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Thread: Open carry in Florida?

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    Open carry in Florida?

    I have read that the NRA plans to push a bill in Florida that will allow concealed firearm license holders to openly carry a firearm in public. I myself am a concealed carrier but i am not sure how I would feel about everyone being able to expose their firearms in public. Anyone know some pros and cons to being able to open carry?

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    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by major91 View Post
    I have read that the NRA plans to push a bill in Florida that will allow concealed firearm license holders to openly carry a firearm in public. I myself am a concealed carrier but i am not sure how I would feel about everyone being able to expose their firearms in public. Anyone know some pros and cons to being able to open carry?
    Where did you read that. I would be shocked to see the NRA pushing an open carry bill. The pros and cons to carry are your own. Carry how you are comfortable. I prefer open carry, its more comfortable for me and it is a better deterrent IMO. I do not buy into the excuses of open carry that your a target or you scare people. Its my right I carry how I am comfortable. I do not care if you cc or oc that's a personal choice, just carry.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by major91 View Post
    I have read that the NRA plans to push a bill in Florida that will allow concealed firearm license holders to openly carry a firearm in public. I myself am a concealed carrier but i am not sure how I would feel about everyone being able to expose their firearms in public. Anyone know some pros and cons to being able to open carry?
    Welcome to the forum and for asking questions and researching this issue! You will quickly find many threads that answer your questions and expose many of the false myths about open carry.

    I was recently in Florida for vacation, and it was weird being forced to conceal my firearm the entire time.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Quote Originally Posted by conandan View Post
    Where did you read that. I would be shocked to see the NRA pushing an open carry bill. The pros and cons to carry are your own. Carry how you are comfortable. I prefer open carry, its more comfortable for me and it is a better deterrent IMO. I do not buy into the excuses of open carry that your a target or you scare people. Its my right I carry how I am comfortable. I do not care if you cc or oc that's a personal choice, just carry.
    http://www.tampabay.com/news/politic...lorida/1244820

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    Regular Member Phoenix David's Avatar
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    Does me carrying an M&P .45 in a Crossbreed SuperTuck under a polo shirt make me any more or less dangerous then if I tuck the polo shirt behind the gun?

    But..But someone will run up and kill you and take the gun away from you. Sure that's possible but so statistically unlikely.

    It used to be the other way around where good men always open carried and only scoundrels had them concealed.
    Freedom is a bit like sex, when your getting it you take it for granted, when you're not you want it bad, other people get mad at you for having it and others want to take it away from you so only they have it.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by conandan View Post
    Where did you read that. I would be shocked to see the NRA pushing an open carry bill. ...
    Me, too. Looks like here is why: "Hammer said the bill is necessary to protect such gun owners from harassment by police when they accidentally reveal concealed weapons in public."

    I'm still not sure if it is the full NRA or just their state affiliate, which the media might just label as the "NRA." This is also from last summer. Didn't FL just get some relaxing on this issue for accidental exposure?
    Last edited by MAC702; 04-08-2013 at 09:59 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by major91 View Post
    I have read that the NRA plans to push a bill in Florida that will allow concealed firearm license holders to openly carry a firearm in public. --snipped--
    Cite (source) to credible publication, please.
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    Originally Published: Wednesday, August 8, 2012 1:40pm

    That was before the current mess.

    No legislator in Florida will sponsor any pro-gun laws this year.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    Originally Published: Wednesday, August 8, 2012 1:40pm

    That was before the current mess.

    No legislator in Florida will sponsor any pro-gun laws this year.
    My bad - it was hiding in plain view

    Now I am confused though as the linked article shows a date of Monday, April 8, 2013 .

    State Sen. Greg Evers, a Republican running for re-election in a Panhandle district, was the 2011 bill's main sponsor in the Senate. If he's still in Tallahassee next year, Evers said, he would enthusiastically support a new bill, based on ongoing allegations that police are harassing concealed-weapon licensees.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

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    Regular Member conandan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Me, too. Looks like here is why: "Hammer said the bill is necessary to protect such gun owners from harassment by police when they accidentally reveal concealed weapons in public."

    I'm still not sure if it is the full NRA or just their state affiliate, which the media might just label as the "NRA." This is also from last summer. Didn't FL just get some relaxing on this issue for accidental exposure?
    Yes they changed the law so you can't be arrested for printing or accidentally exposing your gun. But some LEOS will still give you a hard time and try to site you for something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by conandan View Post
    Yes they changed the law so you can't be arrested for printing or accidentally exposing your gun. But some LEOS will still give you a hard time and try to site you for something.
    That's funny.

    It it not now, nor has it even been, illegal to expose a concealed firearm. (Unless, of course, that exposure is in a careless/threatening manner or during the commission of a crime.)

    That bill was originally written to allow licensed Open Carry, period. Due to the shenanigans of several of our 2nd amendment loving Sheriffs and members of the Florida Senate, and the complete lack of spine on the part of the NRA, we got what we got: The introduction of an undefined statutory term 'brief'. This introduced ambiguity into the law that did not exist prior and now creates a situation where different LEOs interpretation of that undefined term will (has) result(ed) in more arrests than before it's passage.

    The change in the law, arguably, made it easier to be arrested for exposure of a concealed firearm.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    That's funny.

    It it not now, nor has it even been, illegal to expose a concealed firearm. (Unless, of course, that exposure is in a careless/threatening manner or during the commission of a crime.)

    That bill was originally written to allow licensed Open Carry, period. Due to the shenanigans of several of our 2nd amendment loving Sheriffs and members of the Florida Senate, and the complete lack of spine on the part of the NRA, we got what we got: The introduction of an undefined statutory term 'brief'. This introduced ambiguity into the law that did not exist prior and now creates a situation where different LEOs interpretation of that undefined term will (has) result(ed) in more arrests than before it's passage.

    The change in the law, arguably, made it easier to be arrested for exposure of a concealed firearm.
    No, the law never read that "exposing a normally-lawfully-concealed firearm is unlawful", but another law did read that (outside of certain exceptions which are the subject of another discussion) the open-carrying of a firearm was indeed unlawful. If a normally-concealed firearm was "exposed", even if only for a second, it was seen as "openly-carried" for that period, and therefore unlawful. It is not possible for something to be "exposed" and "concealed" at the same time.

    The passage of SB234, as mentioned, did indeed "de-criminalize" the "brief" exposure of a normally-lawfully-concealed firearm, as you noted. Also, as you noted, the definition of "brief" has not been laid out, and I am not aware of any court cases that are likely to set a precedent for determining it. I agree that one is likely coming.

    As far as "more arrests being made" is concerned, I feel that this is due, at least in part, to many CWFL-holders "pushing the envelope" more, and also due to an influx of newly-licensed carriers who "rushed through" their licensing process in the years following the 2008 presidential race/election, and have not become as "refined" in their carry practices as more experienced armed persons have become.
    Last edited by MedWheeler; 04-10-2013 at 07:32 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MedWheeler View Post
    No, the law never read that "exposing a normally-lawfully-concealed firearm is unlawful", but another law did read that (outside of certain exceptions which are the subject of another discussion) the open-carrying of a firearm was indeed unlawful. If a normally-concealed firearm was "exposed", even if only for a second, it was seen as "openly-carried" for that period, and therefore unlawful. It is not possible for something to be "exposed" and "concealed" at the same time.

    The passage of SB234, as mentioned, did indeed "de-criminalize" the "brief" exposure of a normally-lawfully-concealed firearm, as you noted. Also, as you noted, the definition of "brief" has not been laid out, and I am not aware of any court cases that are likely to set a precedent for determining it. I agree that one is likely coming.

    As far as "more arrests being made" is concerned, I feel that this is due, at least in part, to many CWFL-holders "pushing the envelope" more, and also due to an influx of newly-licensed carriers who "rushed through" their licensing process in the years following the 2008 presidential race/election, and have not become as "refined" in their carry practices as more experienced armed persons have become.
    You should really go read some case law on the topic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    You should really go read some case law on the topic.
    Would love to ...

    How about some cites?
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    Quote Originally Posted by notalawyer View Post
    You should really go read some case law on the topic.
    Care to steer me in the right direction, or would you rather remain adversarial?

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    Quote Originally Posted by MedWheeler View Post
    Care to steer me in the right direction, or would you rather remain adversarial?
    Sorry...after I posted that I went looking for my case law links I keep but that file is on another computer that died on me a couple weeks ago. Have not had time to recover it yet. As soon as I do, I'll post them.

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    ^^ Okay. Might be a few days before I can get back here, so take your time. I do know of several cases of persons either having charges dismissed or being acquitted, but all the ones I know of were due to other reasons, and not because it was determined that the "open display" of the gun in question was, in fact, within legal limits.

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