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Thread: HYPOTHETICAL SB-59 dies, new bill offered

  1. #1
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    HYPOTHETICAL SB-59 dies, new bill offered

    hypothetical...

    SB-59 is dead. New bill offered, what say you.

    NO CPL needed to OC in bars/restaurants/Meijer(any liquor licensed place), theaters, Churches/synagogues and NO CPL needed to carry in a vehicle..

    BUT!!!

    OC is illegal in schools, daycares, hospitals and stadiums.

    DO YOU SUPPORT THIS BILL??

  2. #2
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    HYPOTHETICAL SB-59 dies, new bill offered

    Get the popcorn...
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
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    I think I would agree to this. you should be able to carry in the bolded areas. And it doesn't create another level of privileged people. and as has been argued many times the open carry with a cpl is a grey area for schools, daycares, hospitals and stadium.

    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    hypothetical...

    SB-59 is dead. New bill offered, what say you.

    NO CPL needed to OC in bars/restaurants/Meijer(any liquor licensed place), theaters, Churches/synagogues and NO CPL needed to carry in a vehicle..

    BUT!!!

    OC is illegal in schools, daycares, hospitals and stadiums.

    DO YOU SUPPORT THIS BILL??
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  4. #4
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    HYPOTHETICAL SB-59 dies, new bill offered

    ...
    Last edited by TheQ; 12-03-2012 at 05:05 PM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  5. #5
    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post

    OC is illegal in schools, daycares, hospitals and stadiums.
    illegal even with a CPL?
    If guns cause crime, all mine are defective- Ted Nugent

  6. #6
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    ...
    you yourself claims that those aren't "rights" those are grey areas that may be legal but there is no case law to prove it.
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  7. #7
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Heck no I don't support your bill! Any new bill should eliminate all PFZs and require all citizens to own firearms and open carry daily. A Kennesaw, Georgia gun bill on steroids, if you will. Anything less will be a compromise!
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by detroit_fan View Post
    illegal even with a CPL?
    Illegal no matter what.

  9. #9
    Regular Member detroit_fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    Illegal no matter what.
    then my vote is a solid no
    If guns cause crime, all mine are defective- Ted Nugent

  10. #10
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by griffin View Post
    Heck no I don't support your bill! Any new bill should eliminate all PFZs and require all citizens to own firearms and open carry daily. A Kennesaw, Georgia gun bill on steroids, if you will. Anything less will be a compromise!
    First part about eliminating PFZ's, YES. I believe that's a very reasonable goal to set. The second part about requiring to own and carry...haha, that would make the world a better place, but I can't see that EVER happening, especially in Michigan.

  11. #11
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    First part about eliminating PFZ's, YES. I believe that's a very reasonable goal to set. The second part about requiring to own and carry...haha, that would make the world a better place, but I can't see that EVER happening, especially in Michigan.
    Make it like Kennesaw's law, those who object are exempted.
    Big Gay Al
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  12. #12
    Regular Member MikeTheGreek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Gay Al View Post
    Make it like Kennesaw's law, those who object are exempted.
    Why would you require everyone to carry but except anyone who objects? That makes no sense. You HAVE To do this, but if you dont want to..fine.

    0.o

  13. #13
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Gay Al View Post
    Make it like Kennesaw's law, those who object are exempted.
    Illogical. Reported.
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Why would you require everyone to carry but except anyone who objects? That makes no sense. You HAVE To do this, but if you dont want to..fine.

    0.o
    The exact text of the ordinance is:

    [Sec 34-21][18]

    (a) In order to provide for the emergency management of the city, and further in order to provide for and protect the safety, security and general welfare of the city and its inhabitants, every head of household residing in the city limits is required to maintain a firearm, together with ammunition therefore.
    (b)Exempt from the effect of this section are those heads of households who suffer a physical or mental disability which would prohibit them from using such a firearm. Further exempt from the effect of this section are those heads of households who are paupers or who conscientiously oppose maintaining firearms as a result of beliefs or religious doctrine, or persons convicted of a felony.

  15. #15
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    Based on the results of the poll so far, it appears this site should change its name to Open Carry with a CPL.org. This law would improve the carry laws in this state for every gun owner who doesn't have a CPL. Interesting results so far.

  16. #16
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheGreek View Post
    Why would you require everyone to carry but except anyone who objects? That makes no sense. You HAVE To do this, but if you dont want to..fine.

    0.o
    Because, to force people to do something is UN-American, sort of like forcing us to buy health insurance, even if we don't want to. DOH.
    Big Gay Al
    Coordinator, Michigan Pink Pistols
    Big Gay Al's Big Gay (Gun) Blog
    Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal FNX-45 .45ACP 16 rounds of hurt.

  17. #17
    Michigan Moderator Big Gay Al's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by griffin View Post
    Illogical. Reported.
    LOL, you crack me up.
    Big Gay Al
    Coordinator, Michigan Pink Pistols
    Big Gay Al's Big Gay (Gun) Blog
    Fabrique Nationale d'Herstal FNX-45 .45ACP 16 rounds of hurt.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Bronson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    hypothetical...

    SB-59 is dead. New bill offered, what say you.

    NO CPL needed to OC in bars/restaurants/Meijer(any liquor licensed place), theaters, Churches/synagogues and NO CPL needed to carry in a vehicle..

    BUT!!!

    OC is illegal in schools, daycares, hospitals and stadiums.

    DO YOU SUPPORT THIS BILL??
    Yes.

    Bronson
    Those who expect to reap the benefits of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it. – Thomas Paine

  19. #19
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    No. Stop trying to carve out such areas from LACs.

    Carry on

  20. #20
    Regular Member Bikenut's Avatar
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    No.. I would not support such a bill.. or any other bill that has the basic premise that the government should be in control of where, how, why, or for whom, the right to bear arms is "allowed".
    Gun control isn't about the gun at all.... for those who want gun control it is all about their own fragile egos, their own lack of self esteem, their own inner fears, and most importantly... their own desire to dominate others. And an openly carried gun is a slap in the face to all of those things.

  21. #21
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    Wowwie!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by scot623 View Post
    hypothetical...

    SB-59 is dead. New bill offered, what say you.

    NO CPL needed to OC in bars/restaurants/Meijer(any liquor licensed place), theaters, Churches/synagogues and NO CPL needed to carry in a vehicle..

    BUT!!!

    OC is illegal in schools, daycares, hospitals and stadiums.

    DO YOU SUPPORT THIS BILL??
    I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE^^^^^^^^

    How about,,, get rid of 28.425o,,, and
    all the off limit places on the back of the permit.
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

  22. #22
    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    HYPOTHETICAL SB-59 dies, new bill offered

    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE^^^^^^^^

    How about,,, get rid of 28.425o,,, and
    all the off limit places on the back of the permit.
    Green tried that with SB 58. Governor wouldn't go near the bill so therefore the legislative leadership wouldn't.
    Last edited by TheQ; 12-04-2012 at 09:06 AM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmlefler View Post
    No. Stop trying to carve out such areas from LACs.

    Carry on
    This questsion had nothing to do with creatingin carve outs and has everything to do with gauging our willingness to compromise.

  24. #24
    Regular Member Yooper's Avatar
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    I wish 5225 would pass. Getting rid of registration is, IMO, much more important than what SB59 does.
    Rand Paul 2016

  25. #25
    Regular Member 1245A Defender's Avatar
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    Well,,,

    Quote Originally Posted by 1245A Defender View Post
    I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE^^^^^^^^

    How about,,, get rid of 28.425o,,, and
    all the off limit places on the back of the permit.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    Green tried that with SB 58. Governor wouldn't go near the bill so therefore the legislative leadership wouldn't.
    After thinking about my words in this post for awhile, I was going to make a revision...

    If the words of 425o were changed some,,, to only require, concealed carry in these places,,,
    the governer would be happy, the grey areas would go away, the law would be clear.

    You could trade the grey areas of OC with a cpl, for real CC with a CPL only...
    More training is an infringment.
    There is no history of lawfull carry in michigan that points to any need for more training...
    EMNofSeattle wrote: Your idea of freedom terrifies me. So you are actually right. I am perfectly happy with what you call tyranny.....

    “If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.”

    Stand up for your Rights,, They have no authority on their own...

    All power is inherent in the people,
    it is their right and duty to be at all times ARMED!

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