Wth

I was in my local indian smoke shop at the time this news came out. I stated, this type of thing is exactly why I carry..and the propriator answers??? "exactly"

Think about this: If every adult in that school carried, how many would have died? the bad guy? maybe one or two others. Sheep to the slaughter in the artificial "victim rich zone"

Ideas for strategic response.

I hear all of the good arguments on here, but we are, of course, preaching to the choir. I would welcome any good suggestions on how we respond to this in the community, especially now that the left looks to be gearing up for a hard push, using this tragedy (of THEIR making) as an excuse. Give me some, if you will pardon the term, ammo for conversation.

Boomboy007 said:

I hear all of the good arguments on here, but we are, of course, preaching to the choir. I would welcome any good suggestions on how we respond to this in the community, especially now that the left looks to be gearing up for a hard push, using this tragedy (of THEIR making) as an excuse. Give me some, if you will pardon the term, ammo for conversation.

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A couple of pointers I would use, although I'm not a political strategist.

Remember the reasons why gun free school zone laws were imposed, not why they don't work. GFSZA was not meant to stop school shooters, it was to provide a means to federally prosecute gang members and the like who came packing to school. So point out that the law not only allows things like this to happen easier, but that it's failed in its intended role to boot

The majority of the non-gun owning public thinks gun laws are stricter then they actually are ( this is one thing the brady campaign does right, provides me ideas) use this to your advantage. I want guns allowed "for those licensed to own firearms" (keep in mind the word license means many things, including simple permission, a law allowing you to buy and own firearms with no paperwork is, strictly speaking, a license to own and sell firearms) this will put in their minds the idea that these people are somehow trained or have official type of paperwork without actually lying. this will make things easier politically if people believe the law requires more then it does

Firearms are only the most easy means to kill people, but not the only. a recent skrool massacre in China 22 people died from stab wounds. Bombs can be made easily from house hold products, official US military publications on how to make bombs are freely available for less then two dollars at surplus stores, so while guns are easy, there is plenty of firepower in regular household products sold with no restrictions. 30 dollars in cash I can get 8 gallons of gasoline and a book of matches... that's alot of potential deadly right there....

Finally I conclude with saying, the gun makes it easier for school shooters yes, but it also makes it easier for the 130 pound woman walking home at night to protect herself from the 200 pound rapist, it may be easier to off gang rivals with a gun, but it also makes it easier for a skinny middle age Korean just trying to keep his store open to protect himself against those who would kill him for 20 bucks in the register and a pack of smokes. Or for the outnumbered police officer to make it home to his family at the end of his shift. Guns are a morally neutral tool. they can sybomlize justice and equality just as they can symbolize fear and intimidation. It's important people understand that fact.


A coda I usually use on liberals... this only works on leftists though.... "Is it ok for Brinks to arm their armored car drivers" and they always say "yes" and then I look at them and say "so it's ok for the big corporations to allow people to carry guns to protect their money but not ok for a single mom to carry one to protect her kids" they always look dumbfounded at that one

Trigger Dr said:

Economy, recent election, but most of it, I would guess they are just nucking futz

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It's worldwide and not all school attacks involve guns. This happened in China at almost the same time as the CT. shooting:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57559179/china-school-knife-attack-leaves-23-injured/

It appears that mankind has developed to it's max and the pendulum is returning to the other side.

Sure glad I don't have young kids in school anymore. If I did, I'd probably be sitting in the car everyday, watching the door for people just like this.

We've come a long way since I was in Grade School but I'm not sure it's all good. I wouldn't have put it past my Grade School principal, in the small town I grew up in, to have kept a .45 in his desk.

manchurian candidates. what better way for our government to get us to give our rights away by delving to the bottom of the pot and have children massacred, putting massive fear into the hearts of the people. like someone said before in this thread, there are too many similar "orchestrated" events of this nature. they may have finally hit a nerve with this latest one. it is truly sad, all of them are.

I rember driving my pickup to school with the gun rack in the back window with guns in it so we could go plinking after school. And the principal say how it must be nice to have one that was semi auto . All he had when he was our age was single shot or bolt action rifles and shotguns its amazing how no one got shot in our school. You could walk through the parking lot and I would bet 10% of the pickups had guns in the back windows.

My condolences go out to the family of the injured. My frustration goes out to a society who insists that we give up rights for safety, it has a horrible track record.

Boomboy007 said:

I hear all of the good arguments on here, but we are, of course, preaching to the choir. I would welcome any good suggestions on how we respond to this in the community, especially now that the left looks to be gearing up for a hard push, using this tragedy (of THEIR making) as an excuse. Give me some, if you will pardon the term, ammo for conversation.

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Good approach Brian. Letters to editor, although our local paper is a joke, call in to local talk shows. There are going to be a lot of people venting frustrations out on inanimate objects and those of us who carry.

Just saw on fox that both guns actually used in the shooting were pistols. The "high powered" .223 rifle was left in the car.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I bought my wife some flowers as a thanks for homeschooling our kids. Guns are most definitely allowed in their school.

Take a look at society in general. The movies are violent, the cartoons are violent, sassing (for a lack of a better word) parents/teachers, you get the idea. Just how long will it take for someone to take this morality into action? We found out!

Some of his family said that he was autistic. Does that make a difference? I don't know. There are two parts to a person; body and mind.

You feed a child junk food and he will get fat.
You feed a child's mind junk food and, well, what do you expect?

My heart goes out to the families involved. I really think we have failed you.

Squeak said:

Some of his family said that he was autistic. Does that make a difference? I don't know. There are two parts to a person; body and mind.

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This is an interesting point Squeak. Life's not fair and maybe this kid was, I would be interested in finding out if his disabilities were coddled or if instead he was taught to deal with his life that didn't make him normal........I am thinking by his actions ...coddled.

sudden valley gunner said:

This is an interesting point Squeak. Life's not fair and maybe this kid was, I would be interested in finding out if his disabilities were coddled or if instead he was taught to deal with his life that didn't make him normal........I am thinking by his actions ...coddled.

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As both the 380Lady and I listened to the ABC news this morning and overheard where the female commentator was explaining that those she had talked with claimed that the shooters mother had coddled him from a very young age. We do believe your first impression is correct.

I happened to comment back to 380Lady that I hope that doesn't end up being the fate of my oldest grandson as one of my daughters who is also pursuing a career in teaching coddles both of her sons all the time. It is a shame that she had found a good man who was willing to be a part of our grandsons lives and was teaching them some real lessons in life, but because she never wanted him to rough-house with them or allow them to be boys, she ended the relationship with the one person who was doing the most good in that family. Of course her mentor in all of this was the woman I divorced for her erratic behaviors that were never apparent before we got married.

I believe his older brothers exact words were "he has 'slight' autism or asperger syndrome", doesn't seem like it to me. There is also a lot of misinformation with this story, things keep getting changed or extra stuff keeps getting put in, I read on one news media outlet that was changed in another outlet or left out. Also keep reading in the comments the Brady Campaign is farming for investors and support, and I think we should counter with not another "system has failed" as EMN put it, BC is going that route for gun-control.

We should just keep showing responsible gun ownership and honesty like we have been, BC has been dishonest through their run and now they are waning in support and funds and people who will listen.

'I Am Adam Lanza's Mother': A Mom's Perspective On The Mental Illness Conversation In America

Is the bigger issue on this killing spree "Mental Illness" ?

Everyone keeps talking about how we should respond or what should be done after things like this. Why do we need to respond or change anything? this was an extremely rare tragedy, I doubt any law or whatever could have done much of anything. It happened, the guy was a whacko, what do we need to do? ban whacko's? guns? turn our schools into prison style securement?

course arming teachers would be great as one school in Texas is planning on allowing but we all know that's not gonna go over very many places.

unless we're willing to allow firearms everywhere and stop creating 'defense free zones', we're not going to stop anything like this from happening once in a while and responding with anything other than common sense isn't going to amount to anything.

why was this kid with mental illness allowed to get ahold of guns? That should be the question. Maybe stiffer penalties for those who leave guns exposed for kids and mentally ill people. Just like the cop in Marysville that left the gun in the car for his kid to get ahold of.

amzbrady said:

why was this kid with mental illness allowed to get ahold of guns? That should be the question. Maybe stiffer penalties for those who leave guns exposed for kids and mentally ill people. Just like the cop in Marysville that left the gun in the car for his kid to get ahold of.

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Are you kidding?

one, in case you didn't know, the law of your state allows you to arm children to protect their home (RCW 9.41.042 (8))

second, if the shooter was not adjudicated as mentally defective or committed to a mental hospital then he was legally allowed to possess firearms and has the same rights as everyone. I've seen that he was on meds and apparently went to a hospital, but was he adjudicated or committed? if no then he was legally allowed to possess firearms and thus the mother bears no responsibility.

It is wrong to take away someone's rights because another person abused those rights. Period

those who trade liberty for safety deserve neither.

Freedom costs.

I think that EMN has it right; not only is trading liberty for safety morally wrong, but it has been shown to be counter-effective. I know plenty of people living with autism, some functional adults in society, some needing the lifelong care of society. None of them have ever committed mass murder.

We will never, ever be able to eliminate crazy people. In fact, most of the brilliant scientists, entertainers, athletes, and others who are "special" examples of humanity have a little element of nuttiness. That is generally WHY they are able to think, act, or perform past the normal limits to which most of us are constrained. Thus, I really don't care to TRY to totally eliminate "crazy". That said, we all need access to the tools that will protect us from Mr. (or Ms.) Mass Murderer. There will ALWAYS be a tool for the effective elimination of large numbers of people if you take guns away from the law abiding; there just won't be an effective tool to resist these attacks.

Firearms are the ultimate in equality: A gun doesn't care if you are black, white, asian, or latino. It doesn't care if you are a 280lb man, or a 102 lb woman. Gay, straight, bi, transgendered. Christian, Muslim, Jew, or Pagan, Firearms are the ULTIMATE in equality. They are the tools that prevent simple Might is Right rule.

Sorry, getting worked up on the ole' soapbox.

So it looks like Seattle Councilman Bruce Harrell is already using this to go after pre-emption and wanting every city in WA to have their own laws:

http://www.komonews.com/news/local/Seattle-Councilman-working-to-tighten-gun-laws-183891091.html


I already called and left him a message explaining that it would cost the state a fortune and put us even further into debt, as well as making no sense for something to be a crime and then not be a crime just by crossing into a different city limits.

Here is his info, everyone give him a call and/or write him an email:
Council position: 3 Personal Blog RSS Feed to Personal Blog Facebook Twitter Flickr
In office since: 2008
Current term: 2012-2015

Chair: Public Safety, Civil Rights, and Technology Committee
Vice-Chair: Transportation Committee
Member: Housing, Human Services, Health, and Culture Committee and
Labor Relations Policy Committee
Alternate: Libraries, Utilities, and Center Committee

Phone: 206-684-8804
Email: bruce.harrell@seattle.gov
Website: seattle.gov/council/harrell/
Staff: Vinh Tang, Jennifer L. Samuels, and Jeremy Racca

EMNofSeattle said:

Are you kidding?

one, in case you didn't know, the law of your state allows you to arm children to protect their home (RCW 9.41.042 (8))

second, if the shooter was not adjudicated as mentally defective or committed to a mental hospital then he was legally allowed to possess firearms and has the same rights as everyone. I've seen that he was on meds and apparently went to a hospital, but was he adjudicated or committed? if no then he was legally allowed to possess firearms and thus the mother bears no responsibility.

It is wrong to take away someone's rights because another person abused those rights. Period

those who trade liberty for safety deserve neither.

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And now it appears, based on a recent news release, that this kid's Mother KNEW her kid was "different". SHE chose to provide him with the guns he used, telling people she thought shooting would be a good activity for him and it might have a "calming" effect on him.

The money would have been better spent on some psychological counseling. Maybe a professional would have seen this coming long ago and he would have been "adjudicated" as mentally ill.

Combine the untreated mental illness due to people not wanting any social stigma attached to their kids, the lack of family (this shooter was from a broken family), and the overall despair that goes with a failing economy, makes for a dangerous combination. How many more "time bombs" are walking the street today like this kid and the last several mass shooters?

The best our "Leaders(?)" are coming up with is "ban more weapons", not "let's put more emphasis on mental health evaluation, treatment, and if necessary, institutions".