Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Please tell me this wasn't on of you..

  1. #1
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,066

    Please tell me this wasn't on of you..

    Man with CHL attemps to arrest security guard for carrying and then threatens police with open carry rally???

    What a hypocrite!

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2d4_1345740976

  2. #2
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    North Chesterfield VA
    Posts
    10,682
    OMFG.

    There are words to describe that person. They are found in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual, Vol. V.

    While he may be technically correct, he is also several kinds of wrong. There may not be meds for some of those conditions.

    I did not (could not force myself to) read to the end. Did he get the guard in front of a magistrate? If that happened was there anything else (like a court hearing) that came afterwards?

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  3. #3
    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    S. Kitsap, Washington state
    Posts
    3,763
    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    Man with CHL attemps to arrest security guard for carrying and then threatens police with open carry rally???

    What a hypocrite!

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2d4_1345740976
    Oops, Was I not supposed to do that? I thought he was police officer, my bad
    they love our milk and honey, but they preach about some other way of living, when they're running down my country man they're walkin' on the fightin side of me

    NRA Member

  4. #4
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,066
    I read the whole thing but did not watch the video. The cops removed the security guard from his presence and let the guard go. I don't know the law there (here in AZ I believe security guards must be licensed to carry on the job) but how can you talk about OC while trying to get a guy arrested for it. And he was angry the security guard that he was FILMING took his picture ...

  5. #5
    Regular Member Lord Sega's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Warrenton, Oregon
    Posts
    317
    He "handed custody" over to the responding LEO, the LEO let the security guard walk.

    Oregon does have "citizen's arrest":

    133.225
    Arrest by private person

    (1) A private person may arrest another person for any crime committed in the presence of the private person if the private person has probable cause to believe the arrested person committed the crime. A private person making such an arrest shall, without unnecessary delay, take the arrested person before a magistrate or deliver the arrested person to a peace officer.

    (2) In order to make the arrest a private person may use physical force as is justifiable under ORS 161.255 (Use of physical force by private person making citizens arrest). [1973 c.836 §74]


    HOWEVER, he did not have RAS let alone Probable Cause (required, see above), and the security guard did not have to show a CHL or prove anything to some guy on the street.
    Technically he was right that the security guard, to carry loaded in the city limits of Portland needs a CHL or must OC unloaded.
    He didn't appear to illegally detain the security guard (ie keep him from leaving by threat or force), I don't know why the guard voluntarily stayed in the encounter.

    The guard should have told him to pound sand and walked away, and if the guy tried to detain (again, no PC) he would be up on illegal detainment (kidnapping?) or assault if he held the guard by any force.

    Schrödinger's cat paradox: security guard; legal with CHL, illegal without CHL, doesn't have to show/prove CHL to guy on the street. Guy has no RAS/PC. Guy was wrong.
    "Guns are not the problem … crazy is the problem” ... “We cannot legislate our society to the craziest amongst us.” - Jon Stewart
    “I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend." - Tolkien

  6. #6
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,066
    Is this true by the way, is a CHL required to open carry in Portland?

    The Portland Public Order 14A.60.010 does not exempt citizens with a DPSST license, it makes no mention of a DPSST license at all, so it seems by the law, the only way a private citizen can open carry a loaded weapon in Portland Oregon is via a Concealed Handgun License
    NM, question answered above, thank you Lord Sega.

    If someone came up to me questioning my right to carry (cop or citizen), I'd be pretty P.O.'d
    Last edited by sharkey; 11-22-2012 at 02:49 AM.

  7. #7
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Medford, Oregon, United States
    Posts
    125
    You got to be kidding me. Agree, this person is an hypocrite and does not know about the 4th amendment or Article 1 Section 9 (Oregon Constitution).

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    earth's crust
    Posts
    17,838
    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Sega View Post
    He "handed custody" over to the responding LEO, the LEO let the security guard walk.

    Oregon does have "citizen's arrest":
    .
    Citizen's arrest is a common law right .. so unless their is a law banning it, then its legal. Good cite though, looks like OR wanted to limit the right instead of eliminating it...

  9. #9
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    earth's crust
    Posts
    17,838
    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    Man with CHL attemps to arrest security guard for carrying and then threatens police with open carry rally???

    What a hypocrite!

    http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2d4_1345740976
    Sounds like "If I cannot OC, then you can't" mentality .... why can cops carry in certain manners and not the public in the same manner in certain states?

  10. #10
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,066
    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Sounds like "If I cannot OC, then you can't" mentality .... why can cops carry in certain manners and not the public in the same manner in certain states?
    If he was detaining a cop for carrying illegally I'd support him, what he was doing was harassing an individual because he didn't like the fact that he yelled at a teenager for ******* on the sidewalk.

    The dual standards is fodder for another thread.

    I found it hilarious when I heard many cops would lose their right to carry for DV even though I think that law is unconstitutional.

  11. #11
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,066
    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Citizen's arrest is a common law right .. so unless their is a law banning it, then its legal. Good cite though, looks like OR wanted to limit the right instead of eliminating it...
    I can't speak to common law but in many states statutorily the offense must be felonious or disturbing to the peace. I don't know if carrying loaded in Oregon without a CPH is a misdemeanor or felony.

    Regardless the guy who did the citizen's arrest is an idiot. Threatening an open carry protest for someone else carrying a gun is beyond words.

    ETA: Since the man doing the citizen's arrest is not LE the 4th doesn't apply to him but he nor LE have the right to search and seize for a permit or to check if the gun is loaded. (I know Cali used to but that was illegal too)
    Last edited by sharkey; 11-22-2012 at 10:16 PM.

  12. #12
    Regular Member Lord Sega's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Warrenton, Oregon
    Posts
    317
    For Oregon: Oregon is an OC state, but the state preemption allows cities (Portland is one of them) to have city ordinance for unloaded OC, a CHL exempts having to unload.

    Sharkey, you are right that as a civilian 4A doesn't apply, but ORS 133.225 Arrest by private person requires Probable Cause to perform the "citizen's arrest". (see the ORS in my earlier post).

    EDIT, had to add this Citizen's arrest video LINK
    Last edited by Lord Sega; 11-23-2012 at 03:01 AM.
    "Guns are not the problem … crazy is the problem” ... “We cannot legislate our society to the craziest amongst us.” - Jon Stewart
    “I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend." - Tolkien

  13. #13
    Founder's Club Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Fairfax Co., VA
    Posts
    18,766
    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    SNIP Threatening an open carry protest for someone else carrying a gun is beyond words.
    +1 It kinda violates the premise that everybody has a right to self-defense, doesn't it.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  14. #14
    Regular Member david.ross's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA, USA
    Posts
    1,241
    This guy would appear to be an iraq war vet who is against the war

    http://ivaw-oregon.us/blog/7

    He's doing us all a disservice by his aggressive vocalizations during his confrontation with police.
    Gays are prominent members of firearm rights, we do more via the courts, don't like it? Leave.
    Religious bigots against same sex marriage are not different than white supremacists.
    I expel anti-gay people off my teams. Tolerance is key to team cohesion and team building.

  15. #15
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    North Chesterfield VA
    Posts
    10,682
    Quote Originally Posted by david.ross View Post
    This guy would appear to be an iraq war vet who is against the war

    http://ivaw-oregon.us/blog/7

    He's doing us all a disservice by his aggressive vocalizations during his confrontation with police.
    Could you provide a more specific link?

    Thanks.

    stay safe.
    Last edited by skidmark; 11-24-2012 at 07:12 AM. Reason: typo
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  16. #16
    Regular Member david.ross's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA, USA
    Posts
    1,241
    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Could you provide a more specific link?

    Thanks.

    stay safe.
    The link is to his blog, the site has multiple blogs, his is blog ID 7
    Gays are prominent members of firearm rights, we do more via the courts, don't like it? Leave.
    Religious bigots against same sex marriage are not different than white supremacists.
    I expel anti-gay people off my teams. Tolerance is key to team cohesion and team building.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •