Check this out

Not totally OC but good for the BS we are having to dealwith


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=b2Upjn5DR0o

It's relevant. Good link, thanks!

Really good video. They make a fantastic point with the magazine demonstrations. Also, I love the 1911 at the end

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Some of the comments are just crazy.
Check out this little nugget of knowledge.
Excerpt from YouTube comments:
Azimaet0 15 hours ago

The fact that you stated "Shouldn't we give law enforcement every opportunity to take these maniacs down?" is a sure sign that you are not willing to risk your own life to protect not only your own right to live but as well as protecting others. On another note, it is ILLEGAL for citizens to carry firearms with or without a concealed permit in designated federal areas (in other words Giffords being a federal representative means where ever she was is considered federal ground.)
· in reply to Rebel Phoenix


That is the kind of thing that drives me up the wall. People making stuff up or running with something they heard once.

decklin said:

Some of the comments are just crazy.
Check out this little nugget of knowledge.
Excerpt from YouTube comments:
Azimaet0 15 hours ago

The fact that you stated "Shouldn't we give law enforcement every opportunity to take these maniacs down?" is a sure sign that you are not willing to risk your own life to protect not only your own right to live but as well as protecting others. On another note, it is ILLEGAL for citizens to carry firearms with or without a concealed permit in designated federal areas (in other words Giffords being a federal representative means where ever she was is considered federal ground.)
· in reply to Rebel Phoenix


That is the kind of thing that drives me up the wall. People making stuff up or running with something they heard once.

Click to expand...

You know what they say, "You can't fix stupid"

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This video is clearly demonstrates a desire outcome.

Take time to look at the rate of fire by the man in the video which was very slow rate to a deliberate faster rate with 3-10rd magazines and the rate of fire was changed during the 6-5rd mags and then jump to the end where he fired the 1911 with 3-7rd mags and look at the rate of fire! Ridiculous

Lets not stoop to what he Anti's do to try and gather support.

Hmmm I dont agree

BigDave said:

This video is clearly demonstrates a desire outcome.

Take time to look at the rate of fire by the man in the video which was very slow rate to a deliberate faster rate with 3-10rd magazines and the rate of fire was changed during the 6-5rd mags and then jump to the end where he fired the 1911 with 3-7rd mags and look at the rate of fire! Ridiculous

Lets not stoop to what he Anti's do to try and gather support.

Click to expand...

I dont believe a Sherriff has to stoop to anything. I think it was a good video showing that mag size dosent make that dramatic of a difference.
Why do some people have to find bad in everything. He is trying to support us.

TheGunMan said:

I dont believe a Sherriff has to stoop to anything. I think it was a good video showing that mag size dosent make that dramatic of a difference.
Why do some people have to find bad in everything. He is trying to support us.

Click to expand...

And I cannot believe people are so stupid to buy into this video, clearly altered rate of fire for a desire result.
He is not actually trying to support anyone, is this flawed video.

When it comes down to it, smaller magazine size will have little effect on the out come do to the response time for law enforcement to arrive and the shooting is done.

It is not about finding the bad it is supporting the truth and this video provide it.

Take a few moments and watch it again, from the first demo with 1 mag of 20rds to the end with the model 1911 and 3 mags with 7rds, note how much a higher rate of fire from the two! Dramatically different.

The variance in the rate of fire is pretty obvious I have to admit.

So much so, and so variant, I think it shows quite a natural flow in the firing of a firearm, when its at the same target, in quick succession. Why wouldn't someone speed up after firing multiple rounds from the same gun, at the same fixed targets and range? They might have been better served by using a larger sample size of shooters, and switching shooters for each drill.

I don't think the video "debunks" quite as much as some might hope, but at the same time, its also quite obvious to me how little of an dramatic effect reloading has on the entire sequence of events.

The fact is, unless a shooter corners the right person who doesn't freeze in the face of certain death, the shooter places himself in the middle of his targets leaving them little choice but to "try or die" (i.e. Loughner) or the opportunity presents itself to other brave souls willing to take the chance who MAY have been safe otherwise, no one that's unarmed is going to intervene to stop an active shooter regardless if the shooter is reloading or not.

For most observing, a reload will happen so quickly that the brain will hardly get the chance to register the act before its done, especially in an active shooter situation.

This is to say nothing of what an unarmed persons chances would be to intervene when there is more than one shooter (i.e. Columbine) or the shooter has more than one ready firearm (i.e. Aurora)

The video is interesting, but highly open to interpretation based upon the viewers own experience, and agenda.

It is not, as some have attempted to make it out, the end all be all.

Jim's results are obviously invalid, but Christy seemed to maintain a pretty steady rate of fire, and her lesser experience really helps prove the core point. It is just unfortunate that Jim's results will give Anti's a reason to dismiss the entire video (as we can see people here doing already!)

I agree on the rate of fire issue. It's a shame because it is otherwise a very good video.

I also noticed that they called us Civilians, when the correct term would be Citizens.

Both shooters are counting their rounds very carefully in order to prevent slide lock- probably to speed their reload times. It's unrealistic to expect a mass murderer to count the rounds and reload while the last round is still in the chamber.

The faults of this video notwithstanding, it makes a good point in the debate. Magazine size is irrelevant- to say that victims will jump up and attack a shooter during a reload is stupid. It would require that they be watching the shooter (from cover) carefully enough to be able to tell the difference between the shooter pausing (to get a better grip, to look for another victim, etc) and the shooter reloading.

When it comes down to it, reloads do take time and more magazines will add up to additional time, though the time added by using lower capacity magazines will not be enough to stop a threat when depending on law enforcement to arrive.
Someone being armed when and where a threat presents itself, provides the only chance to stop a deadly threat.

Wow!

TheGunMan said:

Not totally OC but good for the BS we are having to dealwith


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=b2Upjn5DR0o

Click to expand...

Thanks for sharing this! I opening to watch and educational for myself as well!

Yes and no..

BigDave said:

This video is clearly demonstrates a desire outcome.

Take time to look at the rate of fire by the man in the video which was very slow rate to a deliberate faster rate with 3-10rd magazines and the rate of fire was changed during the 6-5rd mags and then jump to the end where he fired the 1911 with 3-7rd mags and look at the rate of fire! Ridiculous

Lets not stoop to what he Anti's do to try and gather support.

Click to expand...

While I agree that the "rate of fire" does speed up as he moves to smaller magazines, let's not lose site of what is really interesting: that smaller magazines do not create "enough" time gap between reloads to necessarily stop the shooter. While it "may" provide some relief in time, I would suggest that the resulting gap is negligible.

well said Big Dave!

BigDave said:

When it comes down to it, reloads do take time and more magazines will add up to additional time, though the time added by using lower capacity magazines will not be enough to stop a threat when depending on law enforcement to arrive.
Someone being armed when and where a threat presents itself, provides the only chance to stop a deadly threat.

Click to expand...

Totally agree!

BigDave said:

When it comes down to it, reloads do take time and more magazines will add up to additional time, though the time added by using lower capacity magazines will not be enough to stop a threat when depending on law enforcement to arrive.
Someone being armed when and where a threat presents itself, provides the only chance to stop a deadly threat.

Click to expand...

+1 Well said.........................Don't get used to it LOL