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Thread: Great Traffic Stop Experience (if there is such a thing)

  1. #1
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    Great Traffic Stop Experience (if there is such a thing)

    It's been a while since I posted on here. Someone ticked me off, so I have just been a spectator of the forum who continues to OC in James City County and the peninsula. However, I break the silence (not that anyone cares) because this experience was just too positive not to share.

    Last night, my wife and I were headed to a dinner party with friends to watch the ball game last night. As we were travelling through Williamsburg city limits, I was caught going "a little" over the speed limit.

    As common procedure, I had both hands on the steering wheel and did not move until the officer tapped on my window. After rolling it down, the usual request: "License and registration please sir."

    My response was as such: "My driver's license is in my wallet. I have to reach past my pistol in order to get it out." My .357 is always located on my right hip.

    Officer: "Do you have a CHP?"

    Response: "I am carrying openly."

    Officer: "Okay."

    You won't believe what happened after that... a routine, boring traffic stop. The officer never mentioned the firearm again, nor did he even shine his flashlight in the direction of the firearm after I initially retrieved my wallet. He knocked 7 mph off of the ticket, we had a couple laughs, and off we went.

    I appreciate Officer Meth's (yes, that is his name) knowledge of VA handgun laws, and his respect and courtesy towards me in regards to those laws. Hopefully he will be a good ally in court when I go to beg for mercy before the judge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by godspel-13 View Post
    It's been a while since I posted on here. Someone ticked me off, so I have just been a spectator of the forum who continues to OC in James City County and the peninsula. However, I break the silence (not that anyone cares) because this experience was just too positive not to share.

    Last night, my wife and I were headed to a dinner party with friends to watch the ball game last night. As we were travelling through Williamsburg city limits, I was caught going "a little" over the speed limit.

    As common procedure, I had both hands on the steering wheel and did not move until the officer tapped on my window. After rolling it down, the usual request: "License and registration please sir."

    My response was as such: "My driver's license is in my wallet. I have to reach past my pistol in order to get it out." My .357 is always located on my right hip.

    Officer: "Do you have a CHP?"

    Response: "I am carrying openly."

    Officer: "Okay."

    You won't believe what happened after that... a routine, boring traffic stop. The officer never mentioned the firearm again, nor did he even shine his flashlight in the direction of the firearm after I initially retrieved my wallet. He knocked 7 mph off of the ticket, we had a couple laughs, and off we went.

    I appreciate Officer Meth's (yes, that is his name) knowledge of VA handgun laws, and his respect and courtesy towards me in regards to those laws. Hopefully he will be a good ally in court when I go to beg for mercy before the judge.
    Well, if we are going to have arbitrary limits on how fast we can move, I guess I'd rather have it go this way.

    One caution I would give readers is that a driver can't know whether it is a good cop or bad cop at inception, so there is always risk when notifying the cop. We've plenty of reports of guns being temporarily seized and the serial number run.

    Also, the experience of the OP proves the lie from all those cops who justify temporary gun seizures by saying drivers with guns are dangerous, including the US Supreme Court in PA vs Mimms. If all drivers with guns were dangerous, or even a significant number of drivers with guns, no cop would do what Officer Meth did. Cops would temporarily seize all guns every time.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Well, if we are going to have arbitrary limits on how fast we can move, I guess I'd rather have it go this way.

    One caution I would give readers is that a driver can't know whether it is a good cop or bad cop at inception, so there is always risk when notifying the cop. We've plenty of reports of guns being temporarily seized and the serial number run.

    Also, the experience of the OP proves the lie from all those cops who justify temporary gun seizures by saying drivers with guns are dangerous, including the US Supreme Court in PA vs Mimms. If all drivers with guns were dangerous, or even a significant number of drivers with guns, no cop would do what Officer Meth did. Cops would temporarily seize all guns every time.
    I agree with your statement regarding judge of character of a LEO. In light of said statement, should I refuse to hand my firearm over to a LEO that asks me to do so? I understand that it may create a sort of "situation" for the officer, but if he does not have a sufficient reason to detain my weapon, is it worth the fight? Are more officers just going to show up and forcibly take it from me to just to run serial numbers and ogle over my 125g hollow points?

    Which brings up another issue. My firearm is not registered to me. It was a gift from a great guy at my former church, who, as far as I know, was the only owner.

    For the record, I am a proponent of not offering identification if I am in public and a LEO sees my firearm and has no reason to detain me.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by godspel-13 View Post
    I agree with your statement regarding judge of character of a LEO. In light of said statement, should I refuse to hand my firearm over to a LEO that asks me to do so? I understand that it may create a sort of "situation" for the officer, but if he does not have a sufficient reason to detain my weapon, is it worth the fight? Are more officers just going to show up and forcibly take it from me to just to run serial numbers and ogle over my 125g hollow points?

    Which brings up another issue. My firearm is not registered to me. It was a gift from a great guy at my former church, who, as far as I know, was the only owner.

    For the record, I am a proponent of not offering identification if I am in public and a LEO sees my firearm and has no reason to detain me.
    There are two court cases that say a cop has the authority to temporarily seize your gun during a traffic stop. PA vs Mimms and US vs Baker. Both linked below.

    However, I wouldn't hand my gun to a cop. I'd say, "I won't resist you removing the gun from its holster." The idea being that having a gun in your hand can get you shot. Philip Van Cleave, president of VCDL, tells the story of a traffic stopped driver shot by the partner on the passenger side who saw the driver reaching into the glove box for a gun but not hearing the driver-side cop telling the driver to hand over the gun because of traffic or something.

    Separately, but related, you can always refuse consent while complying with a cop's demand. For example, if the cop demands you let him take your gun. The reason is explained in the video by FlexYourRights, linked below.

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ources-Here!!&
    Last edited by Citizen; 01-06-2013 at 05:53 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Glad for you......as it should be..

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    There are two court cases that say a cop has the authority to temporarily seize your gun during a traffic stop. PA vs Mimms and US vs Baker. Both linked below.

    However, I wouldn't hand my gun to a cop. I'd say, "I won't resist you removing the gun from its holster." The idea being that having a gun in your hand can get you shot. Philip Van Cleave, president of VCDL, tells the story of a traffic stopped driver shot by the partner on the passenger side who saw the driver reaching into the glove box for a gun but not hearing the driver-side cop telling the driver to hand over the gun because of traffic or something.

    Separately, but related, you can always refuse consent while complying with a cop's demand. For example, if the cop demands you let him take your gun. The reason is explained in the video by FlexYourRights, linked below.

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ources-Here!!&
    Thank you for the links, citizen. More tools for my toolbox so I do not give up my rights or have the violated with my own consent. Now excuse me, I have some more learning to do...

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    Good story and typical for the area. York, James City and Williamsburg have the most professional LEA's in the state. IMO.

    Cross the river and you get the other side of the coin.

    As to your other question/statement ...there is NO GUN REGISTRATION in Virginia. It isn't registered to anyone.

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    Regular Member USNA69's Avatar
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    Whenever I carry, I place my DL (and CHP, if necessary) in a shirt pocket.
    In any encounter where ID must be shown, my hands never have to be out of sight of the LEO.
    Even so, I would tell him that my DL is in my shirt breast pocket, and I would remove it very slowly.
    No need to make an already nervous LEO any more nervous.

    Of course, in the other shirt pocket is the Olympus DVR, capturing the encounter.

    However, I do need to move my registration out of my glove box to a more visible location (visor?) for the same reasons.
    Last edited by USNA69; 01-06-2013 at 08:18 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by USNA69 View Post
    Whenever I carry, I place my DL (and CHP, if necessary) in a shirt pocket.
    In any encounter where ID must be shown, my hands never have to be out of sight of the LEO.
    Even so, I would tell him that my DL is in my shirt breast pocket, and I would remove it very slowly.
    No need to make an already nervous LEO any more nervous.

    Of course, in the other shirt pocket is the Olympus DVR, capturing the encounter.

    However, I do need to move my registration out of my glove box to a more visible location (visor?) for the same reasons.
    Great idea! However, I am a man of routine to the point that I would lose my license in t minus 5 seconds. And I just don't feel comfortable making any moves after putting the car in park and placing both hands on the steering wheel. I do not want a gun pointed at me for any reason, even by a cop. I want to start out on his good side and finish that way, if possible. Heck, I got 7 mph knocked off for being polite.

  10. #10
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    Re: Great Traffic Stop Experience (if there is such a thing)

    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Good story and typical for the area. York, James City and Williamsburg have the most professional LEA's in the state. IMO.

    Cross the river and you get the other side of the coin.

    As to your other question/statement ...there is NO GUN REGISTRATION in Virginia. It isn't registered to anyone.
    Hey hey...what side of the water mister...

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by mpguy View Post
    Hey hey...what side of the water mister...

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
    The side that uses which instead of what.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  12. #12
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    Re: Great Traffic Stop Experience (if there is such a thing)

    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    The side that uses which instead of what.
    Lmao

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by godspel-13 View Post
    <snip> He knocked 7 mph off of the ticket, we had a couple laughs, and off we went.

    I appreciate Officer Meth's (yes, that is his name) knowledge of VA handgun laws, and his respect and courtesy towards me in regards to those laws. Hopefully he will be a good ally in court when I go to beg for mercy before the judge.
    How fast were you going?

    Sounds like the ideal stop to me. I am a advocate for posting positive (uneventful) encounters as well as negative encounters. Thanks for the post.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    How fast were you going?

    Sounds like the ideal stop to me. I am a advocate for posting positive (uneventful) encounters as well as negative encounters. Thanks for the post.
    I am embarrassed to say because I was going uncharacteristically fast. It was a commercial zone that dropped from 55 mph to 45 mph to 35 mph to 25 mph in the course of about a mile and half. The name of the road is Bypass Rd. I got clocked doing 42 mph.
    Last edited by godspel-13; 01-07-2013 at 07:16 PM.

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