Results 1 to 23 of 23

Thread: ammo

  1. #1
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wild Wild West Michigan
    Posts
    1,188

    ammo

    With a CPL while carrying in Michigan are there laws regarding the transport of ammo? Someone I know was told in a cpl class that the ammo has to be locked away. Is this true?
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  2. #2
    Regular Member Xanaseyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Jackson, MI
    Posts
    37
    As long as it's not in a non-pistol in a vehicle, you can do pretty much whatever you like with your ammunition.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wild Wild West Michigan
    Posts
    1,188
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanaseyr View Post
    As long as it's not in a non-pistol in a vehicle, you can do pretty much whatever you like with your ammunition.
    sorry, non-pistol? you mean like an ammo case?
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  4. #4
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portage, MI
    Posts
    1,490
    No, no law regarding where the ammo is as long as it's not in the gun. If you have a CPL obviously you can have it loaded in a handgun but long guns must be unloaded.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  5. #5
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wild Wild West Michigan
    Posts
    1,188
    Quote Originally Posted by xmanhockey7 View Post
    No, no law regarding where the ammo is as long as it's not in the gun. If you have a CPL obviously you can have it loaded in a handgun but long guns must be unloaded.
    and if there is no gun in the vehicle then the ammo can also be anywhere no matter who is driving the vehicle right?
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  6. #6
    Regular Member xmanhockey7's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portage, MI
    Posts
    1,490
    Quote Originally Posted by Raggs View Post
    and if there is no gun in the vehicle then the ammo can also be anywhere no matter who is driving the vehicle right?
    As far as I know yes. IANAL.
    "No state shall convert a liberty to a privilege, license it, and charge a fee therefor.- Murdock vs Pennsylvania 319 US 105

    ...If the state converts a right into a privelege, the citizen can ignore the license and fee and engage in the right... with impunity.
    - Shuttleworth vs City of Birmingham, Alabama 317 US 262

    Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no legislation which would abrogate them.
    - Miranda vs Arizona 384 US 436

  7. #7
    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Mulligan's Valley
    Posts
    4,830
    If you go back a few decades, before preemption, some localities used to have moronic laws about ammunition transport and carry. Old timers can sometimes end up getting confused over this.

    But not any more. Either the law requires it to be out of the gun or it doesn't. And even in those circumstances where it can't be in the gun, store it anywhere else you want.

    There may be certain exceptions to this you'll run into, like federally controlled areas, but in general, do what you want with loose ammo, and by that I mean any ammo which isn't loaded into a gun, whether it be in speed loaders or magazines or just loose. Do what you want.
    Answer every question about open carry in Michigan you ever had with one convenient and free book- http://libertyisforeveryone.com/open-carry-resources/

    The complete and utter truth can be challenged from every direction and it will always hold up. Accordingly there are few greater displays of illegitimacy than to attempt to impede free thought and communication.

  8. #8
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Lansing, Michigan
    Posts
    3,448

    ammo

    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    If you go back a few decades, before preemption, some localities used to have moronic laws about ammunition transport and carry. Old timers can sometimes end up getting confused over this.

    But not any more. Either the law requires it to be out of the gun or it doesn't. And even in those circumstances where it can't be in the gun, store it anywhere else you want.

    There may be certain exceptions to this you'll run into, like federally controlled areas, but in general, do what you want with loose ammo, and by that I mean any ammo which isn't loaded into a gun, whether it be in speed loaders or magazines or just loose. Do what you want.
    CPL holder drinking needs to have filled magazine stored apart from gun.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  9. #9
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Battle Creek, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    2,157
    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    CPL holder drinking needs to have filled magazine stored apart from gun.
    I know what you meant but you know that somebody is going to come along, read what you wrote and ask: "so I can have ammo in with the gun as long as it's not in the magazine?"

    In the case of a CPL holder with some level of BAC all ammo for the properly stored gun must be separated from the gun whether it's loose, in a magazine or speedloader, or brand new in the box.

    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(2rk...me=mcl-28-425k

    (3) This section does not prohibit an individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol who has any bodily alcohol content from doing any of the following:

    (a) Transporting that pistol in the locked trunk of his or her motor vehicle or another motor vehicle in which he or she is a passenger or, if the vehicle does not have a trunk, from transporting that pistol unloaded in a locked compartment or container that is separated from the ammunition for that pistol.

    (b) Transporting that pistol on a vessel if the pistol is transported unloaded in a locked compartment or container that is separated from the ammunition for that pistol.
    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine

  10. #10
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Burton, Michigan
    Posts
    3,361
    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    I know what you meant but you know that somebody is going to come along, read what you wrote and ask: "so I can have ammo in with the gun as long as it's not in the magazine?"

    In the case of a CPL holder with some level of BAC all ammo for the properly stored gun must be separated from the gun whether it's loose, in a magazine or speedloader, or brand new in the box.

    http://www.legislature.mi.gov/(S(2rk...me=mcl-28-425k



    Bronson
    Only if the vehicle you're in (yours or someome elses, as a driver or passenger) does not have a trunk or if you're on a boat.

    (3) This section does not prohibit an individual licensed under this act to carry a concealed pistol who has any bodily alcohol content from doing any of the following:

    (a) Transporting that pistol in the locked trunk of his or her motor vehicle or another motor vehicle in which he or she is a passenger or, if the vehicle does not have a trunk, from transporting that pistol unloaded in a locked compartment or container that is separated from the ammunition for that pistol.

    (b) Transporting that pistol on a vessel if the pistol is transported unloaded in a locked compartment or container that is separated from the ammunition for that pistol.

  11. #11
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Battle Creek, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    2,157
    Quote Originally Posted by SpringerXDacp View Post
    Only if the vehicle you're in (yours or someome elses, as a driver or passenger) does not have a trunk or if you're on a boat.

    True. So if you are a CPL holder that is inclined to drink and have a vehicle, or routinely ride in someone else's vehicle, that doesn't have a trunk you better make sure to bring along a locking gun case everywhere you go

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine

  12. #12
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Mason, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    1,954
    Quote Originally Posted by Bronson View Post
    True. So if you are a CPL holder that is inclined to drink and have a vehicle, or routinely ride in someone else's vehicle, that doesn't have a trunk you better make sure to bring along a locking gun case everywhere you go

    Bronson
    Or, you could do like I did, and just quit drinking outside of your home. Solved a lot of my problems, and saves me a ton of money.
    Big Gay Al
    Coordinator, Michigan Pink Pistols
    Big Gay Al's Big Gay (Gun) Blog
    Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal FNX-45 .45ACP 16 rounds of hurt.

  13. #13
    Regular Member Vmaxx's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Rochester Hills, Michigan, USA
    Posts
    85
    Quote Originally Posted by Big Gay Al View Post
    Or, you could do like I did, and just quit drinking outside of your home. Solved a lot of my problems, and saves me a ton of money.
    This is the option I choose, it works the best there's never a question should I or not. Fool proof every time!!

  14. #14
    Regular Member Xanaseyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Jackson, MI
    Posts
    37
    Quote Originally Posted by Raggs View Post
    sorry, non-pistol? you mean like an ammo case?
    Sorry, a non-pistol firearm. Transport of loaded rifles, shotguns, and other firearms which are not pistols ist verboten.
    Loaded pistols, with a CPL, are generally okay, and any ammunition not in a firearm can be transported however you like. (ammo case, lockbox, tool box, grocery bag, loose in the cupholder, magazines hanging from the rear-view)

  15. #15
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Burton, Michigan
    Posts
    3,361
    Quote Originally Posted by Xanaseyr View Post
    Sorry, a non-pistol firearm. Transport of loaded rifles, shotguns, and other firearms which are not pistols ist verboten.
    Loaded pistols, with a CPL, are generally okay, and any ammunition not in a firearm can be transported however you like. (ammo case, lockbox, tool box, grocery bag, loose in the cupholder, magazines hanging from the rear-view)
    No LOL, actually that (Blue) would be illegal per Michigan Vehicle Code.

  16. #16
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Northville, Michigan
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by SpringerXDacp View Post
    No LOL, actually that (Blue) would be illegal per Michigan Vehicle Code.
    True, although almost every car I get in my shop has something hanging from the rear view mirror, so I don't really think that law is enforced very well.

  17. #17
    Regular Member Xanaseyr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Jackson, MI
    Posts
    37
    Quote Originally Posted by SpringerXDacp View Post
    No LOL, actually that (Blue) would be illegal per Michigan Vehicle Code.
    MCL 257.709?
    (1) A person shall not operate a motor vehicle with any of the following:
    ...
    (c) An object that obstructs the vision of the driver of the vehicle, except as authorized by law.
    ...
    (3) This section does not apply to any of the following:
    ...
    (d) A vehicle registered in another state, territory, commonwealth of the United States, or another country or province.
    You'll want to hang them in such a way that they don't obstruct the driver's vision, but that's just common sense.
    Last edited by Xanaseyr; 11-26-2012 at 04:52 PM.

  18. #18
    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Grand Rapids
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    True, although almost every car I get in my shop has something hanging from the rear view mirror, so I don't really think that law is enforced very well.
    Its just one of those laws that gives LEOs 'bait' for a fishing expedition.
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

  19. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    Burton, Michigan
    Posts
    3,361
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Bear View Post
    Its just one of those laws that gives LEOs 'bait' for a fishing expedition.
    Yes this. Hanging an object, of any size, from the rear view mirror is a primary offense in Michigan, just like our seat belt laws.


    http://www.autoevolution.com/news/re...igan-6481.html

    .
    .
    .
    .
    Still, Michigan’s law was questioned whether or not was too ambiguous.They finally reached to the conclusion that “The law’s language is unqualified: an obstruction of any size for any amount of time falls within it,” as the court wrote in an opinion released April 30.

    Michigan State Police supported the law, saying it’s been clear for years that dangling objects (such as graduation tassels, dice, garter belts, jewelry and more), while driving can block a driver's view and are therefore illegal. The offense is a civil infraction with a fine of $100 or more.

  20. #20
    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Grand Rapids
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by SpringerXDacp View Post
    Yes this. Hanging an object, of any size, from the rear view mirror is a primary offense in Michigan, just like our seat belt laws.


    http://www.autoevolution.com/news/re...igan-6481.html
    I always get a chuckle over the wanna be gangstas that do stuff like that, with the purple headlights, tinted windows, loud stereos, etc just begging to be stopped. Seems like if you were a REAL gangsta, you'd want to keep a lower profile....
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

  21. #21
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Okemos, MI
    Posts
    884
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Bear View Post
    Seems like if you were a REAL gangsta, you'd want to keep a lower profile....
    This.

    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  22. #22
    Regular Member HKcarrier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    michigan
    Posts
    831
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Bear View Post
    I always get a chuckle over the wanna be gangstas that do stuff like that, with the purple headlights, tinted windows, loud stereos, etc just begging to be stopped. Seems like if you were a REAL gangsta, you'd want to keep a lower profile....


    Here's my gangsta ride....


    Last edited by HKcarrier; 11-28-2012 at 03:54 PM.
    When you put the gun in the holster, put the ego in the gun safe.

  23. #23
    Michigan Moderator Shadow Bear's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Grand Rapids
    Posts
    1,018
    Quote Originally Posted by HKcarrier View Post
    Here's my gangsta ride....


    Sweet- I had one of these back in the day-

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	72 olds.jpg 
Views:	50 
Size:	9.8 KB 
ID:	9615

    Mine didn't have downriggers, though....
    'If the people are not ready for the exercise of the non-violence of the brave, they must be ready for the use of force in self defense. There should be no camouflage.....it must never be secret.' MK Gandhi II-146 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)-- Gandhi supports open carry!

    'There is nothing more demoralizing than the fake non-violence of the weak and impotent.' MK Gandhi II-153 (Gandhi on Non-Violence)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •