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Thread: Man arrested in Lexington library..

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    Regular Member self preservation's Avatar
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    Man arrested in Lexington library..

    As always the story is very short and I'm sure they have left out a lot of details. Sounds to me like this may be a 65.870 issue.. By the way, check out what they charged him with... If he concealed his gun without a CCDW then I could see charging him with that. But not what they charged him with. After we learn the whole story it might be time for an OC meetup at this library...


    http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/M...180772281.html
    Last edited by self preservation; 11-26-2012 at 08:45 AM.
    “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Edmund Burke

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    Re: Man arrested in Lexington library..

    Assuming the part about it laying on the table was true, why would he do that? Idiot!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tattedupboy View Post
    Assuming the part about it laying on the table was true, why would he do that? Idiot!
    yeah, if that part is true. he should go to jail

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    Regular Member self preservation's Avatar
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    Yeah, if it was lying on the table it would make no sense to me. Now if it was holstered it would be a different story. But once again the media always does a piss poor job reporting the facts of these cases. I would like to know the facts. Not the LEO's "facts" or even the guys "facts" for that matter...but the true facts.(I know that's almost like a unicorn)
    “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Edmund Burke

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    Regular Member 09jisaac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tattedupboy View Post
    Assuming the part about it laying on the table was true, why would he do that? Idiot!
    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis C View Post
    yeah, if that part is true. he should go to jail
    You all are way to fast to turn on each other. As long as he was in control of the firearm and it was "stored" (Backpack, holster, purse, etc.) then what does it matter? He wasn't waving the thing around.

    What would be the difference between him laying the firearm on the table and a woman laying the firearm on the table in a purse. Very little in actuality, but purse carry is generally accepted.

    This is half the reason we have to fight for self defense rights anymore. Everyone, most in OUR group here, are too fast to call something stupid illegal.
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    Re: Man arrested in Lexington library..

    Quote Originally Posted by 09jisaac View Post
    You all are way to fast to turn on each other. As long as he was in control of the firearm and it was "stored" (Backpack, holster, purse, etc.) then what does it matter? He wasn't waving the thing around.

    What would be the difference between him laying the firearm on the table and a woman laying the firearm on the table in a purse. Very little in actuality, but purse carry is generally accepted.

    This is half the reason we have to fight for self defense rights anymore. Everyone, most in OUR group here, are too fast to call something stupid illegal.
    Yup... Something that's wrong isn't necesarily illegal, and just because it's illegal doesn't mean it's wrong.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    We espose not handling guns in public, so as to not give any false impressions. Don't know how one places a gun on the table w/o handling it. In some states this might well constitute brandishing. Would I take it as threatening? - quite possibly.

    Further it is alledged - "then tried to conceal it from officers" - more handling.

    When I go into a library or anywhere else, my handgun stays holstered except in the gravest extreme..........period.

    I get a similar image of a SA revolver laying on a poker table
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    i'm not fast to turn anything. if the dude had it out on the table out in the open off of his person. in a holster or not. you do not have control of that firearm. that is the kind of stupidity that can get someone hurt.

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    Re: Man arrested in Lexington library..

    If you are outside your home or vehicle, your firearm should ALWAYS be holstered on or about your person, point blank period! There is no reason it should be laying on a table if it isn't being used.

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    Regular Member self preservation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    We espose not handling guns in public, so as to not give any false impressions. Don't know how one places a gun on the table w/o handling it. In some states this might well constitute brandishing. Would I take it as threatening? - quite possibly.

    Further it is alledged - "then tried to conceal it from officers" - more handling.

    When I go into a library or anywhere else, my handgun stays holstered except in the gravest extreme..........period.

    I get a similar image of a SA revolver laying on a poker table
    I read it as the officers saw the gun on the table, the guy saw the officers and tried to conceal it. But wouldn't one think that if LEO saw a man grap a gun when they walked in that a shooting would not have happened? As I said, I wish we knew the real story because there is just to much missing information.
    “The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.” Edmund Burke

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    Regular Member CharleyCherokee's Avatar
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    I'm sure they had a mini conference to figure out what they could possibly charge him with. Honestly after reading the statute I don't see how terroristic threatening is going to stick. Well from the information provided anyway.
    Last edited by CharleyCherokee; 11-26-2012 at 05:37 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tattedupboy View Post
    Assuming the part about it laying on the table was true, why would he do that? Idiot!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis C View Post
    yeah, if that part is true. he should go to jail
    I see no law explicitly broken by setting your gun on a table. It may not be wise or recommended to do so, but that doesn't make it illegal.

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    While I wouldn't recommend it, in Kentucky citizens may choose to openly carry any firearm they wish. If I feel like a shotgun is what I need to carry today, then I can pack it all day long, including a trip to the library if I choose. Would I be subject to arrest if I set the shotgun down? I don't think that would be reasonable. I can set a firearm within my personal space somewhere off my body but still have control of the firearm. I can't find any info on the exact charged this guy is facing. If he attempted to conceal the firearm, and didn't possess a license then he was in the wrong. But just for setting it on the table, I have to say that is a no go.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garyh9900 View Post
    While I wouldn't recommend it, in Kentucky citizens may choose to openly carry any firearm they wish. If I feel like a shotgun is what I need to carry today, then I can pack it all day long, including a trip to the library if I choose. Would I be subject to arrest if I set the shotgun down? I don't think that would be reasonable. I can set a firearm within my personal space somewhere off my body but still have control of the firearm. I can't find any info on the exact charged this guy is facing. If he attempted to conceal the firearm, and didn't possess a license then he was in the wrong. But just for setting it on the table, I have to say that is a no go.
    Don't know the laws of Kentuky well enough to respond, but the problem I see is that this incident virtually begs your lawmakers to address the issue.

    Also see muzzle control as problematic when a gun is placed on a table.
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    Regular Member CharleyCherokee's Avatar
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    This is just speculation on my part, but here is what I think most likely happened. Individual was in the library well away from others at a table to himself. Police officers entered building and the individual seeing them come in took the firearm off the table to holster it.

    Terroristic Threatening 3rd: http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/508-00/080.PDF

    2nd: http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/508-00/078.PDF

    1st: http://www.lrc.ky.gov/KRS/508-00/075.PDF
    Last edited by CharleyCherokee; 11-26-2012 at 07:48 PM. Reason: Added statute citations.
    A bullet may have your name on it, but shrapnel is addressed to whom it may concern.
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    Re: Man arrested in Lexington library..

    The only time I could possibly imagine justifying the unholstering of one's weapon in a non self defense situation out in public is in the stall of a public restroom.

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    so what i am gathering from what is being said, you would go into a public place, restaurant, library what have ya, sit down think gee i think instead of keeping my firearm in my holster i'll just pull it out and sit it on the table for every one to see and enjoy. really?

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    Regular Member Lord Sega's Avatar
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    I read KRS 508.075, 508.078, and 508.080 Terroristic Threatening (1st, 2nd, and 3rd degree) and none of them even closely apply.
    Having the weapon out of the holster and/or attempting to conceal it (if he doesn't have a CCDW) could bring different charges, but Terroristic Threatening is bogus.
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    i was thinking along the lines of some degree of endangerment. if not jail time he needs his guns taken away for such ignorance.

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    Man arrested in Lexington library..

    Y'all are thinking the gun on the table was UNHOLSTERED. No info given in the linked article. Moving a holstered firearm from the table to elsewhere when police arrive may not be wise or illegal. But this scenario might be more supportive of NOT getting shot in the library by the police.

    Just thinking out loud at the keyboard.


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    The article says that he was initially approached and asked to turn his music down.

    I wonder if, on being asked, he said he was going to "shoot the place up" or made some other sort of threat along those lines. That, IMO, might justify a charge of terroristic threatening.

    The information at this point is so sparse that I'm going to withhold judgement until more comes out. I agree that having the weapon on the table does not justify the charges he received. As others are saying, I'm guessing that there's a lot more to the story. If not, the arresting officer has a whole lot of explaining to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis C View Post
    i was thinking along the lines of some degree of endangerment. if not jail time he needs his guns taken away for such ignorance.
    ASBOLUTELY NOT! You honestly believe we should deprive someone of their rights for such a minor infraction? Perhaps you could get arrested one day for something that you believe is ok but an officer may not. Should you have your firearms taken away because of something you thought was ok, but an officer determined in his own mind wasn't? We should not speak of such foolishness, and we certainly should not suggest taking someone's firearms for an action that was NOT illegal. Perhaps the firerarm was still in a holster while laying on the table; what would the problem be with this?

    I personally would never take my firearm from my side unless I was using the rest-room, but I will NOT burn someone at the stake because they made a MISTAKE in judgement!
    "I never in my life seen a Kentuckian without a gun..."-Andrew Jackson

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    Quote Originally Posted by KYGlockster View Post
    ASBOLUTELY NOT! You honestly believe we should deprive someone of their rights for such a minor infraction? Perhaps you could get arrested one day for something that you believe is ok but an officer may not. Should you have your firearms taken away because of something you thought was ok, but an officer determined in his own mind wasn't? We should not speak of such foolishness, and we certainly should not suggest taking someone's firearms for an action that was NOT illegal. Perhaps the firerarm was still in a holster while laying on the table; what would the problem be with this?

    I personally would never take my firearm from my side unless I was using the rest-room, but I will NOT burn someone at the stake because they made a MISTAKE in judgement!
    when ignorance of that level can take ones life, dam skippy i think so. its not something you take out in public cause its an inconvenience on your side when sitting down. your being reckless with that kind of behavior. its not a cell phone or a freaking toy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis C View Post
    when ignorance of that level can take ones life, dam skippy i think so. its not something you take out in public cause its an inconvenience on your side when sitting down. your being reckless with that kind of behavior. its not a cell phone or a freaking toy.
    Since when did sitting a firearm on a table become reckless?

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    Quote Originally Posted by garyh9900 View Post
    Since when did sitting a firearm on a table become reckless?
    I was wondering that myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Curtis C View Post
    when ignorance of that level can take ones life, dam skippy i think so. its not a cell phone or a freaking toy.
    Go ahead and explain this. I did not know that there was a recall on firearms that set on tables. I set my firearm on tables (or table like) surfaces every day. I have never had a ND. I am still alive.
    No man alive can beat me in a fair fight: It's not fair to chase a man down and beat him.

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