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Thread: Recording a leo

  1. #1
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    Recording a leo

    What is the law when recording leo's? Like if I get stopped while OC'ing do I have to inform him or her that I am audio and or video recording?

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    Google/Bing/Yahoo is your friend.

    I found this in under three minutes:

    § 15A‑287. Interception and disclosure of wire, oral, or electronic communications prohibited.
    (a) Except as otherwise specifically provided in this Article, a person is guilty of a Class H felony if, without the consent of at least one party to the communication, the person:
    (1) Willfully intercepts, endeavors to intercept, or procures any other person to intercept or endeavor to intercept, any wire, oral, or electronic communication... (emphasis added by Citizen).

    http://www.ncleg.net/gascripts/statu...pl?statute=15A

    Looks like NC is what is called a "one-party consent" state. Generally, this means that if one party to the conversation consents, then it is legal to record. Generally, that one party can be you.

    Wait a bit for others to chime in just in case the statute changed or there is some court interpretation of the statute that skews things.

    Also, over the last year and half, federal courts have been finding that recording public officials is protected by the First Amendment. Cops were arresting people for video-ing them in public, citing wiretapping laws and pretending the First Amendment didn't exist. A few federal courts have ruled in favor of the arrestee's. I don't know the opinion of the federal court with jurisdiction over NC or whether that court has even ruled on such a case.

    Best to wait until you get a few more answers that cite the law or court opinion, and then check out those citations yourself. You can also google reporters and videography of public officials in NC--professions that record frequently.
    Last edited by Citizen; 01-02-2013 at 07:42 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCCobra View Post
    What is the law when recording leo's? Like if I get stopped while OC'ing do I have to inform him or her that I am audio and or video recording?
    Yes you can record an encounter with a leo. I carry a small recorder on my person.
    I have OC and CC for 10+ years.
    Lannie
    GRNC Member and volunteer, NRA member and volunteer. Open Carry Advocate
    Triangle Open Carry Co-Organizer: Co-Chairman Johnston county Friends of the NRA.

  4. #4
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    recent rulings are that wire tapping is just that tapping a closed conversation (telephone, etc.). in which case NC is one party consent state. but you do have to be a party in the conversation

    any thing that is said in the open is recordable since no privacy is to be expected.

    any public figure does not have the rights of privacy, since they are public. but they can expect privacy in their private lives. refer back to things said in open. this can mean a cop can not expect privacy, even if he is in the police station
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lannie View Post
    Yes you can record an encounter with a leo. I carry a small recorder on my person.
    I have OC and CC for 10+ years.
    Lannie
    Lannie, this is Andrew from the Triangle Carry Open Cary group on Meetup.

    Do you ever let the leo know you are recording or no?

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCCobra View Post
    Lannie, this is Andrew from the Triangle Carry Open Cary group on Meetup.

    Do you ever let the leo know you are recording or no?
    Never had a confrontation with LEOs,but with discussions with officers I never show my recorder.
    Lannie
    GRNC Member and volunteer, NRA member and volunteer. Open Carry Advocate
    Triangle Open Carry Co-Organizer: Co-Chairman Johnston county Friends of the NRA.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NCCobra View Post
    Lannie, this is Andrew from the Triangle Carry Open Cary group on Meetup.

    Do you ever let the leo know you are recording or no?
    I never mention it or let the cop see it.* A quick google search shows too many confiscated digital recording devices confiscated and returned blank.

    It is important to understand that if you are recording a bad encounter with a cop, you really, really want to not escalate things into an arrest. If arrested, you will be very thoroughly searched. Google "search incident", meaning a search incident to arrest. Your recording will definitely be found, and likely erased, if the recorder doesn't disappear altogether. Also, you don't want to mention the recording or threaten legal process against the cop during a bad cop encounter. Meaning, you don't want to back him into a corner where now he has to arrest you to obtain the recording and invent a charge to justify the arrest in order to protect himself.


    *Besides avoiding confiscation, my state is a one-party consent state so I am not required to disclose the recording.
    Last edited by Citizen; 01-03-2013 at 06:40 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I never mention it or let the cop see it.* A quick google search shows too many confiscated digital recording devices confiscated and returned blank.

    It is important to understand that if you are recording a bad encounter with a cop, you really, really want to not escalate things into an arrest. If arrested, you will be very thoroughly searched. Google "search incident", meaning a search incident to arrest. Your recording will definitely be found, and likely erased, if the recorder doesn't disappear altogether. Also, you don't want to mention the recording or threaten legal process against the cop during a bad cop encounter. Meaning, you don't want to back him into a corner where now he has to arrest you to obtain the recording and invent a charge to justify the arrest in order to protect himself.


    *Besides avoiding confiscation, my state is a one-party consent state so I am not required to disclose the recording.
    I thought there was a app that records to the internet for mobile devices.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    I thought there was a app that records to the internet for mobile devices.
    Good point. Thanks for mentioning it.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  10. #10
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    There are a couple good Android apps...Cop Recorder and Police Tape (by the ACLU). if you can see a need, start one and then lock the screen. Just make sure that you have the swipe security turned on and the usb connection turned off and the phone is relatively secure. I believe that either will allow automatic uploads to the internet periodically.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by carolina guy View Post
    There are a couple good Android apps...Cop Recorder and Police Tape (by the ACLU). if you can see a need, start one and then lock the screen. Just make sure that you have the swipe security turned on and the usb connection turned off and the phone is relatively secure. I believe that either will allow automatic uploads to the internet periodically.
    i have heard... your fone's screen should be locked at all times so you have to put in either a code or a pattern to use it. again, i have heard this precludes the authorities from accessing your device (so the authorities can protect evidence is the term i have heard) w/o a court order.

    say you were texting and have an accident and are taken to the hospital or away from your fone, the police could look at your fone texting activities and could cite you as at least a contributor to the accident.

    yes, yes, i know police need RAS but in their effort to protect evidence etc., better safe than sorry so keep your fone inaccessible from prying eyes.

    wabbit

    PS: again, I have heard those fone recorder apps that record to the internet are free access to anybody who has a 'membership' to the site possibly including the media and the authorities. thanks i pass having everyone access my recording before i have it reviewed by my attorney.

    pps: didn't you folk watch Sesame Street and learn how to spell words pho·neti·cal·ly...geez guess ya'll had very limited educational opportunities, huh!!
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    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ncwabbit View Post
    i have heard... your fone's screen should be locked at all times so you have to put in either a code or a pattern to use it. again, i have heard this precludes the authorities from accessing your device (so the authorities can protect evidence is the term i have heard) w/o a court order.

    say you were texting and have an accident and are taken to the hospital or away from your fone, the police could look at your fone texting activities and could cite you as at least a contributor to the accident.

    yes, yes, i know police need RAS but in their effort to protect evidence etc., better safe than sorry so keep your fone inaccessible from prying eyes.

    wabbit

    PS: again, I have heard those fone recorder apps that record to the internet are free access to anybody who has a 'membership' to the site possibly including the media and the authorities. thanks i pass having everyone access my recording before i have it reviewed by my attorney.

    pps: didn't you folk watch Sesame Street and learn how to spell words pho·neti·cal·ly...geez guess ya'll had very limited educational opportunities, huh!!
    I keep my phone on a short screen saver timeout (less than 2 minutes) and always have the option to hit the power button to lock it immediately. So, with the swipe, memory encryption turned on, and USB connections turned off, they would need to either hack the phone or get my pattern to access any data...both would/should require a court order or my cooperation.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  13. #13
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    If the cops learn of your "recording" device there is no need to erase anything if damaging the device will suffice to preclude the reconstruction or transferring of the recorded data. Uploading in real time is a necessity. Any monetary cost is the price we must pay to exercise our right(s).
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

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    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    If the cops learn of your "recording" device there is no need to erase anything if damaging the device will suffice to preclude the reconstruction or transferring of the recorded data. Uploading in real time is a necessity. Any monetary cost is the price we must pay to exercise our right(s).
    You are correct. Speaking for Android apps...

    Neither Police Tape or Cop Recorder do real-time uploads, but Police Tape does go "invisible" once started...so if you were to show them your screen, there is no indication that a recording is taking place.

    However, Qik can do automatic uploads of audio and video to a pre-configured site in "the cloud" for later retrieval or sharing. Qik is a bit slower to start than the others, so I guess it is really a matter of how much time you have to prepare...
    Last edited by carolina guy; 01-04-2013 at 01:09 PM.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

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    It isn't ideal since I have to actually stop the recording to start an uploading, but it is the best way I have found to do it on Android. You need two applications to do this; a voice recorder of your choice (I use Easy Voice Recorder Pro) and DropSync. You will also need a dropbox account. Basically, this setup allows you to start and stop a recording. Once the recording is stopped, it is automatically uploaded to dropbox provided you have a data connection.

    A few problems I have experienced, if you have your phone in your pocket, expect a lot of static; especially when you are moving. Another problem would be your data connection; if you hardly have a signal, the upload is going to take a while. This can be somewhat remedied by selecting a lower recording quality so not as much data needs to be uploaded. And of course the final problem would be the fact that you have to actually stop the recording to initiate the upload.

    Total cost: about $10 for the pro version of both Voice Recorder Pro and DropSync.

    If anyone else has an alternative that can solve these shortcomings, I'd love to try it.

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    You don't need to inform LEO you are recording them in NC. Just make sure your voice can be heard somewhere in the recording, as Im sure they would try to say that since you aren't being recorded, you can't consent to said recording..unless you say something. Of course, IANAL.

    Since I am an amateur radio service operator, if worse comes to worse, Ill just inform the officer that the antennas on my vehicle are being used to broadcast/record our convo in real-time to a secure location.

  17. #17
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    just to let you guys know once more that wire tapping covers that wire tapping. that is a one party consent.

    public sounds and sights are just that. anything that can be seen or heard in public (open air) can be recorded

    if you want to err on the side of cation go ahead and inform someone they are being recorded, but the courts have decided you don't have to
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

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