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Thread: Cleveland gun buy back

  1. #1
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    Cleveland gun buy back

    Date is Saturday June 15,2013 at public safety central located at 2100 Payne Avenue. They are offering $100 Target or gas gift cards for handguns, $200 target or gas gift cards for semi auto rifles (AR's); pending on if they are operable. They will also be giving a pair of Lake Erie monsters and cavs tickets. Other guns can be turned in (ie bolt action, lever action, shotguns,etc.) but no incentives will be given. Ill be out in front with cash stopping people from getting them melted down. Who else will be there?

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    Regular Member NEOOpenCarry's Avatar
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    I don't want to commit yet, but we are meeting in two weeks to set a date for our Cleveland OC walk, and I will definitely bring this date up as a possibility. I'm sure some of our members would be willing to pick up a few guns to keep them from getting melted. I will let you know.
    “Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.” - Thomas Jefferson

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    Re: Cleveland gun buy back

    Funny I was just wondering when ours would be....this gives me some time to save up for it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by NEOOpenCarry View Post
    I don't want to commit yet, but we are meeting in two weeks to set a date for our Cleveland OC walk, and I will definitely bring this date up as a possibility. I'm sure some of our members would be willing to pick up a few guns to keep them from getting melted. I will let you know.
    Excellent idea! If I am off that day, I will participate in the walk. Maybe I can pick up a nice bargain in the process!

    On edit: Be careful, though, of city officials grabbing your OCed firearm and replacing it with a gift card!
    Last edited by eye95; 05-06-2013 at 09:04 AM.

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    Accomplished Advocate BB62's Avatar
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    Be aware, the CPD can (will) threaten you with charges if you "interfere" with their "buyback".
    Last edited by BB62; 05-06-2013 at 10:22 AM.

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    I'm definitely interested in a Cleveland OC walk! Also, bb62 wouldn't it be unlawful to interfere with us saving the guns if we are on public property? It's a private party transfer and also ill be running the serial numbers of any guns I come across to buy. Having the walk on the same day as the buyback would be a good "coincidence" :P

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    Accomplished Advocate BB62's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jordysoso View Post
    I'm definitely interested in a Cleveland OC walk! Also, bb62 wouldn't it be unlawful to interfere with us saving the guns if we are on public property? It's a private party transfer and also ill be running the serial numbers of any guns I come across to buy. Having the walk on the same day as the buyback would be a good "coincidence" :P
    Oh, they won't necessarily do it directly... "You have a vendor's license? I thought not. Move on please."

    My point is that I can almost guarantee you that they will mess with you. You have to decide what to do when it happens.

    And YES, I love the idea of an OC walk coinciding with the "buyback". I go back to suggestions I've made elsewhere, though - get their policies for handling open carriers via a records request ahead of time. They may or may not hassle a group OCing - but remember, this is the city that fought the notion that preemption applied to them!

    Alternately, because I think that OC group walks, unless they're in reaction to something, or celebrate an occasion, don't necessarily accomplish anything as far as establishing the acceptability of OCing without interference.
    Last edited by BB62; 05-06-2013 at 01:20 PM.

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    Regular Member NEOOpenCarry's Avatar
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    How hard would it be to get a vendors license there? I have no idea of the process. How funny would that be though? Officer: "Sir unless you have a vendors license, move on!" Me: "I do infact have a vendors license sir. Who wants an extra 50 bucks for their gun??" As the line completely shifts over to me ;-)
    “Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.” - Thomas Jefferson

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    A vendor is a seller. I'd be buying.

    Just do the OC walk carrying a sign saying that you are in the market for a gun. If a private sale happens to spring up on the spot, so be it.

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    First off there is power in numbers. I doubt they will make 30+ people leave. And to be a vendor you have to be selling something. I'd be buying for personal use, not resale. If the cops think I have intent to resale, it won't matter because they cannot prove it. But nonetheless I'm excited for the walk and buy back

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    Quote Originally Posted by BB62 View Post
    Be aware, the CPD can (will) threaten you with charges if you "interfere" with their "buyback".
    Have multiple video cameras going and a lawyer on standby if you can, maybe contact a pro-gun lawyer and invite him to come along.

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    Quote Originally Posted by F350 View Post
    Have multiple video cameras going and a lawyer on standby if you can, maybe contact a pro-gun lawyer and invite him to come along.
    I plan on trying to bring a few sheriffs. I know a few that would love to go to this. But a lawyer present is a good idea too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    A vendor is a seller. I'd be buying.

    Just do the OC walk carrying a sign saying that you are in the market for a gun. If a private sale happens to spring up on the spot, so be it.
    Yes, I read the Cleveland ordinances on "vendors licenses" and it by definition only applies to people selling or bartering wares. It has no provisions to deal with those specifically purchasing. It's an item definitely in our favor. I searched the entire code for key words such as "solicit" and the only applicable item came for this vendor license section. It doesn't apply to purchasing.

    http://www.amlegal.com/nxt/gateway.dll/Ohio/cleveland_oh/cityofclevelandohiocodeofordinances?f=templates$fn =default.htm$3.0$vid=amlegal:cleveland_oh

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    The next thing Cleveland will do is say you are soliciting. And without case law, it could be an issue....

    http://www.amlegal.com/nxt/gateway.dll/Ohio/cleveland_oh/partsixoffensesandbusinessactivitiescode/titleigeneraloffenses/chapter605-disorderlyconductandactivity?f=templates$fn=docume nt-frame.htm$3.0#JD_605.031

    “Solicit” or “soliciting” means to request an immediate donation of money or other thing of value from another person, regardless of the solicitor’s purpose or intended use of the money or other thing of value. The solicitation may be, without limitation, by the spoken, written, or printed word, by gesture or by other means of communication.

    You are requesting and "other thing of value" therefore you are soliciting. Now, you can only be guilty if you do it....

    (1) In an aggressive manner;
    (2) Within twenty (20) feet of any automated-teller machine without the consent of the owner or other person legally in possession of the machine, provided, however, that when an automated- teller machine is located within an automated-teller machine facility, the distance shall be measured from the entrance or exit of the automated-teller machine facility;
    (3) Within twenty (20) feet of a bus stop, rapid-transit shelter, or bus shelter;
    (4) Within twenty (20) feet of a line of pedestrians waiting to obtain access to a building or event;
    (5) Within twenty (20) feet of the area of the sidewalk used by an outdoor restaurant under a temporary public right-of-way occupancy permit issued under Chapter 513 of the Codified Ordinances or by a vendor under a permit issued under Chapter 508, Section 675.06, or Section 675.07 of the Codified Ordinances;
    (6) Within twenty (20) feet of a valet zone established under Section 451.33 of the Codified Ordinances;
    (7) Within fifteen (15) feet of any pay telephone, provided, however, that when a pay telephone is located within a telephone booth or other facility, the distance shall be measured from the entrance or exit of the telephone booth or facility;
    (8) Within fifteen (15) feet of the entrance or exit of any public toilet facility;
    (9) On public property within ten (10) feet of an entrance to a building;
    (10) On public property within ten (10) feet of an entrance to a parking lot;
    (11) On a public street, by intentionally or recklessly blocking the safe or free passage of a person or vehicle.


    I hope #1 doesn't apply to anyone. Basically, if the person say no, walk away from them and you are clear of #1. The rest, just follow those and you'll be safe as well.

    As far as I can tell, they don't have a general no solicitation at all ordinance. It's simply you can't do it in those locations.

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    Regular Member NEOOpenCarry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediSkipdogg View Post
    The next thing Cleveland will do is say you are soliciting. And without case law, it could be an issue....

    http://www.amlegal.com/nxt/gateway.dll/Ohio/cleveland_oh/partsixoffensesandbusinessactivitiescode/titleigeneraloffenses/chapter605-disorderlyconductandactivity?f=templates$fn=docume nt-frame.htm$3.0#JD_605.031

    “Solicit” or “soliciting” means to request an immediate donation of money or other thing of value from another person, regardless of the solicitor’s purpose or intended use of the money or other thing of value. The solicitation may be, without limitation, by the spoken, written, or printed word, by gesture or by other means of communication.

    You are requesting and "other thing of value" therefore you are soliciting. Now, you can only be guilty if you do it....

    (1) In an aggressive manner;
    (2) Within twenty (20) feet of any automated-teller machine without the consent of the owner or other person legally in possession of the machine, provided, however, that when an automated- teller machine is located within an automated-teller machine facility, the distance shall be measured from the entrance or exit of the automated-teller machine facility;
    (3) Within twenty (20) feet of a bus stop, rapid-transit shelter, or bus shelter;
    (4) Within twenty (20) feet of a line of pedestrians waiting to obtain access to a building or event;
    (5) Within twenty (20) feet of the area of the sidewalk used by an outdoor restaurant under a temporary public right-of-way occupancy permit issued under Chapter 513 of the Codified Ordinances or by a vendor under a permit issued under Chapter 508, Section 675.06, or Section 675.07 of the Codified Ordinances;
    (6) Within twenty (20) feet of a valet zone established under Section 451.33 of the Codified Ordinances;
    (7) Within fifteen (15) feet of any pay telephone, provided, however, that when a pay telephone is located within a telephone booth or other facility, the distance shall be measured from the entrance or exit of the telephone booth or facility;
    (8) Within fifteen (15) feet of the entrance or exit of any public toilet facility;
    (9) On public property within ten (10) feet of an entrance to a building;
    (10) On public property within ten (10) feet of an entrance to a parking lot;
    (11) On a public street, by intentionally or recklessly blocking the safe or free passage of a person or vehicle.


    I hope #1 doesn't apply to anyone. Basically, if the person say no, walk away from them and you are clear of #1. The rest, just follow those and you'll be safe as well.

    As far as I can tell, they don't have a general no solicitation at all ordinance. It's simply you can't do it in those locations.
    It looks like this only applies to people who are asking for a "donation" of money or other things of value. We would be offering to pay for any valuable or service we receive. This more applies to people begging on street corners and what not. It says nothing about paying for those services or goods.
    “Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.” - Thomas Jefferson

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    You don't get arrested for buying a sports program from someone on the street lol

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    Regular Member Suckerspawn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    A vendor is a seller. I'd be buying.

    Just do the OC walk carrying a sign saying that you are in the market for a gun. If a private sale happens to spring up on the spot, so be it.
    How would we protect ourselves from buying stolen guns?

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    Cleveland gun buy back

    I don't think you can.

    I'll have my iPad. I'll say, "Just let me run the numbers. Oh, can I have your ID?" If something is up with the gun, I expect the seller to run and get his gift card. If not, I will end my bluff on running the numbers, record the identifying information of the seller, complete the transaction, and then ask the police to run the numbers. If something nefarious comes up, I'll share the ID of the seller and forfeit the gun.

    Anyone have a better idea? Or want to poke holes in mine? Or add to it?


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    Re: Cleveland gun buy back

    Eye,

    I went to the Seattle gun buyback with a stack of bills of sale. Never used a single one. Everyone was in a hurry, I went off my gut feeling about the person. I turned only 1 guy away who gave me an uneasy feeling. Most of the people and guns being turned in didn't fit the demographics to be worried about.
    Too lazy to do a blog! Follow me on Twitter instead! @6ShotScott

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    I'll be using my iPhone on a website that you can run serial numbers of guns for free. They search databases of stolen or missing guns and it's instant.

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    Cleveland gun buy back

    Quote Originally Posted by Jordysoso View Post
    I'll be using my iPhone on a website that you can run serial numbers of guns for free. They search databases of stolen or missing guns and it's instant.
    What site would that be?


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  22. #22
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    www.gunverify.com

    I used it a year ago when I bought my ruger. Idk if they have changed anything since but the homepage of the site still looks the same

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    Vendors license

    Quote Originally Posted by Pecker View Post
    Yes, I read the Cleveland ordinances on "vendors licenses" and it by definition only applies to people selling or bartering wares. It has no provisions to deal with those specifically purchasing. It's an item definitely in our favor. I searched the entire code for key words such as "solicit" and the only applicable item came for this vendor license section. It doesn't apply to purchasing.

    http://www.amlegal.com/nxt/gateway.dll/Ohio/cleveland_oh/cityofclevelandohiocodeofordinances?f=templates$fn =default.htm$3.0$vid=amlegal:cleveland_oh
    * Have your pocket recorder running from the minute you exit your vehicle.
    * Have multiple copies of the Cleveland city ordinance on vendors available for the PD.
    * "Am I being detained, or am I free to go ? "


    'Nuf said....

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    Cleveland gun buy back

    My recorder runs from the instant I leave the house until I get back.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

    <o>

  25. #25
    Regular Member MyWifeSaidYes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    My recorder runs from the instant I leave the house until I get back.

    ^^^ What he said.
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    What does a caring, sensitive person feel when they are forced to use a handgun to stop a threat?

    Recoil.

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