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Thread: 2013 SB 0049 - Protect Personal Information Obtained From Pistol Registration

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    2013 SB 0049 - Protect Personal Information Obtained From Pistol Registration

    This bill would prevent someone from obtaining Personal Information from the existing MI Pistol Registration Processes and Database, which would prevent "Gun Owner Maps" from being created like just happened in NY:

    http://www.theverge.com/2013/1/14/38...p-for-burglary

    Bill Text at following link (additions in BOLD, removals in strikethrough): http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2013-SB-0049
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

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    Regular Member PDinDetroit's Avatar
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    Another story of a homeowner burglarized and firearms stolen after being listed on the "Gun Map" by a NY Newspaper.

    http://newyork.newsday.com/news/nati...-say-1.4463741
    Rights are like muscles. You must EXERCISE THEM to keep them from becoming atrophied.

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    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDinDetroit View Post
    This bill would prevent someone from obtaining Personal Information from the existing MI Pistol Registration Processes and Database, which would prevent "Gun Owner Maps" from being created like just happened in NY:

    http://www.theverge.com/2013/1/14/38...p-for-burglary

    Bill Text at following link (additions in BOLD, removals in strikethrough): http://legislature.mi.gov/doc.aspx?2013-SB-0049
    how about protect and destroy all registration information and never require another sovereign citizen to register a firearms with the government again.
    "If it ain't loaded and cocked it don't shoot." - Rooster Cogburn
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    Regular Member Ezerharden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smellslikemichigan View Post
    how about protect and destroy all registration information and never require another sovereign citizen to register a firearms with the government again.
    Great idea, now how to get that into law?
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    Regular Member Ezerharden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BoiledFrogs View Post
    Yep, pretty much sums it up don't it?
    Sorry, I was asking for serious answers, and ideas. I don't draft legislation but others here do.
    Want to keep informed of Open Carry events in your area? Go to www.miopencarry.org/update

    I carry a gun because a Police Officer is too heavy.

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    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Can we get confirmations from Michigan gun organizations that they will not allow criminalization of OC in PFZ's, or any other anti gun-rights compromises, in order to get this legislation passed?

    I am quite seriously asking for this. I am not being facetious.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    “He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.”--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    2013 SB 0049 - Protect Personal Information Obtained From Pistol Registration

    Quote Originally Posted by DanM View Post
    Can we get confirmations from Michigan gun organizations that they will not allow criminalization of OC in PFZ's, or any other anti gun-rights compromises, in order to get this legislation passed?

    I am quite seriously asking for this. I am not being facetious.
    Stop trolling.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

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    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    Stop trolling.
    The question is very relevant to each new proposed legislation since Michigan gun organizations established that they may compromise OC to get proposals passed.

    So, how is a very relevant question trolling? Michigan gun organizations brought this question upon themselves, with what they did on compromising to criminalize OC in PFZ's in the, thankfully, failed SB59. Don't shoot the questioner for asking the question they brought upon themselves.

    To all representatives of Michigan gun owner organizations authorized to answer: this, as demonstrated by your record with SB59, is now a relevant question. Just answer it.
    Last edited by DanM; 01-17-2013 at 08:06 PM.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    “He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.”--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    Regular Member Ezerharden's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanM View Post
    The question is very relevant to each new proposed legislation since Michigan gun organizations established that they may compromise OC to get proposals passed.

    So, how is a very relevant question trolling? Michigan gun organizations brought this question upon themselves, with what they did on compromising to criminalize OC in PFZ's in the, thankfully, failed SB59. Don't shoot the questioner for asking the question they brought upon themselves.

    To all representatives of Michigan gun owner organizations authorized to answer: this, as demonstrated by your record with SB59, is now a relevant question. Just answer it.
    Don't you think asking about sacrificing OC to pass a bill about information isn't very facetious? I mean you have asked the same identical question on every bill related thread. Maybe you should run for public office so you can define bills more to your liking.
    Want to keep informed of Open Carry events in your area? Go to www.miopencarry.org/update

    I carry a gun because a Police Officer is too heavy.

    For Drama free gun rights discussion, see http://forums.michiganopencarry.org/

  10. #10
    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ezerharden View Post
    Don't you think asking about sacrificing OC to pass a bill about information isn't very facetious? I mean you have asked the same identical question on every bill related thread. Maybe you should run for public office so you can define bills more to your liking.
    Ummm, Michigan gun orgs including MOC demonstrated they will compromise and criminalize some currently legal forms of OC. We're on an OC advocacy site, so my question about what Michigan gun orgs will stomach as far as compromise on OC for each proposed legislation is relevant.

    I don't have to be running for public office to ask the question. All I have to be is a concerned OC advocate.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    “He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.”--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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    Regular Member TheQ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanM View Post
    Ummm, Michigan gun orgs including MOC demonstrated they will compromise and criminalize some currently legal forms of OC. We're on an OC advocacy site, so my question about what Michigan gun orgs will stomach as far as compromise on OC for each proposed legislation is relevant.

    I don't have to be running for public office to ask the question. All I have to be is a concerned OC advocate.
    Good thing I'm not an "OC advocate". I'm just a good for nothing, compromising lobbyist. I know many that walked the great path before me like many of you on this site have never worked day and night to support a pro-gun bill that contains compromises...you've only worked for bills that....oh, wait. Nevermind.
    Last edited by TheQ; 01-17-2013 at 11:06 PM.
    Call for a cop, call for an ambulance, and call for a pizza. See who shows up first.

    I am not a lawyer (merely an omnipotent member of a continuum). The contents of this post are not a substitute for sound legal advice from a licensed attorney in your jurisdiction.

    Comments and views stated in my post are my own and do not necessarily represent the views of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. unless stated otherwise in the post.

  12. #12
    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanM View Post
    Can we get confirmations from Michigan gun organizations that they will not allow criminalization of OC in PFZ's, or any other anti gun-rights compromises, in order to get this legislation passed?
    Not allow? Only the legislature and governor can "not allow."
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
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    Regular Member griffin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DanM View Post
    Ummm, Michigan gun orgs including MOC demonstrated they will compromise and criminalize some currently legal forms of OC.
    What gun orgs, if any, are you a a member of: MOC, MGO, MCRGO, NRA, GOA?
    "If we lose freedom here, there's no place to escape to."
    "Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." – William F. Buckley
    "...go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains set lightly upon you; and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen." – Samuel Adams
    Wheels

  14. #14
    Regular Member Raggs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by griffin View Post
    What gun orgs, if any, are you a a member of: MOC, MGO, MCRGO, NRA, GOA?
    Not sure how that matters, does his opinion mean any more if he belongs to all of them, or less if he doesn't belong to any?
    My reasons to OC
    1. to raise awareness of the legality of open carry in Michigan
    2. To raise awareness that good people carry guns
    3. A deterrent to people so that I won't be targeted
    4. Because it's more comfortable than CC in most situations
    5. Because I can and want to
    6. Because it's perfectly legal
    7. Self defense

  15. #15
    Regular Member DanM's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheQ View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by DanM
    Ummm, Michigan gun orgs including MOC demonstrated they will compromise and criminalize some currently legal forms of OC. We're on an OC advocacy site, so my question about what Michigan gun orgs will stomach as far as compromise on OC for each proposed legislation is relevant.

    I don't have to be running for public office to ask the question. All I have to be is a concerned OC advocate.
    Good thing I'm not an "OC advocate". I'm just a good for nothing, compromising lobbyist. I know many that walked the great path before me like many of you on this site have never worked day and night to support a pro-gun bill that contains compromises...you've only worked for bills that....oh, wait. Nevermind.
    Phil, you do a lot of good work for OC in Michigan. Many, including me, highly appreciate your energy and efforts. But let's not get too far away from the relevant discussions in the thread. Some moderators here wrongfully close threads succumbing to "heckler's veto", rather than simply making the hecklers go away.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckler's_veto

    To me, you're not heckling, but some moderators here have vague behaviors on when they close down everyone's speech based on the off-topic reaction of what they may perceive as a heckler or two.
    Last edited by DanM; 01-18-2013 at 09:40 AM.
    "The principle of self-defense, even involving weapons and bloodshed, has never been condemned, even by Gandhi . . ."--Dr. Martin Luther King Jr

    “He who cannot protect himself or his nearest and dearest or their honor by non-violently facing death, may and ought to do so by violently dealing with the oppressor. He who can do neither of the two is a burden.”--M. K. Gandhi

    "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." --M. K. Gandhi

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