore, CCing at a Meijers WITH a CPL is perfectly legal! OCing there with a CPL is also legal.
    I THINK he knows that now... whew!
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  9. #9
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MI_XD View Post
    Whoa, Mike! Slow down! Stop! Back up! Re-read the BOLDED part of the message above.

    It is talking about a Bar or Tavern that makes the majority of its income selling liquor by the glass.. To Be Consumed on the premises.
    Meijers does NOT allow you to Drink the stuff you buy there!! (Until you get it home , or at least to your car )
    Therefore, CCing at a Meijers WITH a CPL is perfectly legal! OCing there with a CPL is also legal.
    Haha, I just read that and corrected myself, I won't warn anyone, because they'll just look at me like I'm a nutcase 0.o
    Molon Labe

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  10. #10
    Anti-Saldana Freedom Fighter Venator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Kidding about which part 0.o
    Good god. A CPL holder can conceal in any place that sell alcohol (Store, Meijers, 7/11) as LONG AS IT IS NOT a bar or tavern. So stores are OK.
    An Amazon best seller "MY PARENTS OPEN CARRY" http://www.myparentsopencarry.com/

    *The information contained above is not meant to be legal advice, but is solely intended as a starting point for further research. These are my opinions, if you have further questions it is advisable to seek out an attorney that is well versed in firearm law.

  11. #11
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venator View Post
    Good god. A CPL holder can conceal in any place that sell alcohol (Store, Meijers, 7/11) as LONG AS IT IS NOT a bar or tavern. So stores are OK.
    I just corrected myself twice now haha. I know this.
    Molon Labe

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  12. #12
    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venator View Post
    Good god. A CPL holder can conceal in any place that sell alcohol (Store, Meijers, 7/11) as LONG AS IT IS NOT a bar or tavern. So stores are OK.
    Edit to add: A Bar or Tavern where sale and consumption of liquor by the glass is the primary source of income.
    Giving up our liberties for safety is the one sure way to let the violent among us win.

    "Though defensive violence will always be a 'sad necessity' in the eyes of men of principle, it would be still more unfortunate if wrongdoers should dominate just men." -Saint Augustine

    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

  13. #13
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Edit to add: A Bar or Tavern where sale and consumption of liquor by the glass is the primary source of income.
    I understand now. You can CC in places that sell alcohol, but bars you have to OC. But I also know that in bars, if they let you OC, you can not drink.

    I think I have this down now Jeeze...the law is complicated. Too much stuff to remember.
    Molon Labe

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    CC In Meijers...wait..what?

    Read MSP legal update 86. After you've read it, read it again. Read it three more times.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  15. #15
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    CC In Meijers...wait..what?

    Also don't confuse the text of MCL 750.234d (non-CPL OC) with the text of MCL 28.425o (places off limit for CC).
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  16. #16
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    CC In Meijers...wait..what?

    Go read every post in this thread and carefully review the referenced/attached material:

    http://www.forums.miopencarry.org/index.php?topic=25


    I'm very very serious about it, go read it. We've had at least one noteworthy person in the open carry community who has lost some rights because they didn't fully understand the law before they carried.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  17. #17
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    Go read every post in this thread and carefully review the referenced/attached material:

    http://www.forums.miopencarry.org/index.php?topic=25


    I'm very very serious about it, go read it. We've had at least one noteworthy person in the open carry community who has lost some rights because they didn't fully understand the law before they carried.
    Bookmarking it and reading it all night tonight. Thank you.

    Sorry, I don't want to seem like the dumb kid around here
    Molon Labe

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    CC In Meijers...wait..what?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Bookmarking it and reading it all night tonight. Thank you.

    Sorry, I don't want to seem like the dumb kid around here
    We're just trying to preserve your privileges. We'd hate to see you get a felony that prevents you from owning guns at all.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  19. #19
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    We're just trying to preserve your privileges. We'd hate to see you get a felony that prevents you from owning guns at all.
    I do really appreciate your help. I'm reading all of this information right now. Going to print it out and make sure I memorize as much as possible.
    Molon Labe

    [+=] Eleftheria i thanatos [+=]

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    Regular Member MI_XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Edit to add: A Bar or Tavern where sale and consumption of liquor by the glass is the primary source of income.
    Hey Doc.. It just hit me. Wouldn't the stating of "liquor by the glass" make it even harder for a bar or tavern to hit that "primary source" since it excludes beer and wine?? I would say the majority of drinks would be more apt to be in the beer or wine group as the primary source. What do you think? In your Oh So Humble (IANAL) opinion??

    liq·uor   /ˈlɪkər or, for 3, ˈlɪkwɔr/ Show Spelled[lik-er or, for 3, lik-wawr] Show IPA
    noun
    1. a distilled or spirituous beverage, as brandy or whiskey, as distinguished from a fermented beverage, as wine or beer.

    Just wondering.
    Last edited by MI_XD; 11-19-2012 at 07:12 PM.

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    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Red face

    MIKE, MIKE, MIKE...

    You need to take Michigander up on his offer to show you the ropes. He is one of the original OCers in SE MI.

    On top of that, he is part of the OC dynamic duo of: Michigander & (EvilCreamSicle is Robin).

    On top of being OC Super Hero's they are close to your age (no handle bar mustaches or leather vests ....[you little crud]...)
    Last edited by FreeInAZ; 11-19-2012 at 07:23 PM.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "You must be the change you wish to see in the world" by Mahatma Gandhi

    “Your beliefs become your thoughts. Your thoughts become your words. Your words become your actions. Your actions become your habits. Your habits become your values. Your values become your destiny.” by Mahatma Gandhi

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    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FreeInAZ View Post
    MIKE, MIKE, MIKE...

    You need to take Michigander up on his offer to show you the ropes. He is one of the original OCers in SE MI.

    On top of that, he is part of the OC dynamic duo of: Michigander & (EvilCreamSicle is Robin).

    On top of being OC Super Hero's they are close to your age (no handle bar mustaches or leather vests ....[you little crud]...)

    I'm going to message him next week when I return from my trip back to Canada to see if he wants to meet up and teach me a few things.

    Hey now...at least I didn't say anything about power chairs?
    Molon Labe

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  23. #23
    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Oh now you are going after my power chair....COME ON!

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "You must be the change you wish to see in the world" by Mahatma Gandhi

    “Your beliefs become your thoughts. Your thoughts become your words. Your words become your actions. Your actions become your habits. Your habits become your values. Your values become your destiny.” by Mahatma Gandhi

  24. #24
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MI_XD View Post
    Hey Doc.. It just hit me. Wouldn't the stating of "liquor by the glass" make it even harder for a bar or tavern to hit that "primary source" since it excludes beer and wine?? I would say the majority of drinks would be more apt to be in the beer or wine group as the primary source. What do you think? In your Oh So Humble (IANAL) opinion??

    liq·uor   /ˈlɪkər or, for 3, ˈlɪkwɔr/ Show Spelled[lik-er or, for 3, lik-wawr] Show IPA
    noun
    1. a distilled or spirituous beverage, as brandy or whiskey, as distinguished from a fermented beverage, as wine or beer.

    Just wondering.
    Try again.

    MCL 436.1105

    (3) "Alcoholic liquor" means any spirituous, vinous, malt, or fermented liquor, liquids and compounds, whether or not medicated, proprietary, patented, and by whatever name called, containing 1/2 of 1% or more of alcohol by volume which are fit for use for beverage purposes as defined and classified by the commission according to alcoholic content as belonging to 1 of the varieties defined in this chapter.
    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine

  25. #25
    Regular Member MI_XD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    Try again.

    MCL 436.1105



    Bronson
    Darn! I thought I had found something!
    Thanks, Bronson.

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