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Thread: weight of law

  1. #1
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    weight of law

    hey guys, i knew this has been argued before. but i tried searching for it, and couldn't find anything

    i am trying to get the guys on NCGO to realize that a "no gun" sign in NC has no weight of law. in other words the owner must tell you leave weather he has a sign or not, and the only thing you could be charged with is if you refuse to leave, is trespass. which is a class II misdemeanor. it has nothing to do with the gun at the most you would pay is a fine. they can not or refuse to tell me what you would be charged with

    if you disagree with this please let me know and why you think this.
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  2. #2
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by papa bear View Post
    hey guys, i knew this has been argued before. but i tried searching for it, and couldn't find anything

    i am trying to get the guys on NCGO to realize that a "no gun" sign in NC has no weight of law. in other words the owner must tell you leave weather he has a sign or not, and the only thing you could be charged with is if you refuse to leave, is trespass. which is a class II misdemeanor. it has nothing to do with the gun at the most you would pay is a fine. they can not or refuse to tell me what you would be charged with

    if you disagree with this please let me know and why you think this.
    I agree completely for OC. Anyone that is CC when a sign is "conspicuously" posted, could be charged (with or without verbal notification) per 14‑415.11 Now what is "conspicuously" posted?? No definition is given in the statute...so I guess it must be easily seen and shown that you did see it, IMO.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Kwik Stix's Avatar
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    weight of law

    Im very interested in this as well.


    Sent from my *******

  4. #4
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Trespass in NCGS

    First and Second Degree Trespass statute:

    14‑159.11. Definition.
    As used in this Article, "building" means any structure or part of a structure, other than a conveyance, enclosed so as to permit reasonable entry only through a door and roofed to protect it from the elements. (1987, c. 700, s. 1.)

    14‑159.12. First degree trespass.
    (a) Offense. A person commits the offense of first degree trespass if, without authorization, he enters or remains:
    (1) On premises of another so enclosed or secured as to demonstrate clearly an intent to keep out intruders; or
    (2) In a building of another.
    (b) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (c) or (d) of this section, first degree trespass is a Class 2 misdemeanor.
    (c) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (d) of this section, a violation of subsection (a) of this section is a Class A1 misdemeanor if all of the following circumstances exist:
    (1) The offense is committed on the premises of any of the following:
    a. A facility that is owned or operated by an electric power supplier as defined in G.S. 62‑133.8(a)(3) and that is either an electric generation facility, a transmission substation, a transmission switching station, a transmission switching structure, or a control center used to manage transmission operations or electrical power generating at multiple plant locations.
    b. Any facility used or available for use in the collection, treatment, testing, storing, pumping, or distribution of water for a public water system.
    c. Any facility, including any liquefied natural gas storage facility or propane air facility, that is owned or operated by a natural gas local distribution company, natural gas pipeline carrier operating under a certificate of public convenience and necessity from the Utilities Commission, municipal corporation operating a municipally owned gas distribution system, or regional natural gas district organized and operated pursuant to Article 28 of Chapter 160A of the General Statutes used for transmission, distribution, measurement, testing, regulating, compression, control, or storage of natural gas.
    (2) The person actually entered a building, or it was necessary for the person to climb over, go under, or otherwise surmount a fence or other barrier to reach the facility.
    (d) If, in addition to the circumstances set out in subsection (c) of this section, the violation also includes any of the following elements, then the offense is a Class H felony:
    (1) The offense is committed with the intent to disrupt the normal operation of any of the facilities described in subdivision (1) of subsection (c) of this section.
    (2) The offense involves an act that places either the offender or others on the premises at risk of serious bodily injury.
    (e) As used in subsections (c) and (d) of this section, the term "facility" shall mean a building or other infrastructure. (1987, c. 700, s. 1; 1993, c. 539, s. 101; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c); 2012‑168, s. 1.)

    14‑159.13. Second degree trespass.
    (a) Offense. A person commits the offense of second degree trespass if, without authorization, he enters or remains on premises of another:
    (1) After he has been notified not to enter or remain there by the owner, by a person in charge of the premises, by a lawful occupant, or by another authorized person; or
    (2) That are posted, in a manner reasonably likely to come to the attention of intruders, with notice not to enter the premises.
    (b) Classification. Second degree trespass is a Class 3 misdemeanor. (1987, c. 700, s. 1; 1993, c. 539, s. 102; 1994, Ex. Sess., c. 24, s. 14(c).)

    14‑159.14. Lesser included offenses.

    The offenses created by this act shall constitute lesser included offenses of breaking or entering as provided in G.S. 14‑54 and G.S. 14‑56. (1987, c. 700, s. 1.)
    I suppose the major question I would have is given the part highlighted in red, can a sign posted prohibit a "class" of people, namely, people carrying a firearm, or unaccompanied minors, etc. ? If not, then I would say that any sign other than a general "no trespassing" sign would have NO weight of law and only the express communication from the people authorized above could generate a trespass charge. But, IANAL.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolina guy View Post
    First and Second Degree Trespass statute:



    I suppose the major question I would have is given the part highlighted in red, can a sign posted prohibit a "class" of people, namely, people carrying a firearm, or unaccompanied minors, etc. ? If not, then I would say that any sign other than a general "no trespassing" sign would have NO weight of law and only the express communication from the people authorized above could generate a trespass charge. But, IANAL.
    People put up no solicitor signs ... go to your local courthouse and do some research. Interesting query.

  6. #6
    Regular Member papa bear's Avatar
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    CAROLINAGUY. one of the criteria for weather or not there is weight of law, is what would you be charged with. i have never heard of anyone being charged with walking past a sign. which brings us back to the fact that you will get charged with trespass. which you have to refuse to leave, which the owner would have to have you charged, which he would have to tell you in the first place.

    there is actually no mention of violation in the law.
    Luke 22:36 ; 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    "guns are like a Parachute, if you don't have one when you need it, you will not need one again"
    - unknown

    i you call a CHP a CCW then you are really stupid. period.

  7. #7
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    I also see the word "intruders" .. clearly a potential patron is not an intruder, correct?

  8. #8
    Regular Member carolina guy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    I also see the word "intruders" .. clearly a potential patron is not an intruder, correct?
    That would be my take from it.
    If something is wrong for ONE person to do to another, it is still wrong if a BILLION people do it.

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