HB 436 Wording

I was reading HB 436 today and came upon the following:


" 3. (1) All federal acts, laws, orders, rules, and regulations, whether past, present, or future, which infringe on the people's right to keep and bear arms as guaranteed by the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution and Article I, Section 23 of the Missouri Constitution shall be invalid in this state, shall not be recognized by this state, shall be specifically rejected by this state, and shall be considered null and void and of no effect in this state.
(2) Such federal acts, laws, orders, rules, and regulations include, but are not limited to:
(a) The provisions of the federal Gun Control Act of 1934;
(b) The provisions of the federal Gun Control Act of 1968;"

Does that mean such laws as not owning a submachine gun without a proper license ( as outlined in Gun Control Act of 1934) will no longer be enforced in the state of Missouri? I must be missing something...

My understanding is, if it is made and sold in Missouri and stays in Missouri it is not subject to Federal Law. The idea is "States Rights".

logunowner said:

I was reading HB 436 today and came upon the following:


" 3. (1) All federal acts, laws, orders, rules, and regulations, whether past, present, or future, which infringe on the people's right to keep and bear arms as guaranteed by the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution and Article I, Section 23 of the Missouri Constitution shall be invalid in this state, shall not be recognized by this state, shall be specifically rejected by this state, and shall be considered null and void and of no effect in this state.
(2) Such federal acts, laws, orders, rules, and regulations include, but are not limited to:
(a) The provisions of the federal Gun Control Act of 1934;
(b) The provisions of the federal Gun Control Act of 1968;"

Does that mean such laws as not owning a submachine gun without a proper license ( as outlined in Gun Control Act of 1934) will no longer be enforced in the state of Missouri? I must be missing something...

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Thanks for your post. That is what I was missing, you are exactly right. I joined the forum after meeting you at the Senate Hearing on 436. If you remember my wife and I were there.

logunowner said:

Thanks for your post. That is what I was missing, you are exactly right. I joined the forum after meeting you at the Senate Hearing on 436. If you remember my wife and I were there.

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I do remember. I am so appreciative of all who took the time to go. This is the week it will pass the House and go to the Governor. I hope after the bill actually becomes law someone will plan an of event soem place central like Columbia or jefferson City the weekend after the bill becomes law. It would be great to see so many Ocers in one place.

mspgunner said:

I do remember. I am so appreciative of all who took the time to go. This is the week it will pass the House and go to the Governor. I hope after the bill actually becomes law someone will plan an of event soem place central like Columbia or jefferson City the weekend after the bill becomes law. It would be great to see so many Ocers in one place.

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That would be a great idea. I live at the lake but would be willing to do what I could. Would it be as simple as starting a thread? I would be willing to get a hold of like Ria's in Jeff City and making arrangements for a group to show up after their lunch hour traffic has cleared. Thoughts?

logunowner said:

That would be a great idea. I live at the lake but would be willing to do what I could. Would it be as simple as starting a thread? I would be willing to get a hold of like Ria's in Jeff City and making arrangements for a group to show up after their lunch hour traffic has cleared. Thoughts?

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There is a lot of time! The bill, if it passes won't go into effect till Aug. 28th! Personally I like Ria's, that weekend migh tbe good. I wouldn't jump on it yet!

mspgunner said:

There is a lot of time! The bill, if it passes won't go into effect till Aug. 28th! Personally I like Ria's, that weekend migh tbe good. I wouldn't jump on it yet!

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Just let me know if you need help, I'm just a Johnny come lately that is willing to help if I can.

mspgunner said:

someone will plan an of event soem place central like Columbia or jefferson City the weekend after the bill becomes law. It would be great to see so many Ocers in one place.

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I was thinking about trying to make something happen in St Louis, since it'd be relatively new ground for OC. But I understand it's also a drive that a lot of people here can't make, so COMO or Lake Ozark or something would be more central.

Oramac said:

I was thinking about trying to make something happen in St Louis, since it'd be relatively new ground for OC. But I understand it's also a drive that a lot of people here can't make, so COMO or Lake Ozark or something would be more central.

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Oh man, please do. I don't want to be the only guy (with my girlfriend, the only gal) in St. Louis carrying openly.

Oramac said:

I was thinking about trying to make something happen in St Louis, since it'd be relatively new ground for OC. But I understand it's also a drive that a lot of people here can't make, so COMO or Lake Ozark or something would be more central.

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"We", the gang of radical OCers who thought up this crazy freedom idea, mostly from the STL area are planning to get together the night of the 27th of August and come midnight to ring in the 28th (If the law gos into effect that day) at perhaps Steak-N-Shake in Maryland Heights were we met many times before Maryland Heights prohibited OC. The place was good about it, never had any problems. It is centrally located for STL and St. Charles Co. people with easy access for both. There is a lot of time still....... But it seems like a reasonable place to ring in our new found freedom.

mspgunner said:

"We", the gang of radical OCers who thought up this crazy freedom idea, mostly from the STL area are planning to get together the night of the 27th of August and come midnight to ring in the 28th (If the law gos into effect that day) at perhaps Steak-N-Shake in Maryland Heights were we met many times before Maryland Heights prohibited OC. The place was good about it, never had any problems. It is centrally located for STL and St. Charles Co. people with easy access for both. There is a lot of time still....... But it seems like a reasonable place to ring in our new found freedom.

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Midnight Milkshake? I'll be there! Might even dust off the ole Camaro for it!

mspgunner said:

"We", the gang of radical OCers who thought up this crazy freedom idea, mostly from the STL area are planning to get together the night of the 27th of August and come midnight to ring in the 28th (If the law gos into effect that day) at perhaps Steak-N-Shake in Maryland Heights were we met many times before Maryland Heights prohibited OC. The place was good about it, never had any problems. It is centrally located for STL and St. Charles Co. people with easy access for both. There is a lot of time still....... But it seems like a reasonable place to ring in our new found freedom.

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Just make sure all those "OCers" have a valid CCW or they will be in violation of the the local prohibition on openly displayed firearms. Enjoy your new priviledge, you worked hard for it.

mspgunner said:

But it seems like a reasonable place to ring in our new found freedom.

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Not to split hairs or anything, but doesn't the new law say that you have to have a permit or endorsement to carry in cities that ban OC? While I think this is a great step for Missouri, OC is still regulated.

acmariner99 said:

Not to split hairs or anything, but doesn't the new law say that you have to have a permit or endorsement to carry in cities that ban OC? While I think this is a great step for Missouri, OC is still regulated.

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Does no one around here know how to celebrate a win?

Nothing against you personally, it's just that I keep seeing this posted. Obviously we all know that it is still slightly regulated. But steps are what get you to where you are going.

You can look at a tall staircase and take one step at a time until you get to the top, or you can just say "I can jump straight to the top from the bottom". Well, the end result of that method is that you make it half the way up with your jump, smash your face on the banister because you over reached, and then slide all the way back down to the bottom where you originally where, left all bloody and bruised and having accomplished nothing.

Big Boy said:

Does no one around here know how to celebrate a win?

Nothing against you personally, it's just that I keep seeing this posted. Obviously we all know that it is still slightly regulated. But steps are what get you to where you are going.

You can look at a tall staircase and take one step at a time until you get to the top, or you can just say "I can jump straight to the top from the bottom". Well, the end result of that method is that you make it half the way up with your jump, smash your face on the banister because you over reached, and then slide all the way back down to the bottom where you originally where, left all bloody and bruised and having accomplished nothing.

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How, exactly, is this a win for OC? OC does not require a permit in MO. OC does not require a background check in MO. OC does not require you be fingerprinted in MO. OC does not require you renew anything every 3 years in MO. OC does not require any of these things in MO because OC in MO is a right . This is the same bill that I opposed last year, because all it does is expand the privileges of CCW holders. It does not protect the rights of MO citizens to exercise their rights unhindered. Please explain how having to pay to exercise rights is a win in your book.

As far as "steps" go, those who worked to get this done have said their work is done. They are satisfied with this legislation and will see no reason to go for full preemption. Unfortunately, they have left real OC in a hole it will have to climb out of. How much harder will it now be to get legislators to listen about preemption, when in their minds the problem has already been addressed?

So, please forgive those of us who opposed this legislation last year, if we aren't doing cartwheels now. It's just that our true goal may have been pushed farther away in the name of progress.

SavageOne said:

How, exactly, is this a win for OC? OC does not require a permit in MO. OC does not require a background check in MO. OC does not require you be fingerprinted in MO. OC does not require you renew anything every 3 years in MO. OC does not require any of these things in MO because OC in MO is a right . This is the same bill that I opposed last year, because all it does is expand the privileges of CCW holders. It does not protect the rights of MO citizens to exercise their rights unhindered. Please explain how having to pay to exercise rights is a win in your book.

As far as "steps" go, those who worked to get this done have said their work is done. They are satisfied with this legislation and will see no reason to go for full preemption. Unfortunately, they have left real OC in a hole it will have to climb out of. How much harder will it now be to get legislators to listen about preemption, when in their minds the problem has already been addressed?

So, please forgive those of us who opposed this legislation last year, if we aren't doing cartwheels now. It's just that our true goal may have been pushed farther away in the name of progress.

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The wheels move slow in JC . I'd suggest getting in there now, making contacts, and getting your foot in the door. It ain't easy, but I'm sure you have thought about all that before stepping up to the plate to gain us our rights back. This year we got what we could. People will be able to OC in the cities that prohibit such with a CCW. That's more than we had, and I consider more than we had progress. Is it perfect? Not by a long shot. Am I "happy" with it? Not as happy as I would be if it were as it should be, legal everywhere. I am happy we got "something" , and like was said, it takes steps, you don't just jump to the top.

I'm sorry "we" didn't get what "you" wanted, but I don't recall "you" ever being in the hearings or the meetings we had before going in to the hearings. I'm bad with names, so forgive me if I overlooked you one or more of those times, but that would have been the time to discuss with the Senators, in their office, what "you" wanted. They would tell "you" what was possible, like they did us.

"You" can sit on a forum and complain "you" didn't get what "you" wanted, or "you" can go try to get what "you" can. There are a lot of internet commandos here that like to complain about what "they" want, but are too damn lazy to actually do something about it. I'm sure you are not the latter since "you" seem so passionate about the cause.

From your post, I'm assuming next year we will be getting updates from "you" on the next step in open carry.

Thanks, and good luck.

SavageOne said:

How, exactly, is this a win for OC? OC does not require a permit in MO. OC does not require a background check in MO. OC does not require you be fingerprinted in MO. OC does not require you renew anything every 3 years in MO. OC does not require any of these things in MO because OC in MO is a right . This is the same bill that I opposed last year, because all it does is expand the privileges of CCW holders. It does not protect the rights of MO citizens to exercise their rights unhindered. Please explain how having to pay to exercise rights is a win in your book.

As far as "steps" go, those who worked to get this done have said their work is done. They are satisfied with this legislation and will see no reason to go for full preemption. Unfortunately, they have left real OC in a hole it will have to climb out of. How much harder will it now be to get legislators to listen about preemption, when in their minds the problem has already been addressed?

So, please forgive those of us who opposed this legislation last year, if we aren't doing cartwheels now. It's just that our true goal may have been pushed farther away in the name of progress.

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Would you please let me know where you can legally OC in Missouri on August 27th, that you will not be on August 28th? If there is no such place, then you have been left uninjured. But, there will be 163,000 of us that will be able to carry in places we weren't before. Is it perfect, no. The question is what are you going to do about it?

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Exactly why I wil no longer post on the MSSA forum, whine, complain and "WE WANT , WE WANT". Get off you @ss and go to jefferson City and tell them what "WE WANT". We did and we took what we could get. Yes, there was a premption Bill that passed committee and went no where!!! This bill does nothing to infringe on open carriers where OC is legal without a CCW. It does allow OC where OC is prohibited by local laws.

If you think you can do better get your tail down to jefferson City and see what "WE WANT, WE WANT can get. There is a good chnace for premption next year if you "WE WANT, WE WANT", WILL WORK FOR IT.
OC preemption is th enext logical step, do hundreds of hours of volunteer wwork, contribute a lot of money to candiadtes, go to fund raisers.... You may just get want you want. It simply may happennext year regardless because it is not an election year and the same group of players will still be there.
HB4376 is NOT a done deal yet, it is not a law:
Status of HB436 (2nd amendment preservation act): To the Governor and

This from The Speaker of the House to me today (FYI)...
Bills that have been truly Agreed to and Finally Passed are signed by Speakers of the House and Senate on May 22nd and then go to the Governor for signature or veto. The Governor has 45 days after the end of session to sign or return a bill. The effective date of signed bills is 90 days after the end of session for bills. Bills that have already been signed by the Governor are those that the Speakers have selected and then have been sent to the Governor. I hope this makes sense. Please let me know if you have any further questions.


Festus, myself and three others worked like dogs, took time off of work and did the best we could to get what we could. Speaking for myself, if this becomes law I'm done with working for 2A rights in Jefferson City. The whiners and crying team can go on with "WE WANT, WE WANT". If nothing else WE WANT you have not made friends with the "WE DOs WE DOs", who worked for three years to get the amendment we are working on.
Good luck WE WANTS............

Festus_Hagen said:

The wheels move slow in JC . I'd suggest getting in there now, making contacts, and getting your foot in the door. It ain't easy, but I'm sure you have thought about all that before stepping up to the plate to gain us our rights back. This year we got what we could. People will be able to OC in the cities that prohibit such with a CCW. That's more than we had, and I consider more than we had progress. Is it perfect? Not by a long shot. Am I "happy" with it? Not as happy as I would be if it were as it should be, legal everywhere. I am happy we got "something" , and like was said, it takes steps, you don't just jump to the top.

I'm sorry "we" didn't get what "you" wanted, but I don't recall "you" ever being in the hearings or the meetings we had before going in to the hearings. I'm bad with names, so forgive me if I overlooked you one or more of those times, but that would have been the time to discuss with the Senators, in their office, what "you" wanted. They would tell "you" what was possible, like they did us.

"You" can sit on a forum and complain "you" didn't get what "you" wanted, or "you" can go try to get what "you" can. There are a lot of internet commandos here that like to complain about what "they" want, but are too damn lazy to actually do something about it. I'm sure you are not the latter since "you" seem so passionate about the cause.

From your post, I'm assuming next year we will be getting updates from "you" on the next step in open carry.

Thanks, and good luck.

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SavageOne said:

How, exactly, is this a win for OC? OC does not require a permit in MO. OC does not require a background check in MO. OC does not require you be fingerprinted in MO. OC does not require you renew anything every 3 years in MO. OC does not require any of these things in MO because OC in MO is a right . This is the same bill that I opposed last year, because all it does is expand the privileges of CCW holders. It does not protect the rights of MO citizens to exercise their rights unhindered. Please explain how having to pay to exercise rights is a win in your book.

As far as "steps" go, those who worked to get this done have said their work is done. They are satisfied with this legislation and will see no reason to go for full preemption. Unfortunately, they have left real OC in a hole it will have to climb out of. How much harder will it now be to get legislators to listen about preemption, when in their minds the problem has already been addressed?

So, please forgive those of us who opposed this legislation last year, if we aren't doing cartwheels now. It's just that our true goal may have been pushed farther away in the name of progress.

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OC still DOES NOT REQUIRE A CCW to exercise the right. Any city that previously did not have laws against OC will be exactly the same as they were before the law. For example, if in Kansas City and Open Carrying, if I get asked for ID I can still say no, because OC is not illegal there. However if I'm in some city like Maplewood that has banned Open Carry, I can still carry. If the cop asks, I will show him my CCW.

Would we prefer it to be completely legal without a ccw in all states? Yes, but that goes back to the steps we're taking.

The only difference will be open carrier's EXPANDED rights to carry against city ordinances that ban OC, as long as they have a CCW.

So, yep, you're right, us being able to carry openly in any city in Missouri is definitely a step backwards :boggled eyes:

Tell me how the fact that we can now OC in cities that previously banned it (after law passes) hinder any rights of OC'ers?

Did you read the bill before you posted here? My guess is no, and that you simply assumed you must have a CCW to OC in ANY part of MO, which is not true.

SavageOne said:

So, please forgive those of us who opposed this legislation last year, if we aren't doing cartwheels now. It's just that our true goal may have been pushed farther away in the name of progress.

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Are you mental ?
Do you have some reading comprehension issues ?

The right to Open Carry in Missouri has been EXPANDED into areas heretofore prohibited.
Is it Constitutional Carry - No, but perhaps you would like to spearhead that ?

IF NOT, please **** and say THANK YOU to those who have worked so hard on your UNGRATEFUL behalf. They have brought you a step closer to what YOU want. Idiot.