Kmart- kid jumps out of aisle with a pistol

Kids have played with toy funs forever. You shouldn't have told him that he could get shot doing what kids do!

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tattedupboy said:

Kids have played with toy funs forever. You shouldn't have told him that he could get shot doing what kids do!

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What at all was inaccurate or untrue about what he said? Do you really need examples of the plethora of cases out there of punk-ass kids getting shot because they pointed a toy gun at someone (usually a cop)? It COULD have gotten the little punk shot, pure & simple. Whether such a shooting would be ethically, morally, or legally justified after the fact is really irrelevant. Dead is dead. Including dead from stupid.

I grew up playing cowboys and indians. As a kid about 6, the lone ranger was my hero and I always had my six gun on. Everywhere I went I shot every indian I saw, Oh and everyone I saw was an indian. I pointed my gun at everything living or not and shot it.

Metalhead47 said:

What at all was inaccurate or untrue about what he said? Do you really need examples of the plethora of cases out there of punk-ass kids getting shot because they pointed a toy gun at someone (usually a cop)? It COULD have gotten the little punk shot, pure & simple. Whether such a shooting would be ethically, morally, or legally justified after the fact is really irrelevant. Dead is dead. Including dead from stupid.

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Kids should be scared to use a toy gun in the commission of a crime, not of playing with a toy gun in a completely innocent manner.

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tattedupboy said:

Kids should be scared to use a toy gun in the commission of a crime, not of playing with a toy gun in a completely innocent manner.

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Pointing a toy gun HE DIDN'T EVEN OWN at a person in a busy store, ESPECIALLY in this day & age, is in no way a "completely innocent manner. As I and others have said, it's a good way to get shot.

Punk. Ass. Kid.


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Metalhead47 said:

Pointing a toy gun HE DIDN'T EVEN OWN at a person in a busy store, ESPECIALLY in this day & age, is in no way a "completely innocent manner. As I and others have said, it's a good way to get shot.

Punk. Ass. Kid.


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I would say more like a parent who needs some training.

amlevin said:

A crowded K-Mart? Where?

My local K-Mart is considered crowded when all the employees show up for work. Makes me wonder how they stay open.

As for the kid, a smack on the back of the head, delivered from the Father would have been really refreshing to see, no doubt. Expect to see it happen right after the Easter Bunny is proven to be real.

If I'd pulled that stunt when the same age, I'd be "assisted" out of the store by my Dad's right shoe. All the way to the car I'd be getting a reminder how stupid I was. To an observer it would have appeared that my Dad was walking on only his left leg while booting my ass with the other.

Ah, the good old days.

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The lack of discipline and respect is a lot of what is wrong today.

Trigger Dr said:

I would say more like a parent who needs some training.

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+10000

sudden valley gunner said:

Good point but slight semantical correction. The venom isn't more toxic the baby rattlers don't have as much control over their venom as adult rattlers.....which would make your point even more poignant.

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PistolPackingMomma said:

Actually, babies are not more toxic, and the output of their venom is less than an adults, since they are much smaller, and the venom sacs cannot hold as much volume as a mature snake. So they may inject more venom by percentage, but that doesn't mean they actually inject more than an adult is capable of.

But both are capable of causing death, given the right circumstances.

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You both need to do more research.

From Professor Harry Greene, one of the world's leading snake experts:

When rattlesnakes are babies, they are too small to eat what adult snakes eat. An adult’s diet consists mainly of mammals like rodents. A baby rattlesnake eats mostly reptiles such as little lizards.

The baby rattler’s venom contains more neurotoxin than the adult’s, because reptiles react differently to adult rattlesnake venom.

Neurotoxins are more dangerous than cytotoxins, which make up most of an adult rattlesnake’s venom.

Therefore, baby rattlesnake venom may be slightly more toxic than adult venom. However, all snake experts agree that being bitten by an adult rattlesnake is far more dangerous than a bite from a baby rattlesnake.

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So yes, baby rattlesnakes ARE more toxic (although slightly) than Adults.

Trigger Dr said:

I would say more like a parent who needs some training.

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+1

amlevin said:

You both need to do more research.

From Professor Harry Greene, one of the world's leading snake experts:



So yes, baby rattlesnakes ARE more toxic (although slightly) than Adults.

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Interesting, I am always open to being corrected and learn more have a link?

rattlesnake venom notwithstanding, The OP was a little harsh with the kid, a ten year old pointing an orange tipped gun in a department store is more likely then not a toy, and that's exactly what a jury is going to buy if he had shot the kid in "self defense" There is little reason to fear death or grave injury in those circumstances. Telling the kid "you could be shot" especially if you were visibly armed... well I don't know, but I wouldn't want to risk someone swearing out a complaint against me for threatening people, especially since B-ham seems to have some serious problems with the actions of their officers and city attorney.

also the fact that the gun was "not his" is irrelevant, that's an issue for the parent and store management to work out.

Although the one time I was a little kid and opened the packaging on merchandise not purchased I came to regret that decision, and didn't ever do it again. While bad parenting may factor in, that's the parent's business.

As far as the toy, if it's legally marked as a toy and it's reasonable to say it is a toy based on the circumstances, then swiss-cheesing the kid is not an option to consider.

EMNofSeattle
rattlesnake venom notwithstanding, The OP was a little harsh with the kid..... Harsh? Harsh? I raised my voice a bit. Harsh is making a grown man pee himself when you yell at him.

a ten year old pointing an orange tipped gun in a department store is more likely then not a toy, Sorry mate, I just do not have that much faith in people to assume a black weapon, in hand, and the tip not readily visible is a toy.

At no time did I consider shooting the individual with the weapon. I observed, moved to an advantageous spot and did not have to act.

Telling the kid "you could be shot" especially if you were visibly armed... well I don't know

I do not care if you are a twelve year old with an airsoft or a LEO with a glock, stupid is as stupid does. Wave a gun or something that appears to be a gun in my face and I will verbally correct you. I have had weapons in my space for my entire life, I do not tolerate sloppy handling of a weapon. Another person may have handled this much worse considering todays headlines.

tattedupboy said:

Kids should be scared to use a toy gun in the commission of a crime, not of playing with a toy gun in a completely innocent manner.

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+1

MSG Laigaie said:

EMNofSeattle
rattlesnake venom notwithstanding, The OP was a little harsh with the kid..... Harsh? Harsh? I raised my voice a bit. Harsh is making a grown man pee himself when you yell at him.

a ten year old pointing an orange tipped gun in a department store is more likely then not a toy, Sorry mate, I just do not have that much faith in people to assume a black weapon, in hand, and the tip not readily visible is a toy.

At no time did I consider shooting the individual with the weapon. I observed, moved to an advantageous spot and did not have to act.

Telling the kid "you could be shot" especially if you were visibly armed... well I don't know

I do not care if you are a twelve year old with an airsoft or a LEO with a glock, stupid is as stupid does. Wave a gun or something that appears to be a gun in my face and I will verbally correct you. I have had weapons in my space for my entire life, I do not tolerate sloppy handling of a weapon. Another person may have handled this much worse considering todays headlines.

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Well call me a wimp, but I don't think I could handle killing someone not old enough to shave, even if I knew he was holding a real gun, I'd probably rather get shot then fire at such s young person. I'm naturally peace-loving at a personel level. I don't think I could ever live with myself. So I'd be more willing to assume its a toy.

I absolutely do not tolerate unsafe firearm handling, but air soft guns are a different manner, they're toys. I've played games involving shooting each other with said guns for years. I don't view an air soft as applicable to the same safety standard, although I'd certainly never point them at people not involved in the game....


That being said, the kid needs to learn to respects other people's (K marts) property and to not go tearing out merchandise, theft is wrong.

And interrupting a guy just trying to shop shoes bad etiquette, the kid needs to learn social skills better, I won't nessecarily condemn him becuase I have my own social skill issues ive been dealing with for some time, but he certianly needs work on them

EMNofSeattle said:

The OP was a little harsh with the kid, a ten year old pointing an orange tipped gun in a department store is more likely then not a toy

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There have been people paint a orange tip on a real gun. Orange tip or not I would have had concern

EMNofSeattle said:

Well call me a wimp, but I don't think I could handle killing someone not old enough to shave, even if I knew he was holding a real gun, I'd probably rather get shot then fire at such s young person. I'm naturally peace-loving at a personel level. I don't think I could ever live with myself. So I'd be more willing to assume its a toy.

I absolutely do not tolerate unsafe firearm handling, but air soft guns are a different manner, they're toys. I've played games involving shooting each other with said guns for years. I don't view an air soft as applicable to the same safety standard, although I'd certainly never point them at people not involved in the game....


That being said, the kid needs to learn to respects other people's (K marts) property and to not go tearing out merchandise, theft is wrong.

And interrupting a guy just trying to shop shoes bad etiquette, the kid needs to learn social skills better, I won't nessecarily condemn him becuase I have my own social skill issues ive been dealing with for some time, but he certianly needs work on them

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OK, You are a wimp...It matters not that the gun was an airsoft. His future gun handling and safety skills are being developed at that age. The lack of proper skill development does not change when the gun changes from toy to real. These skills are very much like penmanship. It is a combination of cognitive skills and muscle memory. Learn to write sloppy and you will continue to write sloppy. Learn proper safety and handling and you will handle safely.

EMNofSeattle said:

Well call me a wimp, but I don't think I could handle killing someone not old enough to shave, even if I knew he was holding a real gun, I'd probably rather get shot then fire at such s young person. I'm naturally peace-loving at a personel level. I don't think I could ever live with myself. So I'd be more willing to assume its a toy.

I absolutely do not tolerate unsafe firearm handling, but air soft guns are a different manner, they're toys. I've played games involving shooting each other with said guns for years. I don't view an air soft as applicable to the same safety standard, although I'd certainly never point them at people not involved in the game....


That being said, the kid needs to learn to respects other people's (K marts) property and to not go tearing out merchandise, theft is wrong.

And interrupting a guy just trying to shop shoes bad etiquette, the kid needs to learn social skills better, I won't nessecarily condemn him becuase I have my own social skill issues ive been dealing with for some time, but he certianly needs work on them

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Your a wimp.

amzbrady said:

Your a wimp.

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"You're a wimp." Insults lose their evidentiary value when possessory interest is violated by improper contraction.

EMNofSeattle said:

As a factor yes, Im yet to hear about a 6 or 7 year old popping out of aisles on a busy shopping day with a loaded gun and start busting caps.

age of the potential aggressor can be a factor, as in if they're barely as tall as my waist they can probably be discounted as a threat for the most part

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I know a few Vietnam Veterans who miss their friends because children who were barely old enough to talk, would walk up to them begging for chocolate, and when in range would suddenly explode. I've also heard that this same tactic was observed in Iraq and Afghanistan.

I understand that I am not talking about children jumping out with what you might suspect is a toy gun in their hands, but consider this, Adults put those children in that position!

Now, what if an Adult put a real loaded pistol in the hand of a child and said, "Want to have some fun playing Cowboys and Indians. Pretend you and I are Cowboys and everyone else is an Indian, now, go shoot yourself some Indians.", do you still think that children who are barely tall enough to reach your waist could not be a threat?

Adults take advantage of youthful naivety all the time, I've already mentioned a few examples, now look at how the DC Snipper twisted the mind of his young apprentice.