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What civil or criminal protections do I have

LOERetired

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[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]I just got around to researching the Wisconsin Castle Doctrine and realized that it only covers an actor in his or her dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]What civil and criminal protections do I have if I am at a gas station and a robber enters armed and attempts to rob the store putting the clerk and me and others at risk of bodily harm and I shoot him or her.

If this has been discussed before, please direct me to the postings.


Castle Doctrine

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/2011/related/acts/94.pdf
[/FONT]
 

LOERetired

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No protection outside of his or her dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Apparently, the current Wisconsin Castle Doctrine don't cover a person in any other place he or she has a right to be besides his or her dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business or the Wisconsin Doctrine would have stated the following which is what is included in the ALEC Model:

ALEC Model URL

http://alecexposed.org/w/images/7/7e/7J2-Castle_Doctrine_Act_Exposed.PDF[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]And [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]ALEC Model[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Castle Doctrine Act[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Summary[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]This act authorizes the use of force, including deadly force, against an intruder or[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]attacker in a dwelling, residence, or vehicle under specified circumstances.[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]It further creates a presumption that a reasonable fear of death or great bodily[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]harm exists under these specific circumstances, and declares that a person has no[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]force if the person is in a place where he or she has a right to be and the force is[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]necessary to prevent death, great bodily harm, or the commission of a forcible[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]felony.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Finally, the act provides immunity from civil prosecution or civil action for using[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]deadly force, defines the term “criminal prosecution,” and authorizes law[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]enforcement agencies to investigate the use of deadly force while prohibiting the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]agencies from arresting a person in these circumstances unless the agency[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]determines that there is probable cause that the force the person used was[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]unlawful.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Model Legislation[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Legislative Resolution and Intent[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]WHEREAS, the Legislature of [insert state/commonwealth name] finds that it is[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]proper for law-abiding people to protect themselves, their families, and others from[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]intruders and attackers without fear of prosecution or civil action from acting in[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]defense of the themselves and others; and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]WHEREAS, the “Castle Doctrine” is a common-law doctrine of ancient origins that[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]declares that a person’s home is his or her castle; and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]WHEREAS, [insert appropriate reference to the State/Commonwealth Constitution[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]that provides for the right of citizens to bear arms] guarantees the right of the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]people to keep and bear arms; and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]WHEREAS, the persons residing in or visiting this [state/commonwealth] have a[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]right remain unmolested within their homes or vehicles; and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]WHEREAS, no person or victim of crime should be required to surrender his or her[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]personal safety to a criminal, nor should a person or victim be required to[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]needlessly retreat in the face of intrusion or attack;[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]*This model is based upon Florida legislation enacted April 26, 2005.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]BE IT RESOLVED, the Legislature of [insert state/commonwealth name] hereby[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]enacts the following:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Section 1. {Home Protection, Use of Deadly Force, Presumption of Fear of Death[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]or Harm}[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]1. A person is presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another when using defensive force[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]that is intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm to another if:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]a. The person against whom the defensive force was used was in the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]process of unlawfully and forcefully entering, or had unlawfully or[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]forcefully entered, a dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle, or if that[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]person had removed or was attempting to remove another against that[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]person’s will from the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle; and[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]b. The person who uses defensive force knew or had reason to believe[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]that an unlawful and forcible entry or unlawful and forcible act was[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]occurring or had occurred.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]2. The presumption set forth in Subsection (1) does not apply if:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]a. The person against whom the defensive force is used has the right[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]to be in or is a lawful resident of the dwelling residence, or vehicle,[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]such as an owner, lessee, or titleholder, and there is not an injunction[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]for protection from domestic violence or a written pretrial supervision[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]order of no contact against that person; or[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]b. The person or persons sought to be removed is a child, grandchild, or[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]is otherwise in the lawful custody or under the lawful guardianship of,[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]the person against whom the defensive force is used; or[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]c. The person who uses defensive force is engaged in a criminal[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]activity or is using the dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle to[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]further a criminal activity; or[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]d. The person against whom defensive force is used is a law[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]enforcement officer, as defined in [insert appropriate reference to[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]state/commonwealth code, which defines the term “law enforcement[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]officer” or similar], who enters or attempts to enter a dwelling,[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]residence, or vehicle in the performance of his or her official duties and[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with applicable[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]law, or the person using force knew or reasonably should have known[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]that the person entering or attempting to enter was a law enforcement[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]officer.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]3. A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]bodily harm to himself or herself or another, or to prevent the commission of a[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]forcible felony.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]4. A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter a person’s[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle is presumed to be doing so with the intent[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]5. As used in this section, the term:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]a. “Dwelling” means a building or conveyance of any kind, including[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]tent, and is designed to be occupied by people lodging therein at night.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]b. “Residence” means a dwelling in which a person resides either[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]c. “Vehicle” means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Section 2. {Immunity from Criminal Prosecution and Civil Action}[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]1. As used in this subsection, the term “criminal prosecution” includes arresting,[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]detaining in custody, and charging or prosecuting the defendant.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]2. A person who uses force as permitted in Section (1) [and other state codes which[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]are affected/amended by this legislation and which refer to the use of force[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]including deadly force] is justified in using such force and is immune from criminal[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]prosecution and civil action for the use of such force, except when:[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]a. The person against whom force was used is a law enforcement[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]officer as defined in [insert appropriate reference to[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]state/commonwealth code, which defines the term “law enforcement[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]officer” or similar], who was acting in the performance of his or her[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]duties and the officer identified himself or herself in accordance with[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]applicable law; or[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]b. The person using force knew or reasonably should have known that[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]the person was a law enforcement officer.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]3. A law enforcement agency may use standard procedures for investigating the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]use of force as described in subsection (2), but the agency may not arrest the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]person for using force unless it determines that there is probable cause that the[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]force that was used was unlawful.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]4. The court shall award reasonable attorney’s fees, court costs, compensation for[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]loss of income, and all expenses incurred by the defendant in defense of any civil[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]action brought by a plaintiff if the court finds that the defendant is immune from[/FONT]​
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]prosecution as provided in subsection (2).[/FONT]





I just got around to researching the Wisconsin Castle Doctrine and realized that it only covers an actor in his or her dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.


What civil and criminal protections do I have if I am at a gas station and a robber enters armed and attempts to rob the store putting the clerk and me and others at risk of bodily harm and I shoot him or her.

If this has been discussed before, please direct me to the postings.


Castle Doctrine

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/2011/related/acts/94.pdf
 

MKEgal

Regular Member
Joined
Jan 8, 2010
Messages
4,383
Location
in front of my computer, WI
939.48 is only Castle Doctrine, not Stand Your Ground.
That's one thing that needs to be corrected. It does say that the court can't consider the possibility of retreat and must presume that the person thought the force used was necessary...
IF you're in one of those places
AND the criminal unlawfully and forcibly entered.

895.62 provides civil immunity also IF the criminal unlawfully and forcibly entered one of those places.

Several things I see need to be changed.
1) providing protection against criminal suits; if someone asserts a claim of self-defense, is put on trial, & the jury says it was self-defense, the gov't division responsible must reimburse all expenses, double, plus a $10,000 fine paid to the citizen for the stress & character slander. I'd like to see similar double jeopardy + fine for the civil suits.

2) as CD is expanded to SYG, expand the civil & criminal protection.

3) change the entry method to cover stealth, and specify that "forcibly" means the use of any force, however small, as in opening a window, door, screen, gate, etc. The WA county DA did a good job of this in the first home invasion shooting which could have been covered under CD, though he also said that simple self-defense applied.

Here's what UT uses:
[the entry is] "unlawful and is made or attempted by use of force, or in a violent and tumultuous manner, or surreptitiously or by stealth, or for the purpose of committing a felony"
In both WI & UT, burglary is a felony.

*****

http://docs.legis.wi.gov/statutes/statutes/939/III/48
939.48 (1m)
(ar) If an actor intentionally used force that was intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm, the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies:

1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring.

2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.
 

Interceptor_Knight

Regular Member
Joined
May 18, 2007
Messages
2,851
Location
Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA
What civil and criminal protections do I have if I am at a gas station and a robber enters armed and attempts to rob the store putting the clerk and me and others at risk of bodily harm and I s

You are privileged to use deadly force to defend yourself or a 3rd party from imminent danger of death or great bodily harm...
"Castle" doctrine does not apply but standard WI Self Defense does. "Castle" Doctrine is not a separate law. 939.48 covers all self defense using deadly force. There is simply a presumption that the force is reasonable under specific circumstances...
the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies:
1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring.
2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.
 

LOERetired

New member
Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
434
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Thanks

Thanks for the info


You are privileged to use deadly force to defend yourself or a 3rd party from imminent danger of death or great bodily harm...
"Castle" doctrine does not apply but standard WI Self Defense does. "Castle" Doctrine is not a separate law. 939.48 covers all self defense using deadly force. There is simply a presumption that the force is reasonable under specific circumstances...
 

LOERetired

New member
Joined
Mar 15, 2010
Messages
434
Location
, ,
Thanks

Thanks for the info



939.48 is only Castle Doctrine, not Stand Your Ground.
That's one thing that needs to be corrected. It does say that the court can't consider the possibility of retreat and must presume that the person thought the force used was necessary...
IF you're in one of those places
AND the criminal unlawfully and forcibly entered.

895.62 provides civil immunity also IF the criminal unlawfully and forcibly entered one of those places.

Several things I see need to be changed.
1) providing protection against criminal suits; if someone asserts a claim of self-defense, is put on trial, & the jury says it was self-defense, the gov't division responsible must reimburse all expenses, double, plus a $10,000 fine paid to the citizen for the stress & character slander. I'd like to see similar double jeopardy + fine for the civil suits.

2) as CD is expanded to SYG, expand the civil & criminal protection.

3) change the entry method to cover stealth, and specify that "forcibly" means the use of any force, however small, as in opening a window, door, screen, gate, etc. The WA county DA did a good job of this in the first home invasion shooting which could have been covered under CD, though he also said that simple self-defense applied.

Here's what UT uses:
[the entry is] "unlawful and is made or attempted by use of force, or in a violent and tumultuous manner, or surreptitiously or by stealth, or for the purpose of committing a felony"
In both WI & UT, burglary is a felony.

*****

http://docs.legis.wi.gov/statutes/statutes/939/III/48
939.48 (1m)
(ar) If an actor intentionally used force that was intended or likely to cause death or great bodily harm, the court may not consider whether the actor had an opportunity to flee or retreat before he or she used force and shall presume that the actor reasonably believed that the force was necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself if the actor makes such a claim under sub. (1) and either of the following applies:

1. The person against whom the force was used was in the process of unlawfully and forcibly entering the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that an unlawful and forcible entry was occurring.

2. The person against whom the force was used was in the actor's dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business after unlawfully and forcibly entering it, the actor was present in the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business, and the actor knew or reasonably believed that the person had unlawfully and forcibly entered the dwelling, motor vehicle, or place of business.
 
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