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Thread: Obvious and non obvious ways to spot Highwaymen

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    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Obvious and non obvious ways to spot Highwaymen

    http://ericpetersautos.com/2013/03/18/know-your-cop/

    I've been noticing more and more that highwaymen are using unmarked vehicles to grab more cash for their employers. I wonder if we'll end up like the former Soviet countries were they all wear plain clothes and drive ordinary cars.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    One of the things citizens can do to discourage "unmarked" LE units is to not pull over for them. This. of course, depends on the state. In my state of La., there are requirements for police vehicles...

    Flight from an officer; aggravated flight from an officer

    A. No driver of a motor vehicle or operator of a watercraft shall intentionally refuse to bring a vehicle or watercraft to a stop knowing that he has been given a visual and audible signal to stop by a police officer when the officer has reasonable grounds to believe that the driver has committed an offense. The signal shall be given by an emergency light and a siren on a vehicle marked as a police vehicle or marked police watercraft.

    If a vehicle in LA. is not marked "POLICE" then there is no requirement to stop until such time as a marked unit appears.
    I don't pull over for unmarked vehicles.

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    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by georg jetson View Post
    One of the things citizens can do to discourage "unmarked" LE units is to not pull over for them. This. of course, depends on the state. In my state of La., there are requirements for police vehicles...

    Flight from an officer; aggravated flight from an officer

    A. No driver of a motor vehicle or operator of a watercraft shall intentionally refuse to bring a vehicle or watercraft to a stop knowing that he has been given a visual and audible signal to stop by a police officer when the officer has reasonable grounds to believe that the driver has committed an offense. The signal shall be given by an emergency light and a siren on a vehicle marked as a police vehicle or marked police watercraft.

    If a vehicle in LA. is not marked "POLICE" then there is no requirement to stop until such time as a marked unit appears.
    I don't pull over for unmarked vehicles.
    That's a good idea, reminds me I have to look up the law in Fl. I was pulled over by a Tahoe on I-95 in South Carolina in the summer of 2010. They conducted an illegal search without my consent of my rental car. I didn't know the law, so I pulled over.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    That's a good idea, reminds me I have to look up the law in Fl. I was pulled over by a Tahoe on I-95 in South Carolina in the summer of 2010. They conducted an illegal search without my consent of my rental car. I didn't know the law, so I pulled over.
    In the case where the unmarked is actually a cop, remeber to obey all traffic regs while he follows you. Many times a marked unit will be sent... pull over immediately once you see the marked unit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    I was pulled over by a Tahoe on I-95 in South Carolina in the summer of 2010. ... I didn't know the law, so I pulled over.
    As best as I can tell, in SC notice by lights and siren is sufficient for a traffic stop.

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    Check to see if it lawful in your jurisdictions to continue to drive until you get to police station or to a more "safe" location. Folks pretending to be cops and stopping folks on the highway have prompted some places to consider such laws.

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    SECTION 56-5-590. Stop.

    "Stop," when required, means complete cessation from movement.

    SECTION 56-5-750. Failure to stop motor vehicle when signaled by law-enforcement vehicle.

    (A) In the absence of mitigating circumstances, it is unlawful for a motor vehicle driver, while driving on a road, street, or highway of the State, to fail to stop when signaled by a law enforcement vehicle by means of a siren or flashing light. An attempt to increase the speed of a vehicle or in other manner avoid the pursuing law enforcement vehicle when signaled by a siren or flashing light is prima facie evidence of a violation of this section. Failure to see the flashing light or hear the siren does not excuse a failure to stop when the distance between the vehicles and other road conditions are such that it would be reasonable for a driver to hear or see the signals from the law enforcement vehicle.
    http://www.scstatehouse.gov/code/t56c005.php
    Last edited by Nightmare; 03-20-2013 at 01:48 PM.

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    Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings, Willie Nelson, and Kris Kristofferson.....Highwaymen.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Obvious and non obvious ways to spot Highwaymen

    Quote Originally Posted by OC for ME View Post
    Johnny Cash, Waylon Jennings, Willie Nelson, and Kris Kristofferson.....Highwaymen.
    +1 Waiting for Willie and Kris to pull me over


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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    http://ericpetersautos.com/2013/03/18/know-your-cop/

    I've been noticing more and more that highwaymen are using unmarked vehicles to grab more cash for their employers. I wonder if we'll end up like the former Soviet countries were they all wear plain clothes and drive ordinary cars.
    Nice, very nice.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

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    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    One commenter at the linked website had an obvious idea I didn't think of, drive by your local [police department] and see what kinds of unmarked vehicles they have. Won't help you on a road trip, but it may be somewhat useful.

    COMMENT EDITED BY ADMINISTRATOR: LEO bashing
    Last edited by John Pierce; 03-21-2013 at 01:15 PM.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    http://www.scstatehouse.gov/code/t56c005.php
    SECTION 56-5-590. Stop.

    "Stop," when required, means complete cessation from movement.

    SECTION 56-5-750. Failure to stop motor vehicle when signaled by law-enforcement vehicle.

    (A) In the absence of mitigating circumstances, it is unlawful for a motor vehicle driver, while driving on a road, street, or highway of the State, to fail to stop when signaled by a law enforcement vehicle by means of a siren or flashing light.
    You highlighted the wrong part. Blue light bandits have flashing lights too.

    Here's the important part: "(A) In the absence of mitigating circumstances, it is unlawful for a motor vehicle driver, while driving on a road, street, or highway of the State, to fail to stop when signaled by a law enforcement vehicle by means of a siren or flashing light."

    I doubt there's a state in the union that hasn't issued warnings about blue light rapists, where police advice people to drive to a well lighted location before stopping.

    I'm a pretty big guy and well armed, but I would never pull over for an unmarked vehicle.

    I've never had one make the attempt, but the closest was a "low profile" Arkansas State Police car. These have no visible lights, and are only marked on the right front fender and passenger door. I was on the interstate when I noticed a car pacing me in the left lane; I glanced over and see two troopers in full uniform, including Smokey Bear hats, looking directly at me. As soon as I acknowledged them, they dropped behind me and hit the (hidden) blue flashers. Of course I pulled over, because they made it obvious that they weren't just some silver Crown Vic with lights behind the grill.
    Last edited by KBCraig; 03-22-2013 at 01:51 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    You highlighted the wrong part. Blue light bandits have flashing lights too.
    Only 'wrong' for not supporting your point. My point, and the law (SECTION 56-5-750), is that lights or siren is sufficient for a lawful stop in South Carolina. I would loove to see a contradictory citation to SC law.
    Last edited by Nightmare; 03-22-2013 at 07:41 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Only 'wrong' for not supporting your point. My point, and the law (SECTION 56-5-750), is that lights or siren is sufficient for a lawful stop in South Carolina. I would loove to see a contradictory citation to SC law.
    But ONLY "while driving on a road, street, or highway of the State"--- So what about pedestrians, they are NOT DRIVING A MOTOR VEHICLE? What about those NOT driving on a road, street, or highway of the state"? So, if in a parking lot on PRIVATE property it is NOT a violation of this law to not stop.

    RIGHTS don't exist without RESPONSIBILITY!
    If one is not willing to stand for his rights, he doesn't have any Rights.
    I will strive to stand for the rights of ANY person, even those folks with whom I disagree!
    As said by SVG--- "I am not anti-COP, I am PRO-Citizen" and I'll add, PRO-Constitution.
    If the above makes me a RADICAL or EXTREME--- So be it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeSparky View Post
    But ONLY "while driving on a road, street, or highway of the State"--- So what about pedestrians, they are NOT DRIVING A MOTOR VEHICLE? What about those NOT driving on a road, street, or highway of the state"? So, if in a parking lot on PRIVATE property it is NOT a violation of this law to not stop.
    That is, on information and belief, correct. Signs at the entrances of parking lots asserting "police have jurisdiction" are common in South Carolina.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Only 'wrong' for not supporting your point. My point, and the law (SECTION 56-5-750), is that lights or siren is sufficient for a lawful stop in South Carolina. I would loove to see a contradictory citation to SC law.
    Sufficient for a stop by a law enforcement vehicle.

    It is an important distinction.

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    Quote Originally Posted by KBCraig View Post
    Sufficient for a stop by a law enforcement vehicle.

    It is an important distinction.
    Yea, but if you fail to pull over and it turns out that it IS a law enforcement vehicle, then you broke the law.

    It is only legal to not pull over if it isn't a LEV that is flashing the lights and sirens.

    So it isn't an important distinction for this thread's discussion.
    No man alive can beat me in a fair fight: It's not fair to chase a man down and beat him.

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HROig...layer_embedded

    The link is to a video of a hero intentionally causing a hit and run. I've noticed lots of heroes pulling people over with their cars nearly on the road, sometimes on the interstate, don't understand it.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HROig...layer_embedded

    The link is to a video of a hero intentionally causing a hit and run. I've noticed lots of heroes pulling people over with their cars nearly on the road, sometimes on the interstate, don't understand it.
    Absent extenuating circumstances this particular NC OEO in SC per the linked video audio track is nothing but a tool and he deserves to have the footage sent to his agency will all identifying information. And he also deserves a couple of citations... and not one for good behavior!

    OH, Yeah, the extenuating circumstances would have included ACTIVE EMERGENCY LIGHTING IN USE!
    RIGHTS don't exist without RESPONSIBILITY!
    If one is not willing to stand for his rights, he doesn't have any Rights.
    I will strive to stand for the rights of ANY person, even those folks with whom I disagree!
    As said by SVG--- "I am not anti-COP, I am PRO-Citizen" and I'll add, PRO-Constitution.
    If the above makes me a RADICAL or EXTREME--- So be it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HROig...layer_embedded

    The link is to a video of a hero intentionally causing a hit and run. I've noticed lots of heroes pulling people over with their cars nearly on the road, sometimes on the interstate, don't understand it.
    The cop was following too closely ... hehehehe

    "what a dick" ....

    How many times has a cop pulled up to your rear bumper -- you go faster and then he pulls you over ....

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    How many times has a cop pulled up to your rear bumper -- you go faster and then he pulls you over ....
    Never. I had a perfect solution for tailgaiters; slow, signal, search for safe pull-over and stop. You must come drive Calif. SR Highway 17 - I don't anymore. Summit Road is most direct way to my neighborhood.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Never. I had a perfect solution for tailgaiters; slow, signal, search for safe pull-over and stop.
    Damn right. Slow down enough that if they wreck into you neither you nor them would have permeant problems down the road. Usually they get the hint and back off so you can safely resume speed.
    No man alive can beat me in a fair fight: It's not fair to chase a man down and beat him.

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