Question, any help would be appreciated

Samantha86 · Dec 8, 2012

I have my CPL. I keep my gun loaded wherever I take it. I do not carry it hot though, because it has no safety on it. If I am in my car driving, and my gun is right there, can my adult friend who is with me take it and use it if we end up in a situation where it needs to be used? Like if someone comes up to the car demanding I get out, or wants money. Last night, in the apartments right next to me, a 16 year old got shot in the stomach by a 29 year old homeless man, the teens were getting in their car about to leave when this homeless guy walked up to them demanding money and the car. The teen guys took the guy down, and one ended up shot, but he is going to be okay, thank god. What if that was me? Does my friend have to have a license to use the gun when it is a life or death situation, like someone threatening to hurt us if we don't give up money or a car? Or does it have to be me, the owner and licensed one? Thanks!! Been curious about this for a while.

MSG Laigaie · Dec 8, 2012

http://www.theolympian.com/2012/12/08/2346617/teen-shot-during-attempted-robbery.html

Is this the incident you are referring to?
Is your friend prohibited from possession of a weapon? If not, use of deadly force may be authorized.

I am not an attorney, but played one in a movie once. Take my advise with a grain of salt and a great deal of personal research.

Flopsweat · Dec 8, 2012

Only a lawyer can properly answer that question for you. In the meantime, strictly for your entertainment,

I would not expect a reasonable prosecutor to go after your friend if it was clear that your lives were in danger. Lots of things can muddy this, though. For example, if your friend is a prohibited person I would never allow a firearm to be within his/her reach.

Now about carrying unchambered - you need to get a handgun that you are comfortable carrying fully loaded. FULLY loaded means with one in the chamber. There is a reason that we practice shooting one handed. This is the same reason that you carry with one in the chamber. I will not carry a gun with no manual safety and a light trigger because, like you, I don't want to shoot myself. I will carry one with a manual safety or a long trigger pull of at least 10 lbs. I'm confident that I can handle such a firearm without accidentally discharging it. I'm not going to mention brand names unless this thread gets really boring.

At first I was not comfortable carrying any gun with a round in the chamber, especially IWB in front. The thought of that barrel pointed straight at my pride and joy was not exactly comforting. I've since learned that modern firearms do not go off spontaneously. You can drop them, shake them, stare at them very sternly, and they will just sit there. You have to pull the trigger. Once I caught on to this I tried carrying with one in the chamber and found that I was comfortable with it in less than a week. Now I would never think of carrying any other way. Since I'm supposed to treat every firearm as if it's loaded, it may as well be, right?

If you ever need that firearm, chances are good that you will need it quickly. Adding the step of working the slide may cost you nothing at all or may cost you everything. I cannot predict which it will be.

MSG Laigaie · Dec 8, 2012

BTW revolver or semi-auto?

Flopsweat · Dec 8, 2012

This article at corneredcat.com may help a bit http://www.corneredcat.com/article/holsters/holster-safety-the-four-rules/ and also look for her stuff on holsters for ladies. There are different considerations and some advantages for gals who pack and Kathy explains things very well. It's a great site and I visit it regularly.

deanf · Dec 8, 2012

What do you mean, "carry it hot"?

hermannr · Dec 8, 2012

Hot_Every_Night said:
I have my CPL. I keep my gun loaded wherever I take it. I do not carry it hot though, because it has no safety on it. If I am in my car driving, and my gun is right there, can my adult friend who is with me take it and use it if we end up in a situation where it needs to be used? Like if someone comes up to the car demanding I get out, or wants money. Last night, in the apartments right next to me, a 16 year old got shot in the stomach by a 29 year old homeless man, the teens were getting in their car about to leave when this homeless guy walked up to them demanding money and the car. The teen guys took the guy down, and one ended up shot, but he is going to be okay, thank god. What if that was me? Does my friend have to have a license to use the gun when it is a life or death situation, like someone threatening to hurt us if we don't give up money or a car? Or does it have to be me, the owner and licensed one? Thanks!! Been curious about this for a while.

I would suggest you read RCW 9A.16. Pay particular attention to RCW 9A.16.110. as well as RCW 9.41.270 Better yet, just KNOW RCW 9.41 from start to finish...read it, read it again, and as many times as is needed to be able to recite it..OK?

In the situation you discribed, I would not even worry about any "prohibitions", as in underage or stuff like that. True SD trumps all.

TheGunMan · Dec 8, 2012

My suggestion

My suggestion is if you are going to carry then load the thing. If you need it you will not have time to chamber a round. Modern firearms are designed to be loaded with one n the chamber.
You need to spend more time with it as to get used to it. In the time it takes you to get it out and chamber a round most people on here could empty a magazine in you. You dont have time.
Practice with your gunand carry it correctly so if you need it, it wont get you killed. What type of gun is it? and model.

TheGunMan · Dec 8, 2012

Ditto

hermannr said:
I would suggest you read RCW 9A.16. Pay particular attention to RCW 9A.16.110. as well as RCW 9.41.270 Better yet, just KNOW RCW 9.41 from start to finish...read it, read it again, and as many times as is needed to be able to recite it..OK?

In the situation you discribed, I would not even worry about any "prohibitions", as in underage or stuff like that. True SD trumps all.

Ditto,
Well said

Difdi · Dec 8, 2012

hermannr said:
In the situation you discribed, I would not even worry about any "prohibitions", as in underage or stuff like that. True SD trumps all.

As the old saying goes, better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

aa1911 · Dec 8, 2012

There's a good reason not loading a round in the chamber is called a 'dead man's gun'. Keep one in the pipe, it is likely you will not have the time or ability to rack a round into the chamber.

I would think that unless the other person is prohibited, they could certainly use the gun.

BigDave · Dec 8, 2012

Hot_Every_Night said:
I have my CPL. I keep my gun loaded wherever I take it. I do not carry it hot though, because it has no safety on it. If I am in my car driving, and my gun is right there, can my adult friend who is with me take it and use it if we end up in a situation where it needs to be used? Like if someone comes up to the car demanding I get out, or wants money. Last night, in the apartments right next to me, a 16 year old got shot in the stomach by a 29 year old homeless man, the teens were getting in their car about to leave when this homeless guy walked up to them demanding money and the car. The teen guys took the guy down, and one ended up shot, but he is going to be okay, thank god. What if that was me? Does my friend have to have a license to use the gun when it is a life or death situation, like someone threatening to hurt us if we don't give up money or a car? Or does it have to be me, the owner and licensed one? Thanks!! Been curious about this for a while.

What weapon do you carry? I am assuming it is a pistol but which one? Springfield XD has two safeties on the back bone of the grip and trigger but no thumb safety, Glock has one on the trigger though personally I do not care for. There are numerous good gun that have trigger block in them to prevent an accidental discharge.

If you are uncomfortable with carrying one in the pipe then I would recommend training classes as knowledge will remove the doubt and nervousness that seems to be plaguing you right now.

As to letting your friend take your weapon if needed is fine as long as they are legal to possess a firearm but raises the issue of being proficient with a handgun and again training would help with that as well. I know a few women that carry and if someone tried to take their firearm to engage someone they likely get shot trying to take it! I would hope you take the position of confident in yourself to do what needs to be done.

Samantha86 · Dec 9, 2012

Carry it hot refers to a live round in the chamber, ready to fire.

deanf said:
What do you mean, "carry it hot"?

Samantha86 · Dec 9, 2012

I have 2 guns, but mainly carry my S&W M&P .45 and it has no safety on it. It is the model with no thumb safety or any of that. I am not nervous or doubt myself, I am educated and know how to use it and I am aware of the safe handling in order to prevent an accident. I don't know what gave you the assumption I am not confident. My friend has training with firearms and is good with it, and I trust him to use it if he needs to.

BigDave said:
What weapon do you carry? I am assuming it is a pistol but which one? Springfield XD has two safeties on the back bone of the grip and trigger but no thumb safety, Glock has one on the trigger though personally I do not care for. There are numerous good gun that have trigger block in them to prevent an accidental discharge.

If you are uncomfortable with carrying one in the pipe then I would recommend training classes as knowledge will remove the doubt and nervousness that seems to be plaguing you right now.

As to letting your friend take your weapon if needed is fine as long as they are legal to possess a firearm but raises the issue of being proficient with a handgun and again training would help with that as well. I know a few women that carry and if someone tried to take their firearm to engage someone they likely get shot trying to take it! I would hope you take the position of confident in yourself to do what needs to be done.

deanf · Dec 9, 2012

Carry it hot refers to a live round in the chamber, ready to fire.

I know, I just hate slang like that. I mean, it really has no meaning. The gun is not "hot" until it's been fired. Just sitting there with a round in the chamber, it's ambient temperature.

Samantha86 · Dec 9, 2012

S&w m&p45

thegunman said:
my suggestion is if you are going to carry then load the thing. If you need it you will not have time to chamber a round. Modern firearms are designed to be loaded with one n the chamber.
You need to spend more time with it as to get used to it. In the time it takes you to get it out and chamber a round most people on here could empty a magazine in you. You dont have time.
Practice with your gunand carry it correctly so if you need it, it wont get you killed. What type of gun is it? And model.

Samantha86 · Dec 9, 2012

I have read all of those, I have them written down and look at them all the time. I am constantly trying to improve my knowledge. Thank you.

hermannr said:
I would suggest you read RCW 9A.16. Pay particular attention to RCW 9A.16.110. as well as RCW 9.41.270 Better yet, just KNOW RCW 9.41 from start to finish...read it, read it again, and as many times as is needed to be able to recite it..OK?

In the situation you discribed, I would not even worry about any "prohibitions", as in underage or stuff like that. True SD trumps all.

Samantha86 · Dec 9, 2012

Semi auto, I don't like revolvers. It is a S&W M&P45

MSG Laigaie said:
BTW revolver or semi-auto?

BigDave · Dec 9, 2012

Hot_Every_Night said:
I have 2 guns, but mainly carry my S&W M&P .45 and it has no safety on it. It is the model with no thumb safety or any of that. I am not nervous or doubt myself, I am educated and know how to use it and I am aware of the safe handling in order to prevent an accident. I don't know what gave you the assumption I am not confident. My friend has training with firearms and is good with it, and I trust him to use it if he needs to.

Oh I don't know, your post! If you knew the laws then you would not have needed to ask if your friend could use your gun legally, or the idea a license gives you any knowledge or proficiency when it doesn't, if you knew about weapons and safe handling then again you would not have needed to ask if carrying one in the chamber was safe, it is if you follow the gun safety rules.

Honestly, you sound like a young kid wanting others to think you know it all but don't.

sudden valley gunner · Dec 9, 2012

BigDave said:
Oh I don't know, your post! If you knew the laws then you would not have needed to ask if your friend could use your gun legally, or the idea a license gives you any knowledge or proficiency when it doesn't, if you knew about weapons and safe handling then again you would not have needed to ask if carrying one in the chamber was safe, it is if you follow the gun safety rules.

Honestly, you sound like a young kid wanting others to think you know it all but don't.

Cite where she asked this?

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