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NRA and open carry

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
I'm saying your statement that the NRA does nothing for the Second Amendment is nonsense.

They do a lot for the Second Amendment. They just do it inadvertently because they are working for what they think the Second Amendment is, which it isn't.

Licensed concealed carry, hunting, sport shooting, etc. are NOT the 2A.

Unfettered possession and unlicensed carry are. The NRA is not fighting directly for them. However, in the process of fighting for the things it does support, it ends up supporting some things that actually help the fight to restore the 2A
 

Q-Tip

Regular Member
Joined
Aug 5, 2010
Messages
102
Location
Mississippi/Tennessee
I do wish they would support all of the 2A, but I was encouraged to see their firm stance against background checks, mag limits, etc., on this last go 'round.
 

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
There is no "all of the 2A." There is only one part. There is no "I support this part of the 2A, but not that."

The problem is that the NRA is supporting what it thinks is the 2A, not what the 2A actually is.

That kind of thinking does some good, but it also does a lot of harm.
 

ron73440

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 3, 2013
Messages
474
Location
Suffolk VA
There is no "all of the 2A." There is only one part. There is no "I support this part of the 2A, but not that."

The problem is that the NRA is supporting what it thinks is the 2A, not what the 2A actually is.

That kind of thinking does some good, but it also does a lot of harm.

You don't get it, the 2A only either covers weapons in use in 1789 or for hunting only. After all, who needs an AR-10 to go hunting? (may not need one, but sure want one) SARC OFF

I wish there were groups that supported the whole thing. Maybe VCDL qualifies?
 

wrearick

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
650
Location
Virginia Beach, Va.
You don't get it, the 2A only either covers weapons in use in 1789 or for hunting only. ....

That is not how I understand the 2A but am willing to be admit my understanding may be flawed. Can you provide any reference or documentation to support your understanding the it only applied to weapons in existance the year the bill was signed or for hunting only?

Thanks,
 

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
He was being sarcastic.

What the RKBA has historically (and this predates firearms, so clearly the definition of "arms" is not locked into a specific technology, just like Freedom of Speech is not so locked) covered arms that one could use for personal reasons (self-defense, hunting, sport) but could also, in a pinch, use as one's personal military weapon. IMO, today's analogs include rifles, shotguns, pistols, revolvers, knives, and the like.
 

Elm Creek Smith

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2013
Messages
204
Location
In the county.
I have a lot of respect for Todd. He never explained why he told me he would kill any open carry legislation that I would have put forward at the time. I am hoping he won't oppose an open carry on a FOID card bill that I intend to put forward after all this concealed carry mess is finished.

I hope it was just timing in the past and not a blatantly anti open carry attitude that some other 2A groups in Illinois seem to have.



Carthago Delenda Est

I don't have a dog in this fight, but from what I've read and heard from people who were there the NRA wasn't willing to settle for a carry law of any sort that left out Chicago or any other "home rule" city/county in the state. Here in Oklahoma, the NRA supported our concealed carry effort as a first step from no provision to carry at all. Once it became clear that concealed carry licensees weren't a problem, we were able to add open carry to our handgun licenses. Would we have preferred to get "constitutional carry?" You bet. Would I give up the open carry option to hold out for "constitutional carry?" Not a chance.

I am a member of the National Rifle Association because right now they are the most effective voice of gun owners in the United States. Does that mean I agree with everything they do? Nope. I am also a member of other, less "mainstream" gun rights organizations. Bad mouthing the NRA just gives the disarmanuts ammunition (NPI) in their fight against gun rights. Savvy?

ECS
 

WalkingWolf

Regular Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2011
Messages
11,930
Location
North Carolina
NRA helped write and pass both the NFA and the GCA, they were behind gun control. They to this day sell gun control, and they package it up as rights. If there ever was a landmark decision by SCOTUS to remove all gun control NRA would go bankrupt overnight.

You people are being played like a Stradivarius...
 

JmE

Regular Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2007
Messages
358
Location
, ,
Yep. They are the most effective voice for licensing the RKBA.

Phooey.

If you license it, it ain't a right.
So far I haven't had to comment as you've said it all for me. Thanks! :)

Just dropping in an atta boy and amen...
 

davidmcbeth

Banned
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
16,167
Location
earth's crust
NRA helped write and pass both the NFA and the GCA, they were behind gun control. They to this day sell gun control, and they package it up as rights. If there ever was a landmark decision by SCOTUS to remove all gun control NRA would go bankrupt overnight.

You people are being played like a Stradivarius...

The NRA is the largest private gun control organization ...
 

Logan 5

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
696
Location
Utah
I'm a lifer with GOA and JPFO for a reason. NRA, I used to have a lifetime membership with them, but somehow for some reason that disappeared. I really knew nothing of it discontinuing until I needed something from them. I'm not a demanding member, really. But a paid membership should be honored.
 

eye95

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2010
Messages
13,524
Location
Fairborn, Ohio, USA
I'm a lifer with GOA and JPFO for a reason. NRA, I used to have a lifetime membership with them, but somehow for some reason that disappeared. I really knew nothing of it discontinuing until I needed something from them. I'm not a demanding member, really. But a paid membership should be honored.

I would see this as an opportunity to get my money back. I wouldn't want the lifetime membership. I'd want the money. Call them, point out that they breached the contract that is your lifetime membership, and ask for a refund. If you do this, let us know how it goes.
 

Logan 5

Regular Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
696
Location
Utah
I thought so too, Eye. I'd rather have the lifer instead, but they don't even have me on record as any kind of member. I checked back in '06 when I started questioning my memberships. NRA has no record of me whatsoever. I dunno. My momma bought me the membership back when I was 12. That was over 30 years ago.

I've heard of that happening to other members as well.
 

Thundar

Regular Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2007
Messages
4,946
Location
Newport News, Virginia, USA
VCDL has a long way to go

I wish there were groups that supported the whole thing. Maybe VCDL qualifies?

My post is not meant to disparage VCDL, but only to give an honest OC appraisal based upon many years of OC activism in the COmmonwealth of Virginia. VCDL is alot better than the NRA, but it is at best agnostic, and often pejorative toward open carry.

VCDL Open Carry: Yes most VCDL members do open carry at public meetings. This has been a quite effective tactic, but for many this tactic is for show and not a way of everyday life for them.

VCDL History on Gun Rights: If you go back and look at their legislative history site you will find that for the lasdt four years their strongly support items were, for the most part P4P. What you will also find, which is most telling, is that constitutional carry was something that they only supported (not strongly support). VCDL has squandered the political opportunity with a terrible legislative agenda over the last 5 years. No firearms freedom act, no constitutional carry, no state agency pre-emption! No serious effort at any of the real "gun rights" issues left for this state. All we have are numerous P4P and C2I2 enhancements.

Pattern Dynamic: CCers get what they want, then leave OC ers holding the bag. Great team players when we help them with a CC score but not so much when we push an OC agenda item. This is the pattern in many places, not just the Commonwealth of Virginia.

VCDL Link: http://www2.vcdl.org/webapps/vcdl/2013leg.html
 
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