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Thread: “There are certain times we should infringe on your freedom”

  1. #1
    Administrator John Pierce's Avatar
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    “There are certain times we should infringe on your freedom”

    “There are certain times we should infringe on your freedom.” These words, or ones very much like them, are powerful words indeed. They have been spoken countless times throughout history by pharaohs, and kings, and emperors, and men with far too much power over the weak and defenseless.


    And once spoken, they have shaped the blood-spattered history of mankind. They are the words of tyrants … of dictators … of slaveowners.


    And always … what followed was misery, and suffering, and then ultimately … horror and death.


    Most recently, these words came from the mouth of New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who has long made it clear that he is far more qualified to run your life than you are.

    Read more of John's article at Monachus Lex.

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    That works both ways though. "there are certain times when we must infringe on your life's progression" ... like when you attempt to terminate ours. It's funny how so many liberals worship Thomas Jefferson but forget that it was he who said "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants."
    Last edited by RockyMtnScotsman; 03-25-2013 at 07:07 PM.

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    Regular Member rushcreek2's Avatar
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    Wealth conveys political power. Absolute wealth apparently conveys near absolute political power.

    Same with Obama ( or whatever his real name is). Their is enormous wealth backing this man, George Soros ?

    The likes of these would be monarchs - is precisely why the pioneers who framed the U.S. Constitution, and formed this Republic insisted on the 2nd Amendment. Of course, would-be despots will attack the 2A. They must in order to achieve their goals.

    We are being told that the institution of marriage has long been "denied" to same-sex partners. A" RIGHT" it is -we are being told . Yet a clear RIGHT enumerated in our founding document is dismissed regularly.
    Last edited by rushcreek2; 03-25-2013 at 08:10 PM.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rushcreek2 View Post
    Wealth conveys political power. Absolute wealth apparently conveys near absolute political power.

    Same with Obama ( or whatever his real name is). Their is enormous wealth backing this man, George Soros ?

    The likes of these would be monarchs - is precisely why the pioneers who framed the U.S. Constitution, and formed this Republic insisted on the 2nd Amendment. Of course, would-be despots will attack the 2A. They must in order to achieve their goals.

    We are being told that the institution of marriage has long been "denied" to same-sex partners. A" RIGHT" it is -we are being told . Yet a clear RIGHT enumerated in our founding document is dismissed regularly.

    I wonder who backed George Washington?--he was a President, correct? Apparently, he was a very wealthy man...likely backed himself, well, and by the help of his wealthy slave owning friends. Yes, the slave owning Founding Fathers believed in Freedom, Liberty, that each are the cornerstone of a Just Republic. Where did we go wrong, that we have found ourselves here, today, in a Republic where Blacks are not slaves, where women have the option to vote, drive a car, decide to not be pregnant; where gays aren't executed, where witches aren't burned at the stake, where a person with the flu is not bled to death in order to cure their ill. What have we done to our original Republic, but make it an abomination...an Obamanation! Whoa is us!!

    Civil Rights, are not Constitutional Rights, that's why they're termed Civil Rights.

    What enumerations are being dismissed, regularly? Let's get down to it, identify what enumerations are being dismissed, find out who's dismissing them, and deport, deport, deport!

    Whether some gay couple wants to get married, or some black person wants to get a drink from a drinking fountain in predominantly white park, or a female wants to vote, that has nothing to do with infringing upon your Rights. Assuming you do have Rights, then where are the Rights of every other red blooded American who lives their life not according to your so-called Principles.
    Last edited by Beretta92FSLady; 03-25-2013 at 08:45 PM.
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I wonder who backed George Washington.
    I'm stickin-it to the man! (aren't YOU the man?) shut up



    “If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face … forever.”

    Best book quote evar
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 03-25-2013 at 10:03 PM.

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    Regular Member Beretta92FSLady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I'm stickin-it to the man! (aren't YOU the man?) shut up



    “If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face … forever.”

    Best book quote evar
    The man ought to have it stuck to him.

    My Name Is Mud
    I don't mind watching the OC-Community (tea party 2.0's, who have hijacked the OC-Community) cannibalize itself. I do mind watching OC dragged through the gutter. OC is an exercise of A Right. I choose to not OC; I choose to not own firearms. I choose to leave the OC-Community to it's own self-inflicted injuries, and eventual implosion. Carry on...

  7. #7
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I wonder who backed George Washington?--he was a President, correct? Apparently, he was a very wealthy man...likely backed himself, well, and by the help of his wealthy slave owning friends. Yes, the slave owning Founding Fathers believed in Freedom, Liberty, that each are the cornerstone of a Just Republic. Where did we go wrong, that we have found ourselves here, today, in a Republic where Blacks are not slaves, where women have the option to vote, drive a car, decide to not be pregnant; where gays aren't executed, where witches aren't burned at the stake, where a person with the flu is not bled to death in order to cure their ill. What have we done to our original Republic, but make it an abomination...an Obamanation! Whoa is us!!

    Civil Rights, are not Constitutional Rights, that's why they're termed Civil Rights.

    What enumerations are being dismissed, regularly? Let's get down to it, identify what enumerations are being dismissed, find out who's dismissing them, and deport, deport, deport!

    Whether some gay couple wants to get married, or some black person wants to get a drink from a drinking fountain in predominantly white park, or a female wants to vote, that has nothing to do with infringing upon your Rights. Assuming you do have Rights, then where are the Rights of every other red blooded American who lives their life not according to your so-called Principles.
    There is no such thing as "constitutional" rights.

    Witch burning was stopped long before our "republic" and it was a tool of those in charge, when the people found out they can use it against those persecuting others with it, it ended abruptly.

    Why do you feel we must give up liberties to support the liberties of various individuals? I think it's great that a country founded by English men for the rights of English men, can be expanded to include all individuals, and much of this was done on purpose by those evil slave owners like Thomas Jefferson.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  8. #8
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Great Article John.

    If you were not on the other side of the country, I'd ask if you'd speak at our state Libertarian convention here in my town on April 20th.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beretta92FSLady View Post
    I wonder who backed George Washington?--he was a President, correct? Apparently, he was a very wealthy man...likely backed himself, well, and by the help of his wealthy slave owning friends. Yes, the slave owning Founding Fathers believed in Freedom, Liberty, that each are the cornerstone of a Just Republic. Where did we go wrong, that we have found ourselves here, today, in a Republic where Blacks are not slaves, where women have the option to vote, drive a car, decide to not be pregnant; where gays aren't executed, where witches aren't burned at the stake, where a person with the flu is not bled to death in order to cure their ill. What have we done to our original Republic, but make it an abomination...an Obamanation! Whoa is us!!

    Civil Rights, are not Constitutional Rights, that's why they're termed Civil Rights.

    What enumerations are being dismissed, regularly? Let's get down to it, identify what enumerations are being dismissed, find out who's dismissing them, and deport, deport, deport!

    Whether some gay couple wants to get married, or some black person wants to get a drink from a drinking fountain in predominantly white park, or a female wants to vote, that has nothing to do with infringing upon your Rights. Assuming you do have Rights, then where are the Rights of every other red blooded American who lives their life not according to your so-called Principles.
    You do realize that the vast majority of the signers if the Declaration of Independence were anti slavery and of course you know that Benjamin Franklin & Benjamin Rush founded the first anti slavery association in America and John Jay founded another anti slavery association that William Livingston belonged to and Richard Bassett, James Madison, James Monroe, Bushrod Washington, Charles Carroll, William Few, John Marshall, Richard Stockton, Zephaniah Swift, also belonged to anti slavery groups. I know you are also familiar with the following quotes by the founding fathers

    My opinion against slavery has always been know, never in my life did I own a slave.
    —John Adams,

    Why keep alive the question of slavery? It is admitted by all to be a great evil.
    —Charles Carroll

    As Congress is now to legislate for our extensive territory lately acquired, I pray to Heaven that they curse not the inhabitants of those regions, and of the United States in general, with a permission to introduce slavery.
    —John Dickinson,

    I could cite many more quotes but I am sure you already know them.

    You are undoubtedly aware that Washington as president signed legislation authored by Rush that outlawed slavery in Michigan Ohio Indiana, Illinois and I believe Wisconsin.

    Yes these were the slave owning founding fathers that you so blithely slander in you immense ignorance of history.

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    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    And I keep getting to hear how background checks protect my second amendment rights. What a crock.

    I couldn't find the AZ ad I was looking for, but this one will do.
    <br>
    "Public opinion and votes have nothing to do with this. The challenge of the Court is not what they're going to do with votes. The challenge-- of the Court is are they going to protect people's rights." - Al Sharpton


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    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    You do realize that the vast majority of the signers if the Declaration of Independence were anti slavery and of course you know that Benjamin Franklin & Benjamin Rush founded the first anti slavery association in America and John Jay founded another anti slavery association that William Livingston belonged to and Richard Bassett, James Madison, James Monroe, Bushrod Washington, Charles Carroll, William Few, John Marshall, Richard Stockton, Zephaniah Swift, also belonged to anti slavery groups. I know you are also familiar with the following quotes by the founding fathers

    My opinion against slavery has always been know, never in my life did I own a slave.
    —John Adams,

    Why keep alive the question of slavery? It is admitted by all to be a great evil.
    —Charles Carroll

    As Congress is now to legislate for our extensive territory lately acquired, I pray to Heaven that they curse not the inhabitants of those regions, and of the United States in general, with a permission to introduce slavery.
    —John Dickinson,

    I could cite many more quotes but I am sure you already know them.

    You are undoubtedly aware that Washington as president signed legislation authored by Rush that outlawed slavery in Michigan Ohio Indiana, Illinois and I believe Wisconsin.

    Yes these were the slave owning founding fathers that you so blithely slander in you immense ignorance of history.
    In addition to your points..

    Only two state were the hold outs for slavery all others were willing to give it up.

    One of the grievances Thomas Jefferson had against King George in his draft of the Declaration of Independence was the institution of Slavery.

    Slavery is evil no doubt. Natural rights apply across all ethnic lines though. All are equal in the law, those who harp on the "slavery" issue because some of the founders were slave owners, are actually just against the natural right principles otherwise they would just fight like Frederick Douglas to have these principles apply to all men.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

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    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    Enlighten the people, generally, and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like spirits at the dawn of day. - Thomas Jefferson
    Liberals, such as B92FSL, fear the enlightenment of the citizenry.....unless, of course, it is state sanctioned enlightenment.

    I have never believed there was one code of morality for a public and another for a private man. - Thomas Jefferson
    Liberals believe the exact opposite.

    I would rather be exposed to the inconveniencies attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it. - Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Archibald Stuart, December 23, 1791
    This is the quintessential liberty-centric viewpoint. Liberals, oddly enough, believe this too, but liberals desire only a select few, who possess the "proper frame of mind", to benefit from "too much" of their brand of liberty.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    And I keep getting to hear how background checks protect my second amendment rights. What a crock.

    I couldn't find the AZ ad I was looking for, but this one will do.
    <br>
    errrr ... I not demanding universal background checks ... must be a Biden relative ....

    FAIL

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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    And I keep getting to hear how background checks protect my second amendment rights. What a crock.

    I couldn't find the AZ ad I was looking for, but this one will do.
    <br>
    He says in this video that comprehensive background checks will stop criminals and the mentally unstable from buying guns.... WTF?

    It has already been shown that comprehensive background checks will do no such thing. Every form of gun control that has been strongly advocated since Newtown has been previously implemented elsewhere in the US a/o the world, and none of it made a significant impact in gun violence, and not only that, in most cases overall violence rose in addition to the little or no decrease in gun violence.

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    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    BERRETTALADY. Washington was practically unanimously appointed to be president, but when his second term came up he had 14 opponents

    most of the founders were against slavery. but trying ot get America off slavery was like trying to get us off gasoline now. now they did make great strides to that end

    DAVIDEMCBETH, are you drunk or high when you post?

    the real biggest evil behind the unerversial background check is that it can not be done. like most things that progressives do it is only a feel good measure. no substance.
    but there is a worst plot that i think the progressive's are planning. to make the UBC work there will have to be a national registration. think about it. how can you tell if the gun that a private trader acquires is not one he has always had. if you require UBC, then you will have to know who has what guns.
    and you know what registration will mean
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

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    Quote Originally Posted by papa bear View Post
    BERRETTALADY. Washington was practically unanimously appointed to be president, but when his second term came up he had 14 opponents

    most of the founders were against slavery. but trying ot get America off slavery was like trying to get us off gasoline now. now they did make great strides to that end

    DAVIDEMCBETH, are you drunk or high when you post?

    the real biggest evil behind the unerversial background check is that it can not be done. like most things that progressives do it is only a feel good measure. no substance.
    but there is a worst plot that i think the progressive's are planning. to make the UBC work there will have to be a national registration. think about it. how can you tell if the gun that a private trader acquires is not one he has always had. if you require UBC, then you will have to know who has what guns.
    and you know what registration will mean
    BR checks are USELESS as well .... look, the sandy hook killer had a BR chk (was denied), still did nothing to stop him ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by sudden valley gunner View Post
    In addition to your points..

    Only two state were the hold outs for slavery all others were willing to give it up.

    One of the grievances Thomas Jefferson had against King George in his draft of the Declaration of Independence was the institution of Slavery.

    Slavery is evil no doubt. Natural rights apply across all ethnic lines though. All are equal in the law, those who harp on the "slavery" issue because some of the founders were slave owners, are actually just against the natural right principles otherwise they would just fight like Frederick Douglas to have these principles apply to all men.
    More facts would only confuse an already history impaired individual, I did wonder if I should explain who all these people were that I mentioned were, I doubt Beretta knows about any of them besides Washington and Franklin.

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    how did this get to be a slavery thread???? back to point ... want to talk slavery, start a thread ...

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    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    And I keep getting to hear how background checks protect my second amendment rights. What a crock.

    I couldn't find the AZ ad I was looking for, but this one will do.
    <br>
    Dude, as long as the guy has a folksy way about him, sits on the back of his truck bed with his pump gun, and has "country facial hair", he definitely represents gun owners.

  20. #20
    Regular Member Red Dawg's Avatar
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    Nah Marshaul, it's the hat and flannel shirt. Or the bushel basket behind him...
    A guy with a gun said it, Like the reports from the search warrants up in CT...I read it on the internet, and they said it was bad, so it must be. Really? The media is so brainwashing people it really is comically unfair..
    The Second Amendment is in place
    in case the politicians ignore the others

    A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone

  21. #21
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshaul View Post
    Dude, as long as the guy has a folksy way about him, sits on the back of his truck bed with his pump gun, and has "country facial hair", he definitely represents gun owners.
    Yeah, they screwed up using a model.

    They should have used an older man with a beer gut.
    "Public opinion and votes have nothing to do with this. The challenge of the Court is not what they're going to do with votes. The challenge-- of the Court is are they going to protect people's rights." - Al Sharpton


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    My eyes may be failing me, but where is that guy's index finger?

  23. #23
    Regular Member OC for ME's Avatar
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    A NYC actor portraying a country redneck. Poor job of it too.

    1. No country redneck would be caught dead wearing flannel.....trust me, I know.
    2. No country redneck "claims" to be a 2A supporter we just exercise our right.....kinda like breathing for us poor country folk.
    3. No country redneck would be caught dead, ever, with the POS shotgun.
    4. eye95 caught the finger thing.
    "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it." - Thomas Jefferson.

    "Better that ten guilty persons escape, than that one innocent suffer" - English jurist William Blackstone.
    It is AFAIK original to me. Compromise is failure on the installment plan, particularly when dealing with so intractable an opponent as ignorance. - Nightmare

  24. #24
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    More facts would only confuse an already history impaired individual, I did wonder if I should explain who all these people were that I mentioned were, I doubt Beretta knows about any of them besides Washington and Franklin.
    That's because some of us are willing to learn even when its' contrary to our preconceived views.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  25. #25
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    My eyes may be failing me, but where is that guy's index finger?
    Why not, he's also sweeping too.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...-gun-attack-a/
    "Public opinion and votes have nothing to do with this. The challenge of the Court is not what they're going to do with votes. The challenge-- of the Court is are they going to protect people's rights." - Al Sharpton


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