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Thread: Prosecutors rule deadly shooting self defense

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Prosecutors rule deadly shooting self defense

    http://www.cbs58.com/news/local-news...180937921.html

    So no one needs to defend themselves in a barber shop/hair salon right? I'm sure the owner was real happy to have a customer there who was carrying.

    A spokesperson for the police department said by law they can't disclose whether he had a concealed carry permit.
    Don't you think if this person didn't have a conceal carry LICENSE that the police would have disclosed that?

    A family member told CBS 58 his gun is registered.
    We need a facepalm emoticon. WI has never had any firearm registration. Very few states do register firearms.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    I almost confused this story with another barber shop incident where the boss shot an employee because the employee had a pair of scissors in his hand and looked menacing, so the boss shot him.

    This one appears to be justified ... sad to have to shoot a kid but that's the way it goes.

  3. #3
    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I almost confused this story with another barber shop incident where the boss shot an employee because the employee had a pair of scissors in his hand and looked menacing, so the boss shot him.

    This one appears to be justified ... sad to have to shoot a kid but that's the way it goes.
    18 is hardly a kid. Heck, even if a 10 year old was threatening your and has the means do to it, would you not want to defend your life? Criminals make their own choices in life and need to be responsible for them.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    ...Heck, even if a 10 year old was threatening your and has the means do to it, would you not want to defend your life? Criminals make their own choices in life and need to be responsible for them.
    You very sadly end the threat of the 10-year old, and then charge the parent with his crime.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    You very sadly end the threat of the 10-year old, and then charge the parent with his crime.
    Of the two criminals, the one who lived is being charged with murder.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Of the two criminals, the one who lived is being charged with murder.
    As he should be.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth
    sad to have to shoot a kid but that's the way it goes.
    I agree with Joseph - 18 isn't a kid.
    And the one who survived is 21, also not a kid.
    And they were both armed with pistols.

    Quote Originally Posted by article
    Police are no longer calling a shooting at a barber shop and hair salon last week a homicide
    What the bleep are they calling it?
    When someone is killed, it's a homicide. Whether or not it's justified, it's still a homicide.
    Wonder how long it'll take the citizen to get his self-defense tool(s) back.
    Will they make him wait until the murder trial of the accomplice is over?
    And will he have to go to court to get a judge to tell MPD to return his property?

    The salon's owner... said security will be stepped up.
    “I'm going to have a surveillance system put around the whole building I'm thinking about hiring a part time security guard maybe 3 hours a day"
    Seems like she has adequate security already - the door was locked & the customer was armed.
    At least she didn't say anything stupid like she was considering posting...

    Ferguson’s relatives said he was good and never got into any trouble.
    They said he was in the shop that day to get his hair cut.
    Riiiiight... He was such a good kid then one day just out of the blue he & his friend decided it would be a good idea to get guns & rob a shop for some cash. If he wanted to get his hair cut, he shouldn't have been pointing a gun at anyone.
    (And what is a barbership doing open for business that time of night?? That's odd.)
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    The simpleton goes blindly on and suffers the consequences.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    What the bleep are they calling it?
    When someone is killed, it's a homicide. Whether or not it's justified, it's still a homicide.
    Well, it is the MKE police, so I wouldn't put it past them to call it jaywalking.

    I agree - justifiable homicide (ie self defense) is still homicide.
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris Badenov View Post
    Why bash the Milwaukee Police Dept? They are stating the official position of the city DA as the header of the article clearly reads.
    True. I'm just referring to the recent/current brewing story of crime misreporting in MKE....violent crimes being under-reported and such.
    - What da hay?

    Keep Calm and Carry On

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    Regular Member Plankton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boris Badenov View Post
    Why bash the Milwaukee Police Dept? They are stating the official position of the city DA as the header of the article clearly reads.
    Why do you care? Are you married to Chief Flynn? Or just one of his mistresses?
    Liberty or death. We're sorry, there are no other options available at this time..........
    "Safety is the new Liberty, and recklessness is the new Freedom, and alcoholism is the new Doug Huffman."

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    I did a quick search and could not find an article which details what happened leading up to the shooting. Are there any?

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    Regular Member NoTolerance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    I did a quick search and could not find an article which details what happened leading up to the shooting. Are there any?
    Copy of the criminal complaint:
    Count 1: FELONY MURDER

    The above-named defendant on or about Wednesday, November 21, 2012, at 2541 N. Martin Luther King Drive, in the City of Milwaukee, Milwaukee County, Wisconsin, did cause the death of Clemon G Ferguson, while attempting to commit armed robbery party to a crime (943.32(2), 939.32 and 939.05), contrary to sec. 940.03 Wis. Stats.

    Upon conviction for this offense, an unclassified Felony, the defendant may be imprisoned for not more than 35 years.

    Complainant is a City of Milwaukee police detective and bases this complaint upon the reports and investigation of fellow City of Milwaukee police officers and police detectives along with the findings of the Milwaukee County Medical Examiner’s Office, whose reports and investigation state the following:

    On November 21, 2012, Police Officer Eric Kradecki came in contact with the defendant, Jeremy Pierce, who came into District 5 City of Milwaukee police station and stated that he was in the area of North Avenue and Martin Luther King Drive walking on the sidewalk going to a barbershop when a black male came up from behind and tried to rob him and then heard a gunshot and realized he had been shot. At that time the defendant stated that he ran to the District 5 police station and reported this incident.

    Detective Mark Peterson spoke with citizen witness Gregory Farmer who stated that on November 21, 2012, while at a barbershop located at 2451 N. Martin Luther King Drive in the City and County of Milwaukee, that he was waiting in the barbershop to get a haircut. Mr. Farmer stated that while waiting to get a haircut that he heard someone knocking at the locked door to the barbershop and that he got up out of his chair and opened the door for who he described as suspect 1 entering into the barbershop and shortly behind him he saw a second suspect enter with a gun in his hand. Mr. Farmer stated at this time he then observed that suspect one was pointing a gun at him and that he, at that time, used his left arm to knock the gun away from being pointed at him and at that time a shot was discharged and that he at that time pulled a gun from a holster and began firing the gun that he had in his possession. Mr. Farmer stated that he began shooting toward suspect one and that while doing so he was moving backwards and at one point he fell over a barber chair and fell to the floor but continued to shoot his gun. Farmer stated that he observed suspect one fall to the ground within the barbershop and that he and the other barbers and patrons ran out the back door and that he then called 911 and reported what had happened.

    Detective Rodolfo Gomez, on November 22, 2012, spoke with the defendant Jeremy Pierce while he was in custody at Froedtert Hospital being treated for the gunshot wound that he had suffered. Detective Gomez asked the defendant how it was that he came to get shot and at first the defendant stated that he was at the barbershop located on Martin Luther King Drive when he states that a person in the barbershop pulled out a black handgun, he heard gunshots and that he fled out of the barbershop and he must have been shot during this gunfire.

    As the interview progressed the defendant eventually admitted that he had entered the barbershop along with a person he identified as Clemon Ferguson and that the plan on entering into the barbershop was to commit a robbery. The defendant stated that it was both he and Mr. Ferguson’s idea to rob the place because they needed some quick money. The defendant stated that he knew the owner of the barbershop, a person that he identified as “JT” who is a drug dealer and has money. The defendant admitted that at the time of the entry into the barbershop that he was armed with a .40 caliber handgun and that Mr. Ferguson also had a gun. The defendant stated that they went to the barbershop together and that he waited at the door while Mr. Ferguson knocked on the door. The defendant stated that once the door was unlocked that the two entered into the barbershop and that after the shooting occurred that he ran out of the barbershop and threw the gun that he had in an alley near his house.

    The body of Clemon Ferguson was located on the floor of the barbershop and he was pronounced deceased. Mr. Ferguson was later transported to the Milwaukee County Medical Examiner’s Office where an autopsy was performed by Dr. Agnieszka Rogalska, a medical doctor licensed to practice medicine in the State of Wisconsin with specialized training in the area of forensic pathology. Upon performing the autopsy on Clemon Ferguson, Dr. Rogalska determined to a reasonable degree of medical certainty that Mr. Ferguson died as a result of gunshot wounds to the head and neck.

    ****End of Complaint****

    Subscribed and sworn to before me and approved for filing this 26th day of November, 2012


    Kevin R. Shomin Complaining Witness
    Assistant District Attorney
    1010663

  13. #13
    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Perfect, thanks.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plankton
    Why do you care? Are you married to Chief Flynn? Or just one of his mistresses?
    No, it's the latest incarnation of the troll.
    It'll get banned like the rest of them soon.

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