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Thread: My Libertarian viewpoint on the right to bear arms

  1. #1
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    My Libertarian viewpoint on the right to bear arms

    Here's the FUQ

    As a person supporting the Libertarian philosophy, I do not support the notion that I must be granted the governments permission to exercise my rights.
    Heres the link...http://www.lpwa.org/libertarian-view...n-legislation/
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  2. #2
    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Yep

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post

    Absolutely right.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    Frederic Bastiat's The Law should be required reading in schools. I think I had to read it in 7th grade (homeschooled).

    And yes, I'm with you also.

  5. #5
    Regular Member Freedom First's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    My Libertarian viewpoint on the right to bear arms
    ...Is the right one. Wish more people could/would pull their heads out, take a deep breath of Freedom, and then stand on the side of their pre-existing Rights. America would be a very different place.
    Freedom can never be lost, only given away by ignorance, by choice, or at the point of a gun. Here in America we can still choose.

    Freedom First 1775

    "I aim to misbehave..." Malcolm Reynolds

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    Are all libertarians so smart and handsome or pretty? I would say YES

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    Quote Originally Posted by thewise1 View Post
    Frederic Bastiat's The Law should be required reading in schools. I think I had to read it in 7th grade (homeschooled).

    And yes, I'm with you also.
    +1

    Just bought a copy the other day, along with some Hobbes, Spooner, Locke, Thoreau and Rousseau. Wish it had been a part of my home school curriculum.

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    I like it! I agree the Bastiat quote is a nice touch.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Regular Member liberty404's Avatar
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    agree

    Sudden, I agree with you. Our rights are re-iterated by the constitution, but derive from our status as human beings. A government might refuse to recognize a person's rights, but that refusal does not abolish them.

    The philosophical and ethical foundation of rights is very important. Also important is clarity on exactly what are rights and what declarations are not rights. The term "human rights" is mis-used by many. I suggest reading the essay "Man's Rights" by Ayn Rand, found in her book "Capitalism, the Unknown Ideal". That essay clarifys the issues and makes a principled defense.

    My opinion is that the defenders of our right to self defense and to the tools of self defense have succeeded while other liberties have been infringed in the past two decades because the second amendment advocates have based the arguments on ethical principles.
    Don't make me hungry, you won't like me when I'm hungry.

  10. #10
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Thank you guys means a lot!
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    YEP

    Now we have our work cut out for us, we have to undo 75 years, give or take, of public education and government indoctrination into the big brother club. This is one of the reasons I started to OC.

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    Good one.

    Here's another classic:

    Every man, woman, and responsible child has an unalienable individual, civil, Constitutional, and human right to obtain, own, and carry, openly or concealed, any weapon -- rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything -- any time, any place, without asking anyone's permission.

    Someday to demonstrate that principle -- before I'm lying on my deathbed in a hospital with green plastic tubes up my nose, before arthritis sets in and I have to do it on crutches -- I intend to walk the length of Manhattan Island with a handgun openly on my hip, unmolested by any freelance or official parasite.


    The rest: http://www.lneilsmith.org/atlanta.html

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Libertarian is quite Utopian...isn't it.

    Libertarianism, like many other 'isms', read well on paper, look fantastic in the mental construct, but aren't practical in application.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    I don't know if I would agree. I don't think we have ever really tried it fully.
    IBTL

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    Regular Member Freedom1Man's Avatar
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    FB Share

    Shared it, loved it.
    Provision for free medical attendance and nursing, for clothing, for food, for housing, for the education of children, and a hundred other matters, might with equal propriety be proposed as tending to relieve the employee of mental strain and worry. --- These matters obviously lie outside the orbit of congressional power. (Railroad Retirement Board v Alton Railroad)

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    Regular Member BigDeeeeeeee's Avatar
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    Well done.
    Darren

    Pass the popcorn

  17. #17
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Thanks again you guys, I know some of what I say will be like a burr in the shoe of some of those who proscribe to major party politics....good, do something about it!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    YEP

    Now we have our work cut out for us, we have to undo 75 years, give or take, of public education and government indoctrination into the big brother club. This is one of the reasons I started to OC.
    Me too, and it won't be done incrementally there is going to be a major shift coming one way or the other, hopefully because of actions like yours in OCing people come down on the liberty side.

    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    Good one.

    Here's another classic:

    Every man, woman, and responsible child has an unalienable individual, civil, Constitutional, and human right to obtain, own, and carry, openly or concealed, any weapon -- rifle, shotgun, handgun, machinegun, anything -- any time, any place, without asking anyone's permission.

    Someday to demonstrate that principle -- before I'm lying on my deathbed in a hospital with green plastic tubes up my nose, before arthritis sets in and I have to do it on crutches -- I intend to walk the length of Manhattan Island with a handgun openly on my hip, unmolested by any freelance or official parasite.


    The rest: http://www.lneilsmith.org/atlanta.html
    Very nice!

    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Libertarian is quite Utopian...isn't it.

    Libertarianism, like many other 'isms', read well on paper, look fantastic in the mental construct, but aren't practical in application.
    Nope nothing Utopic about it, just more realistic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom1Man View Post
    Shared it, loved it.
    Please all who can share it, associate or volunteer with your local libertarian group if you don't have one, form one. We are a group of individuals with a wide range perspectives, the main focus being that coercion by political force is wrong.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  18. #18
    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    I agree 100%. Little by little our rights and freedoms are being lost. THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BARE ARMS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.what part of that sentence is not clear.

  19. #19
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conandan View Post
    I agree 100%. Little by little our rights and freedoms are being lost. THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO KEEP AND BARE ARMS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.what part of that sentence is not clear.
    I believe it is very clear, and why courts have taken so long to make any rulings on it, it is very hard to construe any other meanings.

    The courts have spent much of their history eroding the protections for us against government as spelled out in the constitution, they have done this by creatively twisting the meanings, redefining words or out right ignoring original intent, very hard to do with a one sentence, plainly worded amendment.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  20. #20
    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    Let me ask you this gunner. With the way government has acted the last few decades and the current atmosphere in our judicial system do you think we are able to change anything. Are we to far down the road to turn back. Have really started paying attention the last few years and the more I learn and know about what's going on it infuriates me. Every one says vote them out put in people who share our ideals. But as soon as they get in to office they do not uphold the principals they were elected for. It seems like we are talking in circles same actions expecting a different response. Its that insanity.

    I do support your work and what you are trying to do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    Libertarianism, like many other 'isms', read well on paper, look fantastic in the mental construct, but aren't practical in application.
    You mean like lesbianism?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    You mean like lesbianism?
    Kaaaaa--POW that's is a good one ... one has to admit

    others would say "bad taste" but hey I like Godfrey jokes

  23. #23
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Kaaaaa--POW that's is a good one ... one has to admit

    others would say "bad taste" but hey I like Godfrey jokes
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    SNIP Nope nothing Utopic about [lbertarianism]...
    Yeah, I'll say.

    Anybody who's actually read Utopia by Thomas More would know that.
    Last edited by Citizen; 02-26-2013 at 10:13 PM.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    It was the other guy Grapeshot .... I said it was in bad taste ...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7ict...294B54&index=0

    Better taste?

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