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Liberty U promotes LIBERTY (uh ... for 'permitted' people only)

Repeater

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Liberty for some:

LU changes concealed weapons rules for permitted people
Liberty University students, visitors, faculty and staff with concealed-carry permits can now bring weapons into all Liberty University facilities — from philosophy class to Williams Stadium — except for dormitories.

The policy change went into effect March 22, following a unanimous vote by the Liberty University Board of Trustees. Previously, guns were allowed on campus but not inside buildings.“I think it’s good that Liberty is a little more open than some schools,and I think it’ll continue to create a higher level of security on campus than what was found at Virginia Tech” during the time of the fatal shootings in 2007, Liberty University Chancellor Jerry Falwell Jr. said Tuesday.
Click to expand...

I guess OC would be construed as "a lot more open" huh?
 
Repeater

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Amended 'Policy' explains open carry

From the friendly neighborhood LUPD:

Firearms on Campus
See the PDF:
Section 3. PERSONS ELIGIBLE FOR AUTHORIZATION TO CARRY WEAPON

...

D. Students of Liberty University who are not also employees of Liberty University, who hold a valid concealed weapons permit recognized by the Commonwealth of Virginia, and who are approved by LUPD to carry a concealed weapon, may possess and carry such concealed weapon on University property and all University facilities except residence halls, and may store the approved weapon in a secured container or compartment in their vehicle while on University property. Except as permitted in Section 3 C, no weapons may be stored in residence halls. The approved weapon shall never be openly carried except while necessary for its lawful use.
Click to expand...

What does that [except while necessary for its lawful use] mean?
 
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Repeater said:
From the friendly neighborhood LUPD:

Firearms on Campus
See the PDF:


What does that [except while necessary for its lawful use] mean?
Click to expand...

(chuckle) Well, I think the Fedcoats have said that mere possession of a firearm while involved in a drug offense consitutes a "use"; so, carrying it must be a use, as opposed to shooting it or dry-fire practicing with it. :)



This is a step in the right direction. I wouldn't beat them up too much over the refusal to allow OC. At least they knew OC existed!! All our guys who carry in the commercial district near LU must have been noticed. :)
 
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V

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I know that this is OCDO, and I'm not in favor of being forced to CC just to keep someone from possibly wetting their pants, but can we cut Liberty a little slack here? Seriously! This policy puts them head an shoulders above probably 99% of colleges and universities in the country when it come to respecting individuals' rights to self-defense. It's a huge step in the right direction, and should be applauded.
 
Grapeshot

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VApatriot said:
I know that this is OCDO, and I'm not in favor of being forced to CC just to keep someone from possibly wetting their pants, but can we cut Liberty a little slack here? Seriously! This policy puts them head an shoulders above probably 99% of colleges and universities in the country when it come to respecting individuals' rights to self-defense. It's a huge step in the right direction, and should be applauded.
Click to expand...

Agree that it is a huge positive step forward. As much as I believe in OC, I would rather that they get the right to CC in dormatory facilities next.

Those that demand all or nothing should be careful for what they ask and how the ask............they just might get it............nothing!
 
ocholsteroc

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Now you can carry a gun pretty much anywhere at Liberty University (OC related)

Now you can carry a gun pretty much anywhere at Liberty University

http://now.msn.com/liberty-university-allows-concealed-weapons-on-campus 7 hrs ago



Thanks to a unanimous vote by the Liberty University Board of Trustees, pretty much anybody can now carry a gun anywhere they want on the school's Lynchburg, Va., campus. Previously, guns were not allowed in school buildings, but now students, faculty and visitors with concealed weapon licenses will be saved the nuisance of stowing their weapons in their cars or secured containers before going inside. The only buildings that will continue to prohibit firearms are dormitories. (Sorry, gun-toting dorm dwellers. We suggest you find a good hiding spot for the old guy.) University Chancellor Jerry Falwell Jr. reportedly has zero safety concerns about the new policy and believes the change will make the campus "safer than most."
Click to expand...


Now what about open carry? can we open carry? :monkey
 
Grapeshot

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ocholsteroc said:
Now what about open carry? can we open carry? :monkey
Click to expand...
Edited to correct - would not be the best idea.

Now if they'd only post signs like this throughout the campus.
I would of course prefer that the word "concealed" not be included.
 
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M

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Liberty is a great school.....that said having lived in a LU dorm for one semester I think I would rather live off campus. On campus life is more expensive and more restrictive than off. It is a fabulous school however and the education is first rate. That is one huge step forward. Permitting open carry is the next step, but any step forward is better than none at all.
 
peter nap

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This is one of those situations where I have to bite my tongue. I've quietly said to college students for a couple of years that the ONLY chance they have of getting carry through was with a CHP. Then I have to keep reminding myself that I said it when things like this happen.
 
wylde007

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Once Again, the Point Being Most Missed Here

Is that "permitted" students accounts for ONLY upperclassmen. Since a person under 21 cannot obtain a permit to carry a concealed firearm in Virginia (or most other states of which I am immediately aware) then this rule excludes all 18 (freshmen), 19 (sophomore) and 20 (junior) year-old students. Only seniors would be "permitted" to carry, simply by application of state law.

Is it a "good start"? Maybe, but what are the odds that you're going to have an armed senior attending a freshmen Lit lecture course? The only possibility might be student assistants or graduate students or the teacher.

Still pretty slim protection, if you ask me.
 
richarcm

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wylde007 said:
Is that "permitted" students accounts for ONLY upperclassmen. Since a person under 21 cannot obtain a permit to carry a concealed firearm in Virginia (or most other states of which I am immediately aware) then this rule excludes all 18 (freshmen), 19 (sophomore) and 20 (junior) year-old students. Only seniors would be "permitted" to carry, simply by application of state law.

Is it a "good start"? Maybe, but what are the odds that you're going to have an armed senior attending a freshmen Lit lecture course? The only possibility might be student assistants or graduate students or the teacher.

Still pretty slim protection, if you ask me.
Click to expand...

On the bright side this is at worst equally as effective as the NRAs position of having a few armed guards stand by one door on one end of a campus.

Additionally professors can carry as well.

But good point.
 
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scouser

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What's the old saying? "don't look a gift horse in the mouth".

OK, so you have to have a permit to carry at Liberty. When you compare their stance to that of VCU, ODU, VT and all the others that forbid carry of any kind by anyone studying or working at those institutions, in my opinion they've made a step in the right direction.

I think the point being missed is the one Grapeshot & VApatriot brought up earlier in this thread

Grapeshot said:
VApatriot said:
I know that this is OCDO, and I'm not in favor of being forced to CC just to keep someone from possibly wetting their pants, but can we cut Liberty a little slack here? Seriously! This policy puts them head an shoulders above probably 99% of colleges and universities in the country when it come to respecting individuals' rights to self-defense. It's a huge step in the right direction, and should be applauded.
Click to expand...
Agree that it is a huge positive step forward. As much as I believe in OC, I would rather that they get the right to CC in dormatory facilities next.

Those that demand all or nothing should be careful for what they ask and how the ask............they just might get it............nothing!
Click to expand...

an all or nothing approach will just get nothing, something is better than nothing, save the criticism for the institutions that REALLY deserve it
 
Grapeshot

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Constitutional Carry would solve this problem to some extent as all those old enough to own a handgun could then carry CC or OC w/o a CHP.

Then it becomes just a tiny step for LU to amend their rule/policy to allow all legal gun owners to carry for all legal purposes - hopefully also to include OC.
 
Repeater

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wylde007 said:
Is that "permitted" students accounts for ONLY upperclassmen. Since a person under 21 cannot obtain a permit to carry a concealed firearm in Virginia (or most other states of which I am immediately aware) then this rule excludes all 18 (freshmen), 19 (sophomore) and 20 (junior) year-old students. Only seniors would be "permitted" to carry, simply by application of state law.

Is it a "good start"? Maybe, but what are the odds that you're going to have an armed senior attending a freshmen Lit lecture course? The only possibility might be student assistants or graduate students or the teacher.

Still pretty slim protection, if you ask me.
Click to expand...

See, the age threshold is a very good argument to make.

Perhaps Incrementalism shall apply at LU - and in the future, the liberty to carry for self-protection will become available to all students.
 
scouser

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damned if you do .. damned if you don't ...

Taking a step back and looking at this the way Liberty might,

If they're going to be chastized for taking a step in the right direction they might just start thinking 'why are we bothering?'. They don't make the rules about what age you must be to get a CHP, why not complain that anyone old enough to vote, or old enough to sign up to die in the service of their country should be entitled to a CHP?

Why not boycott the GA because you have to have a CHP to carry there on Lobby Day?

I just don't think this is a battle we should be having over P4P in this case, instead they should be supported by us all and held up as an example to the rest of the colleges of the path they should be taking.

It's not a perfect situation but, given the recent climate since CT, can we really afford to divide ourselves on what is a positive step. What kind of field-day are the antis going to have if we can't present a united front of support for what Liberty are doing
 
Grapeshot

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scouser said:
Taking a step back and looking at this the way Liberty might,

If they're going to be chastized for taking a step in the right direction they might just start thinking 'why are we bothering?'. They don't make the rules about what age you must be to get a CHP, why not complain that anyone old enough to vote, or old enough to sign up to die in the service of their country should be entitled to a CHP?

Why not boycott the GA because you have to have a CHP to carry there on Lobby Day?

I just don't think this is a battle we should be having over P4P in this case, instead they should be supported by us all and held up as an example to the rest of the colleges of the path they should be taking.

It's not a perfect situation but, given the recent climate since CT, can we really afford to divide ourselves on what is a positive step. What kind of field-day are the antis going to have if we can't present a united front of support for what Liberty are doing
Click to expand...

Indeed Liberty (gotta love that name) University is the chink in the armor of solidarity of Virginia colleges. We must stand beside them with arms locked in support and laud their actions. Best of all, it was a unanimous decision of their board - no dissenters.

Gives one hope for academia in the Commonwealth.
 
peter nap

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scouser said:
It's not a perfect situation but, given the recent climate since CT, can we really afford to divide ourselves on what is a positive step. What kind of field-day are the antis going to have if we can't present a united front of support for what Liberty are doing
Click to expand...

I actually agree with what your saying Scouser, otherwise I wouldn't bother telling them that they will have to use P4P to be able to carry.

I don't agree that it's a positive step though. Reality stinks sometimes and this is not a step. It;s the end of the line and the policy won't progress, it will not change.

The good in it is that even though we've traded away a right on that campus, the kids will be able to defend themselves. That's probably worth it but I don't think I'll celebrate it as a victory.
 
scouser

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peter nap said:
I don't agree that it's a positive step though. Reality stinks sometimes and this is not a step. It;s the end of the line and the policy won't progress, it will not change.
Click to expand...

Liberty's policy may not change any further in the right direction, but (for example) Hampden Sydney might see that it didn't cause blood to be spilled all over campus and consider following suit, then Longwood and so on.

It might be the final step at Liberty, but it could be the first step towards safer education in Virginia as a whole. There's a long way to go but, in the supposed words of Lao Tzu, that journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
 
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