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Thread: Clarion Ledger - Statute clarifies that open carry is legal in Mississippi

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    Clarion Ledger - Statute clarifies that open carry is legal in Mississippi

    http://www.clarionledger.com/article...nclick_check=1

    SNIP


    Iíll say it again: House Bill 2, signed into law by the governor, allows a Mississippian, with or without a permit, to strap on a pistol and stroll about in public.

    That fact appears to now be dawning on some folks, including law enforcement and even some lawmakers who passed the bill, which becomes law July 1.

    The new law defines concealed carry, saying a gun doesnít have to be fully concealed as long as itís in a proper holster. But it also states that openly carrying is allowed. A permit is required only for concealed carry, which no longer has to be very concealed.

    . . .

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    From the article...

    "But he remains adamant that openly carrying a firearm was already allowed under Mississippiís constitution ó his law just makes it crystal clear"

    Can we finally get OCDO's map corrected?

    Link to the first thread mentioning this in January...
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...-other-changes

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    Regular Member Eeyore's Avatar
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    Question Implications of the new wording

    I think it's pretty clear that open carry will no longer be impossible (it was never technically illegal) after 1 July 13. What I've been wondering about is this: what (if any) places are off-limits for open carry after 1 July?

    The columnist at the Clarion-Ledger seems to think so, but as far as I know, all the off-limits places are defined in ß45-9-101, which is titled "License to carry stun gun, concealed pistol or revolver." Paragraph (13) starts "No license issued pursuant to this section shall authorize any person to carry a stun gun, concealed pistol or revolver into ...." and proceeds to list the restricted places. OK, so no concealed carry in those places. But since open carry now requires no license, can these restrictions apply to open carriers? I'm thinking the answer is "no," and the police chief quoted in the article seems to think so as well.

    Unless any of these restrictions codified somewhere else in the law, it looks to me that open carry would be authorized pretty much anywhere! Do others agree with my interpretation? Does anyone know of any restrictions outside ß45-9-101(13)?
    Last edited by Eeyore; 03-28-2013 at 04:58 PM.
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    Regular Member wylde007's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Congratulations

    On a small, but VERY IMPORTANT recognition under color of law.

    Now you won't have to prove that it was OK for you to have an openly carried firearm, they'll have to prove that it wasn't. And that's a tough row to hoe with an actual AFFIRMATIVE statute on the books.
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    Regular Member Wolfgang1952's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike View Post
    http://www.clarionledger.com/article...nclick_check=1

    SNIP



    The new law defines concealed carry, saying a gun doesnít have to be fully concealed as long as itís in a proper holster. But it also states that openly carrying is allowed. A permit is required only for concealed carry, which no longer has to be very concealed.

    . . .



    The way I read it, If you put your gun in a holster you still need a permission slip to carry your gun on your hip.
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    Clarification

    Quote Originally Posted by Wolfgang1952 View Post
    The way I read it, If you put your gun in a holster you still need a permission slip to carry your gun on your hip.
    Wolfenstein,

    The wording has been changed to explicitly allow you to carry a holstered weapon.

    (4) For the purposes of this section, "concealed" means hidden or obscured from common observation and shall not include any weapon listed in subsection (1) of this section, including, but not limited to, a loaded or unloaded pistol carried upon the person in a sheath, belt holster or shoulder holster that is wholly or partially visible, or carried upon the person in a scabbard or case for carrying the weapon that is wholly or partially visible.

    It eliminates the pesky bit about "concealed in whole or part".

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    Regular Member Wolfgang1952's Avatar
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    Irate Mormon thanks for the clarification. Now when I come up I wonít have to disarm at the state border.
    Pres. Florida Parishes Chapter of LOCAL www.laopencarry.org

    .308 Isn't an area code, but it can still make long distance calls.
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    Wolf

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    Quote Originally Posted by Irate Mormon View Post
    Wolfenstein,

    The wording has been changed to explicitly allow you to carry a holstered weapon.

    (4) For the purposes of this section, "concealed" means hidden or obscured from common observation and shall not include any weapon listed in subsection (1) of this section, including, but not limited to, a loaded or unloaded pistol carried upon the person in a sheath, belt holster or shoulder holster that is wholly or partially visible, or carried upon the person in a scabbard or case for carrying the weapon that is wholly or partially visible.

    It eliminates the pesky bit about "concealed in whole or part".
    Welcome to OCDO!!

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    Interpretation

    As is always the case with the law, any law is open to intreptation by those who read it. That is why there are courts and courts of review and courts of review that review the courts of review all the way up to the US Supreme Court.

    Anyway, MY intreptation of the law,http://billstatus.ls.state.ms.us/doc...9/HB0002SG.pdf, is that any place that a concealed firearm is prohibited is also the same place that an open carry of a firearm is prohibited. See lines 352-394.

    The Commissioner of Public Safety is responsible for dissiminating information pertaining to this law and we shall see what he does by July 1, 2013.

    I am new here and I see why there are misspelled words for my "spell check" will not work on this site!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MyGlockisaRedneck0 View Post
    As is always the case with the law, any law is open to intreptation by those who read it. That is why there are courts and courts of review and courts of review that review the courts of review all the way up to the US Supreme Court.

    Anyway, MY intreptation of the law,http://billstatus.ls.state.ms.us/doc...9/HB0002SG.pdf, is that any place that a concealed firearm is prohibited is also the same place that an open carry of a firearm is prohibited. See lines 352-394.

    The Commissioner of Public Safety is responsible for dissiminating information pertaining to this law and we shall see what he does by July 1, 2013.

    I am new here and I see why there are misspelled words for my "spell check" will not work on this site!
    Welcome to OCDO MyGlockisaRedneck0!

    I can see that some may want to apply the restrictions in 45-9-101 to open carry, but for this to hold up in a courtroom, the following would nee to happen. The word "concealed" in section 13 would have to be ignored. The fact that the entirety of 45-9-101 is entitled "LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED PISTOL OR REVOLVER" would have to be disregarded because open carry is NOT licensed and NOT concealed, AND the state constitution would also need to be ignored. I'm not saying this couldn't happen, but sheeeesh...

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    Regular Member MSRebel54's Avatar
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    I agree that the restrictions on CC would not apply to OC, since OC may not be regulated as such. But it seems to me that if the place were private property they could just tell you that you can't come in wearing the gun, or post a sign. If you come in anyway, at that point you are guilty of trespass.

    Same for a public building, except it would need to be a "policy" and a sign posted. Trespass again would be the violation.

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    Some may put out signs. I doubt very many will do it. OCing has become a bit more common here in La and there has been no rush to put up "gun buster" signs. Our constitution was changed recently, to supposedly better secure our right to keep and bear, and still no adverse reaction from businesses. Quit the contrary in my experience.

    As a matte of fact, my last OC experience in Picayune Ms. included a few stops to lumber company, hardware store etc, and a couple of the small business owners expressed their interest and approval of OCing.

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    Legal for Mississippians only?

    I hope I'm reading too much into some of the reports, but does the law really only apply to non-prohibited Mississippians? If so, what defines a Mississippian? Is that a citizen (anyone in the state even for 1 minute), or do they mean resident? This would be the only state I'm aware of that limited "constitutional open carry" only to residents. Please tell me the actual statute is clearer and allows open carry to non-prohibited citizens...

    Regardless, nice work getting this signed into law!

    Thanks,

    Tim Brubaker
    Mansfield, GA

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    Regular Member MSRebel54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timb30016 View Post
    I hope I'm reading too much into some of the reports, but does the law really only apply to non-prohibited Mississippians? If so, what defines a Mississippian? Is that a citizen (anyone in the state even for 1 minute), or do they mean resident? This would be the only state I'm aware of that limited "constitutional open carry" only to residents. Please tell me the actual statute is clearer and allows open carry to non-prohibited citizens...

    Regardless, nice work getting this signed into law!

    Thanks,

    Tim Brubaker
    Mansfield, GA
    What part of the law are you referring to? Please cite the part of the law that would lead you to conclude this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by timb30016 View Post
    I hope I'm reading too much into some of the reports, but does the law really only apply to non-prohibited Mississippians? If so, what defines a Mississippian? Is that a citizen (anyone in the state even for 1 minute), or do they mean resident? This would be the only state I'm aware of that limited "constitutional open carry" only to residents. Please tell me the actual statute is clearer and allows open carry to non-prohibited citizens...

    Regardless, nice work getting this signed into law!

    Thanks,

    Tim Brubaker
    Mansfield, GA
    From http://www.lexisnexis.com/hottopics/mscode/:
    Miss. Const. Ann. Art. 3, ß 12 (2013)


    ß 12. Right to bear arms


    The right of every citizen to keep and bear arms in defense of his home, person, or property, or in aid of the civil power when thereto legally summoned, shall not be called in question, but the Legislature may regulate or forbid carrying concealed weapons.
    Where do you see anything limiting the MS RKBA to residents?

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    Quote Originally Posted by georg jetson View Post
    Welcome to OCDO MyGlockisaRedneck0!

    I can see that some may want to apply the restrictions in 45-9-101 to open carry, but for this to hold up in a courtroom, the following would nee to happen. The word "concealed" in section 13 would have to be ignored. The fact that the entirety of 45-9-101 is entitled "LICENSE TO CARRY CONCEALED PISTOL OR REVOLVER" would have to be disregarded because open carry is NOT licensed and NOT concealed, AND the state constitution would also need to be ignored. I'm not saying this couldn't happen, but sheeeesh...
    Thanks for the welcome! The confusion about "concealed" carry was due to that State Supreme Court decision, often referenced, which defined "concealed" as any part of a gun hidden from view-- as laying on a car seat---the part touching the car seat was "concealed" from view or the part being held in a hand was "concealed" from view, and, therefore, there was no such thing as an "unconcealed" gun, and, therefore, no such thing as "open" carry for when any part of a gun was "concealed," the gun was prohibited.

    Idiotic? Yes, I agree that it was an idiotic interpretation, but that was the interpretation for many, many years. Not now!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MSRebel54 View Post
    What part of the law are you referring to? Please cite the part of the law that would lead you to conclude this.
    I was referring to the article from the Clarion-Ledger that the OP snipped: "Iíll say it again: House Bill 2, signed into law by the governor, allows a Mississippian, with or without a permit, to strap on a pistol and stroll about in public."

    I haven't read the bill yet, but your response seems to answer my question.

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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    i was down in southaven this weekend and there were four cops at the gas station so i asked them about it. They got all perturbed and said "the only reason anyone would OC is to intimidate and scare people" i wasnt trying to be a smart ass but i said, well TN is OC and they dont have any issues... they kept repeating to me that i couldnt OC in places that were posted to which i responded, yeah that would be the same as CC law. anyway, they were very unhappy about it an said OC is only legal in a few states (weird, TN is like 5 miles away and it's OC and the world doesnt come crashing down)

    also they said the legislators didnt know what they had passed (huh) and they were working on new legislation to undo it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kopis View Post
    ...........also they said the legislators didnt know what they had passed (huh) and they were working on new legislation to undo it.....
    I sure hope they are stopped from that. I plan on coming back down to Vicksburg next summer and I was planning on OCing everywhere. I was stationed there for years when I was in the Army. I concealed when I was there and I am very happy OC is "legal" there now.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

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    Regular Member MSRebel54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by timb30016 View Post
    I was referring to the article from the Clarion-Ledger that the OP snipped: "Iíll say it again: House Bill 2, signed into law by the governor, allows a Mississippian, with or without a permit, to strap on a pistol and stroll about in public."

    I haven't read the bill yet, but your response seems to answer my question.
    Yeah, HB2 only dealt with concealed carry. It is true that you must be a resident of Mississippi in order to obtain a Mississippi Firearms Permit, but there are no regulations for open carry, and the Mississippi Constitution states, "The right of every citizen to keep and bear arms..."

    It doesn't say "citizen of Mississippi", so I would take that to mean that even if you are a citizen of New York or Illinois, you would still have that right in Mississippi.

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    Regular Member MSRebel54's Avatar
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    They got all perturbed and said "the only reason anyone would OC is to intimidate and scare people"
    Yeah, a lot of them think that their openly displayed firearm is there to "intimidate and scare people", so that's the only reason they can think of as to why anyone would do it.

    anyway, they were very unhappy about it an said OC is only legal in a few states
    With the addition of Arkansas in August, that would bring the number of states where OC is legal (by some means) to 45. So by their reckoning, 45 out of 50 constitutes "a few". But of course these guys probably aren't familiar with all 57 states.

    i was down in southaven
    I've heard a lot of good OC stories from Southaven as well, just to give equal time to the other side of the story.

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    Regular Member Kopis's Avatar
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    yeah, i dont go down there that much mainly because they still allow smoking in restaurants but if OC became legal I'd definitely visit more often. I just saw the four cops and decided to ask them. i was CCing at the time.

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    Regular Member Eeyore's Avatar
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    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by MSRebel54 View Post
    With the addition of Arkansas in August, that would bring the number of states where OC is legal (by some means) to 45. So by their reckoning, 45 out of 50 constitutes "a few". But of course these guys probably aren't familiar with all 57 states.
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    Is It Still Legal?

    I have read that a judge in Hinds County permanently blocked the OC law going into effect. It seems to me that being a county court judge, he can only apply that to Hinds County, not the hole state. Can I get some clarification?

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    Disagreement!

    Event that order is subject to disagreement. Some county sheriffs have stated that the law applies ONLY to Hinds County and not their county. Even the A-G says that since the courts are structured for state wide laws to be challenged in Hind County court, then any Hinds County court order "could" have state wide meaning. But, he did not give a final answer!!!!!!

    I will just wait and see what the Supreme Court says. Meanwhile, I can CC and go on about my business.

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