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Thread: empty holster stink eye?

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    Regular Member pawn99's Avatar
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    empty holster stink eye?

    So i've been ocing. I dont have my cpl yet. I started ocing on wed. Starting out i been ocing while outside on my lawn while taking my dog out or just enjoying the day. On wed i went to walmart to get a few things and pizza hut i orderd inside and took food to go ( wing night!) Lol i disarmed cause pizza hut and walmart sell alcohol and without a cpl i cany carry their. So i just left my holster on. While ordering the lady taking my order was super nice not even a glance at my holster. I figured she didnt notice. Their was a employee who stood next to her. He kept looking at my holster then looking back at me giving me a stink eye. Im like whatever. I go to walmart to pick up a few things and i got major stink eyes. I even over heard a older lady asking the lady she was with if i had a gun. But my holster was empty! Lol. I actully found it funny to see some peoples reactions even with a empty holster. I bet it happens more when im carrying. Does this ever happen to any of you? Lol

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    I haven't done it much yet, but so far no one has even looked twice.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    You will need to work on a confident, reassuring and preferably professional demeanor, and you need to understand that you will be getting questioned, complimented, and hated on at times by the general public. Most won't notice, but many will. It is part of the game. Being confident, knowing how to talk and present yourself, and worst case knowing how to fight, are all crucial aspects of OCing. If it bothers you, no one says you have to go 0 to 100% with OCing. You can ease into it at whatever pace you'd like. Most do.

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    I've been tempted to get a nice T-shirt lettered front and back: "I'm carrying a gun for self-defense. You can, too."

    That ought to send the old biddies into orbit.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I've been tempted to get a nice T-shirt lettered front and back: "I'm carrying a gun for self-defense. You can, too."

    That ought to send the old biddies into orbit.
    That is a spectacular idea. I should have my local print shop make some up.

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    Campaign Veteran smellslikemichigan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I've been tempted to get a nice T-shirt lettered front and back: "I'm carrying a gun for self-defense. You can, too."

    That ought to send the old biddies into orbit.
    my wife and i were approached by a nice old biddy while we were grocery shopping tonight. guess what? she was pro gun! she didn't have one anymore, but she thought it was great that i was carrying.... she was talking to my wife and didn't even notice that she was carrying too until we pointed it out to her. she got even more excited to see a young woman carrying.
    in the same store an older gentleman approached me and thanked me for open carrying and standing up for our rights. hey, even Maya Angelou is pro gun.
    Last edited by smellslikemichigan; 04-05-2013 at 11:02 PM.
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    I had same results at tractor supply cashier CCs away from work of course, but she said she was very interested in OC but just hadnt got the "balls" to do so yet. I directed her to this site havent been back there yet to get her opinion on site. Said she also seen an elderly woman late 70s early 80s OC in the store a few weeks back.

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    Regular Member pawn99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    You will need to work on a confident, reassuring and preferably professional demeanor, and you need to understand that you will be getting questioned, complimented, and hated on at times by the general public. Most won't notice, but many will. It is part of the game. Being confident, knowing how to talk and present yourself, and worst case knowing how to fight, are all crucial aspects of OCing. If it bothers you, no one says you have to go 0 to 100% with OCing. You can ease into it at whatever pace you'd like. Most do.
    Yea which that makes sense. Guess it takes time to adjust too

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    Regular Member pawn99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I've been tempted to get a nice T-shirt lettered front and back: "I'm carrying a gun for self-defense. You can, too."

    That ought to send the old biddies into orbit.
    Thats a damn good idea! I want one now lol.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pawn99 View Post
    So i've been ocing. I dont have my cpl yet. I started ocing on wed. Starting out i been ocing while outside on my lawn while taking my dog out or just enjoying the day. On wed i went to walmart to get a few things and pizza hut i orderd inside and took food to go ( wing night!) Lol i disarmed cause pizza hut and walmart sell alcohol and without a cpl i cany carry their. So i just left my holster on. While ordering the lady taking my order was super nice not even a glance at my holster. I figured she didnt notice. Their was a employee who stood next to her. He kept looking at my holster then looking back at me giving me a stink eye. Im like whatever. I go to walmart to pick up a few things and i got major stink eyes. I even over heard a older lady asking the lady she was with if i had a gun. But my holster was empty! Lol. I actully found it funny to see some peoples reactions even with a empty holster. I bet it happens more when im carrying. Does this ever happen to any of you? Lol
    Next time, just stick a banana in it.

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    Regular Member ron73440's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pawn99 View Post
    So i've been ocing. I dont have my cpl yet. I started ocing on wed. Starting out i been ocing while outside on my lawn while taking my dog out or just enjoying the day. On wed i went to walmart to get a few things and pizza hut i orderd inside and took food to go ( wing night!) Lol i disarmed cause pizza hut and walmart sell alcohol and without a cpl i cany carry their. So i just left my holster on. While ordering the lady taking my order was super nice not even a glance at my holster. I figured she didnt notice. Their was a employee who stood next to her. He kept looking at my holster then looking back at me giving me a stink eye. Im like whatever. I go to walmart to pick up a few things and i got major stink eyes. I even over heard a older lady asking the lady she was with if i had a gun. But my holster was empty! Lol. I actully found it funny to see some peoples reactions even with a empty holster. I bet it happens more when im carrying. Does this ever happen to any of you? Lol
    Quick question, in MI you cannot carry where alcohol is sold?

    In NC you can't carry "where sold and consumed" which sucks bad enough, but that really sucks.
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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Re: empty holster stink eye?

    Quote Originally Posted by ron73440 View Post
    Quick question, in MI you cannot carry where alcohol is sold?

    In NC you can't carry "where sold and consumed" which sucks bad enough, but that really sucks.
    Without a Concealed Pistol License, a person may not possess a firearm at an establishment licensed to sell alcohol.

    Michigan severely limits where a person can oc... without a cpl. If a person DOES have a cpl, Michigan is probably one of the best places to open carry. A person with a CPL can legally OC just about everywhere... bars, schools, etc. (Everywhere except courtrooms/court offices and those areas covered under Federal Law.)

    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ms...2_336854_7.pdf
    Last edited by DrTodd; 04-06-2013 at 08:27 AM.
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    Regular Member FreeInAZ's Avatar
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    Re: empty holster stink eye?

    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Without a Concealed Pistol License, a person may not possess a firearm at an establishment licensed to sell alcohol.

    Michigan severely limits where a person can oc... without a cpl. If a person DOES have a cpl, Michigan is probably one of the best places to open carry. A person with a CPL can legally OC just about everywhere... bars, schools, etc. (Everywhere except courtrooms/court offices and those areas covered under Federal Law.)

    http://www.michigan.gov/documents/ms...2_336854_7.pdf
    To those reading this be advised: while the law is very clear to many in MI with a 6th graders reading level or above. There are Judges in MI who see it differently. Carry at your own peril should you be in -Their "kingdom"

    Lansing & Judge Rosie come to mind.... not right, but that's just the way it is....
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    Michigan Moderator DrTodd's Avatar
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    Re: empty holster stink eye?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreeInAZ View Post
    To those reading this be advised: while the law is very clear to many in MI with a 6th graders reading level or above. There are Judges in MI who see it differently. Carry at your own peril should you be in -Their "kingdom"

    Lansing & Judge Rosie come to mind.... not right, but that's just the way it is....
    Could happen at almost anytime with ANY law.
    BTW, that part of her ruling was dicta... she found him "not guilty" for another reason. Yes, I know this case keeps rearing its ugly head. Because it was dicta and that the defendant won his case and therefore had no grounds for appeal, this case should not be given any more value than her opinion regarding the whole CADL drama. No... wait, that one was actually part of an opinion which was subsequently overruled so that case actually had some value.
    Last edited by DrTodd; 04-06-2013 at 03:44 PM.
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    Disclaimer – I am not a lawyer! Please do not consider anything you read from me to be legal advice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DrTodd View Post
    Could happen at almost anytime with ANY law.
    BTW, that part of her ruling was dicta... she found him "not guilty" for another reason. Yes, I know this case keeps rearing its ugly head. Because it was dicta and that the defendant won his case and therefore had no grounds for appeal, this case should not be given any more value than her opinion regarding the whole CADL drama. No... wait, that one was actually part of an opinion which was subsequently overruled so that case actually had some value.
    It's seems most of the conversations on OCDO are all off topic due to the lack of posting any involvement in posting then from the same few people. As I have no idea what talking about CADL and the law and getting stink eye at Walmart have in common. I'll not add the comment to DrTodds or AZs previous OT posts but I will comment on the OP.

    Don't worry about getting stink eyes from people OC'ing armed or just an empty holster. I tend to find that very few people in public even notice that you're OC'ing let alone give you dirty looks for doing it. Personally, I have encountered very few negative reactions from open carrying and I tend to do it on a daily basis. There is a rare occasion that someone comes at you negatively and I've always found it a good opportunity to try an educate people who don't understand it. There is also always a chance that the person could care less, or just wanted to be rude, negative or nasty. For those people I simply ignore them and continue with what I was doing. If I'm asked to leave I do so immediately and never go back to the place again. So far I've been asked to to leave an establishment once when OC'ing at a bar with 5 others by an on duty officer (all of us had CPLs). After we explained the law to him an he called it in to ask (because he had no idea) he let us go back in. The owner proceeded to then tell us he didnt want us there so we left with our food. (have never been back there).

    All an all if you're dressed right, acting normal, going about your business, you will rarely run in to negative encounters. But as always be ready for anything and know how to react properly if something were to come up with other customers, employees, or law enforcement. The good thing is more and more officers understand open carry like never before which helps our cause.

    Mike

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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    I've been tempted to get a nice T-shirt lettered front and back: "I'm carrying a gun for self-defense. You can, too."

    That ought to send the old biddies into orbit.
    If your intention was to OC and bring as much attention to yourself as possible I guess that would fulfill it's purpose. Definitely not something I'd do or recommend or been tempted to do myself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpringerXDacp View Post
    Next time, just stick a banana in it.

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    Lmao that'd be funny as hell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikestilly View Post
    If your intention was to OC and bring as much attention to yourself as possible I guess that would fulfill it's purpose. Definitely not something I'd do or recommend or been tempted to do myself.
    True. I dont want Attention

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    Re: empty holster stink eye?

    @Mike [...] DrTodd was commenting on the legal areas one can/should be able to open carry in MI. My post was a notice that there are activist judges that ignore the law so open carry in a sporting event, bar, etc.. maybe legal it is also important to know where you are at and what the judges in that area have done in the past to open carriers. [...] Since you are a man of conviction's I am sure you are more than willing to OC at a MSU sporting event correct?

    COMMENTS EDITED BY ADMINISTRATOR: Personal attack
    Last edited by John Pierce; 04-08-2013 at 09:03 AM.
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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pawn99 View Post
    True. I dont want Attention
    Two facts for your consideration. OCing has two, and only two benefits. One is drawing attention. Both to the pro gun cause, getting people talking, both to you and others. The other side of that attention is that it scares 99% of bad guys into wanting to get the hell out of your vicinity as fast as possible.

    The other fact is that mikestilly has himself made pro gun t shirts to take to events and sell. I would firmly stand behind the idea of a shirt that explains what you're doing and why, at least if you'd be comfortable wearing one, and I'm honestly rather surprised that mike isn't more into the idea.
    Last edited by Michigander; 04-07-2013 at 08:19 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ron73440 View Post
    Quick question, in MI you cannot carry where alcohol is sold?

    In NC you can't carry "where sold and consumed" which sucks bad enough, but that really sucks.
    Why do you think all the laws allowing carry with a permit are being put up here. It is not hard to figure out where the lobbyists are heading. Hopefully enough in NC wake up so we are not put in the position of wearing a empty holster. I did not know MI was being infringed upon in this way, it is sad and unfortunate.

    The KMart here does not sell alcohol, maybe the KMarts in MI do not either.

    BTW I OC a knife in Pizza Hut, and any other establishment where the alcohol restriction is in place. For some reason large knives get more attention(stares) than a handgun. I would suggest others carry a knife also in these circumstances. You will get the same statement across and still have some level of self defense.
    Last edited by WalkingWolf; 04-07-2013 at 11:20 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michigander View Post
    Two facts for your consideration. OCing has two, and only two benefits. One is drawing attention. Both to the pro gun cause, getting people talking, both to you and others. The other side of that attention is that it scares 99% of bad guys into wanting to get the hell out of your vicinity as fast as possible.

    The other fact is that mikestilly has himself made pro gun t shirts to take to events and sell. I would firmly stand behind the idea of a shirt that explains what you're doing and why, at least if you'd be comfortable wearing one, and I'm honestly rather surprised that mike isn't more into the idea.
    I read a great article and also a discussion on the Patriot channel with Wilkow on this very issue, which is OT and has nothing to do with the OP of this thread but I'll explain anyways.

    There is a time and a place to wear pro-gun t-shirts and I'm definitely not against them. It all depends on how flamboyant they are as to if they're the right shirt to wear while your actually open carrying in public.

    Pro gun yes but it was done in a thoughtful manner in which it didnt draw unnecessary attention to yourself, good for everyday use (pic of a Minuteman with the actual date of the ratification of the second amendment.) One that is made solely to bring attention to yourself alerting everyone that you're armed is not something I'd recommend because it brings unnecessary attention to yourself while you're open carrying in public. Lastly, this is only my opinion and I'm not telling anyone what to do. We are in a free country and while OCing people can do what they want. My opinion is if you OC with shirts that draw attention to the firearm you're carrying you will have far more negative encounters. I also feel there is a place and a time to wear those flamboyant shirts. Such as going to the range, or shooting in the back yard with your friends, or going to a 2A rally, etc, etc. As someone who open carries on a regular basis and has virtually zero "encounters" I feel wearing provocative shirts is not the way to do it while carrying a firearm while in public around town.


    I'll also condemn the personal attack post by AZ. I hope it's deleted. Typical BS of this forum.

    PS: There are people who open carry to bring as much attention to themselves as possible. As in that is their goal. They are many times the first people to run to forums to complain as to why they keep getting harassed. It is these very people that give open carry a bad name and are the reasons many time people and law enforcement feel people open carry in general is a bad thing. You cant ignore that this occurs.

    PPS: This isnt just limited to shirts either. You dress like a criminal, bum, shlub, you usually are treated like one. Yes I'd say its stereotyping but thats the way life is. A person with a suit an tie is taken more seriously and treated with more respect then a person with jeans with rips all over it, shoes with the laces trailing behind them, hat on backwards, and wearing a wifebeater shirt. It's a fact of life and if people dont understand those basics then you will not understand anything I'm trying to say.
    Last edited by mikestilly; 04-07-2013 at 12:00 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikestilly View Post
    If your intention was to OC and bring as much attention to yourself as possible I guess [the t-shrit idea mentioned above] would fulfill it's purpose. Definitely not something I'd do or recommend or been tempted to do myself.
    Oh? Why not? For heaven's sake, I'm openly carrying a gun in order to draw attention to and promote the basic human right of self-defense. How on earth am I wrong wearing a t-shirt so even more people see it?

    I've seen the NRA t-shirts in public. And, the Don't Tread on Me t-shirts. And, even a couple From My Cold Dead Hands t-shirts. None put their money where their mouth was and OCd at the same time. I would be taking their promotion, and actually doing the bearing of arms they claim to support.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

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    Regular Member Michigander's Avatar
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    If the message was more obnoxious, like "from my cold dead hands you liberal *****!" I could see what you are saying, mike.

    In the context of the message brought up earlier, the message is polite, direct, and unless the person is insane, a felon, a drug user, or a child, it's true. It would prevent someone from connecting the dots in their head to "oh that must be an off duty/plain clothes guard or cop." Adding in "ask me for more information" would make it even better.
    Last edited by Michigander; 04-07-2013 at 03:59 PM.

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    Re: empty holster stink eye?

    Either one supports right's or they do not. No grey area there. From the post of some that proclaim from on high that they are the authority on the 2A. They clearly are conflicted. I support all rights, not just the ones that are ok in my book. You want to wear a shirt that says SCREW guns! Ok by me: it's your right, that many have died for. Likewise someone wants to wear a OC shirt - I support their right to freedom of expression. Funny how some want to pick & choose what rights matter....
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