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Thread: Guns Are NOT Toys

  1. #1

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    Guns Are NOT Toys

    This horror out of Kentucky:

    Apparently unsupervised 5 year old shoots two year old with rifle that looked like a toy:

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...rifle/2128573/

    Simple stuff folks:

    1. firearms should not be designed to look like toys;

    2. Firearms should be properly secured;

    3. Children should not be allowed to play with firearms as if they were toys;

    4. All young children, including those in households where the family is supposedly familiar with guns, should be taught these basics about firearms in the absence of a responsible supervising adult:

    Don't touch it.

    Get away.

    Tell an adult.

    Point 4 is what is taught by the NRA in its "Eddie Eagle" program.

    Sometimes, even the NRA gets it right.

  2. #2
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    The cricket looks like a jr rifle, clearly it is not a toy gun. Toy guns have been made to look like real guns for DECADES. And in those decades there was not a rash of shootings, heck the toy guns did not even have the famous orange tip. Two factors were involved, lack of supervision, and chance/fate. It had NOTHING to do with the design of the gun.

    We learned as children gun safety with BB guns, then graduated to rifles and shotguns at a fairly young age. It is up to each parent to decide how to present gun safety to their child.

    NOT some progressive on a internet site.
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    Sad parenting fail.

    What gets my goat is this:

    In an interview, Dr. Denise Dowd, an emergency room pediatrician at Children's Mercy Hospitals in Kansas City who co-wrote the American Academy of Pediatricians policy on children and guns, said she was "blown away" that anyone would give a rifle to a 5-year-old.

    "We don't give our kids the keys to our car, and there is a good reason for it," she said.
    1) Poor choice of words when commenting on a shooting.
    2) We hear stories all the time of kids getting into cars, knocking it in drive, or going to the store for cereal because there's none in the house.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    This horror out of Kentucky:

    Apparently unsupervised 5 year old shoots two year old with rifle that looked like a toy:

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...rifle/2128573/

    Simple stuff folks:

    1. firearms should not be designed to look like toys;

    2. Firearms should be properly secured;

    3. Children should not be allowed to play with firearms as if they were toys;

    4. All young children, including those in households where the family is supposedly familiar with guns, should be taught these basics about firearms in the absence of a responsible supervising adult:

    Don't touch it.

    Get away.

    Tell an adult.

    Point 4 is what is taught by the NRA in its "Eddie Eagle" program.

    Sometimes, even the NRA gets it right.
    This had nothing to do with the gun and everything to do with terrible parenting. Anyone with a modicum of sense can see that. Go back to your progressive, liberal friends and complain there.
    "Somebody ever tries to kill you, you try and kill em right back!" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    The cricket looks like a jr rifle, clearly it is not a toy gun. Toy guns have been made to look like real guns for DECADES. And in those decades there was not a rash of shootings, heck the toy guns did not even have the famous orange tip. Two factors were involved, lack of supervision, and chance/fate. It had NOTHING to do with the design of the gun.

    We learned as children gun safety with BB guns, then graduated to rifles and shotguns at a fairly young age. It is up to each parent to decide how to present gun safety to their child.

    NOT some progressive on a internet site.
    If your "choice" about how to present gun safety to your kids is to send a 5 year old out to play unsupervised with a .22, you deserve to go to prison when the inevitable happens.

    The advertising for the Cricket impresses me as fine, and does not suggest to me that it is a toy (it is nested here inside this slate article):

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime/201...the_gun_a.html

    On the other hand, making it available with pink and yellow plastic stocks as shown in the ad is -- from my perspective -- rather stupid.

    But hey, it does not violate any law:

    So go ahead, let your infant get his "freedom" on.

    Chances are, it will not be my kids' funeral.
    Last edited by The Donkey; 05-15-2013 at 02:43 PM. Reason: video did not work

  6. #6
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    If your "choice" about how to present gun safety to your kids is to send a 5 year old out to play unsupervised with a .22, you deserve to go to prison when the inevitable happens.

    The advertising for the Cricket impresses me as fine, and does not suggest to me that it is a toy (it is nested here inside this slate article):

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime/201...the_gun_a.html

    On the other hand, making it available with pink and yellow plastic stocks as shown in the ad is -- from my perspective -- rather stupid.

    But hey, it does not violate any law:

    So go ahead, let your infant get his "freedom" on.

    Chances are, it will not be my kids' funeral.
    I didn't say that at all, stop lying! Why is it progressives cannot resist trying to control others and spout lies?

    Anybody who wishes to decide for others the color rifle stock is stupid...
    Last edited by WalkingWolf; 05-15-2013 at 02:45 PM.
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  7. #7
    Regular Member Fallschirmjäger's Avatar
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    Crickett Rifle,


    Toy Rifles


    The Crickett looks like a rifle because it is one, if there's any failure to go around it would be on the part of the toy rifles emulating real rifles too closely and parents who fail to instill proper safety and handling into their children.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    I didn't say that at all, stop lying! Why is it progressives cannot resist trying to control others and spout lies?

    Anybody who wishes to decide for others the color rifle stock is stupid...
    I too used to watch Glenn Beck on Fox.

    He was also rather fond of applying what he must think is a "Progressive" smear to anyone he disagreed with.

    From my perspective, the "Progressive" archetype was Teddy Roosevelt -- he earned it through his rather great work busting up the trusts that were dominating American political and economic life at the turn of the century, at great cost to people like you and me.

    I admire some of Teddy's economic ideas, his ideas about public administration, his robust writing, his assertive internationalism and his gusto for life. And like Teddy, I am an outdoorsman and a gun nut and damn proud of it.

    If you think that makes me a Progressive, that is fine.

    If you send your 5 year old out unsupervised with a firearm, whether or not it has the pink stock shown in the Cricket commercial, you are not only really stupid, but are criminally reckless, and I feel sorry for your children, who are not yet old enough to be responsible for their choices.

    But you are, and in these circumstances, natural selection may take care of your offspring's problems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    This horror out of Kentucky:

    Apparently unsupervised 5 year old shoots two year old with rifle that looked like a toy:

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...rifle/2128573/

    Simple stuff folks:

    1. firearms should not be designed to look like toys;

    2. Firearms should be properly secured;

    3. Children should not be allowed to play with firearms as if they were toys;

    4. All young children, including those in households where the family is supposedly familiar with guns, should be taught these basics about firearms in the absence of a responsible supervising adult:

    Don't touch it.

    Get away.

    Tell an adult.

    Point 4 is what is taught by the NRA in its "Eddie Eagle" program.

    Sometimes, even the NRA gets it right.
    Sorry, but I see nothing wrong with toy guns.
    Guns should be secured? By whose definition ~~~ so I disagree.
    etc mantra of the antis .....

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Sorry, but I see nothing wrong with toy guns.
    I see nothing wrong with toy guns either: I rather like them.

    I have considerable problems with guns that look like toys. I think they get confused with toys, and encourage people not to take them as seriously as they should.

    This is something that the antis have backwards: they worry about ugly black guns -- the real problem is with cute, teeny weeny guns, and the designer colors are icing on the cake.

    But I own guns like that, and I am not quite ready to take a stand one way or the other about regulating them.

    Guns should be secured? By whose definition ~~~ so I disagree.
    Hint: If your five-year old can easily grab one on the way out to play with your two year old, they are probably not properly secured.

    I wonder how I would react if the five year old were the neighbor's kid and the two year old were mine.

    I think that after beating him within an inch of his life, if there were still anything left of him when he got out of prison, I might want to sue him, and it might make sense for a "negligence per se" rule to apply there. As a gun owner, surely he ought to have recognized that a firearm is an unusually dangerous instrument, even if it was cute looking and marketed to children.
    Last edited by The Donkey; 05-15-2013 at 04:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    I see nothing wrong with toy guns either: I rather like them.

    I have considerable problems with guns that look like toys. I think they get confused with toys, and encourage people not to take them as seriously as they should.

    This is something that the antis have backwards: they worry about ugly black guns -- the real problem is with cute, teeny weeny guns, and the designer colors are icing on the cake.

    But I own guns like that, and I am not quite ready to take a stand one way or the other about regulating them.



    Hint: If your five-year old can easily grab one on the way out to play with your two year old, they are probably not properly secured.

    I wonder how I would react if the five year old were the neighbor's kid and the two year old were mine.

    I think that after beating him within an inch of his life, if there were still anything left of him when he got out of prison, I might want to sue him, and it might make sense for a "negligence per se" rule to apply there. As a gun owner, surely he ought to have recognized that a firearm is an unusually dangerous instrument, even if it was cute looking and marketed to children.
    I could paint and orange band around my firearms .. maybe it gives me a tactical advantage

  12. #12
    Regular Member SouthernBoy's Avatar
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    When I was a little kid, a friend and I used to play guns in his back yard which butted up to woods and creek. More often than not, we used real guns his father had brought back from the European Theater in WWII. One of the guns we really liked to play with was an MP 40 Schmeisser (I'm pretty sure it was the MP 40 and not the MP 38, though not positive). This sub machinegun was fully operational but when you are under 10 years old, it was heavy. We didn't know we were doing anything wrong or bad.... we were just kids (this was in Falls Church, VA in the 1950's). We were just having fun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernBoy View Post
    When I was a little kid, a friend and I used to play guns in his back yard which butted up to woods and creek. More often than not, we used real guns his father had brought back from the European Theater in WWII. One of the guns we really liked to play with was an MP 40 Schmeisser (I'm pretty sure it was the MP 40 and not the MP 38, though not positive). This sub machinegun was fully operational but when you are under 10 years old, it was heavy. We didn't know we were doing anything wrong or bad.... we were just kids (this was in Falls Church, VA in the 1950's). We were just having fun.
    Nothing wrong with that then nor now .... on your own land, do whatever you want

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    In an interview, Dr. Denise Dowd, an emergency room pediatrician at Children's Mercy Hospitals in Kansas City who co-wrote the American Academy of Pediatricians policy on children and guns, said she was "blown away" that anyone would give a rifle to a 5-year-old.
    I searched for the above phrase and came up with:

    http://www.aap.org/en-us/advocacy-an...ns_Jan2013.pdf

    The AAP continues to support a number of specific measures to reduce the destructive effects of guns in the lives of children and adolescents through the implementation of the following recommendations.
    • Enact a strong, effective assault weapon ban;
    • Eliminate the gun show loophole and require mandatory background checks and waiting periods before all firearm purchases;
    • Ban on high-capacity magazines;
    • Enact strong handgun regulations; and
    • Require safe firearm storage under federal law.
    So that's where those "any gun in your home?" medical questions probably come from! AAP is toxic. I hadn't noticed them before, but I'm glad their name showed up in the article to highlight their anti-gun activities.

    Crickett makes good firearms and I don't think they look like toys. They do have colors, what don't? Most of them are similar to real gun colors and of course there's pink for girls. Their guns are designed with special safety features too. I've considered getting one for myself actually, because a 2.5 pound long gun is pretty unique. Hope this doesn't hurt the company PR, because I like them.

    http://www.crickett.com/crickett_22_LR.php

    What a tragedy for that family. Don't ever let kids keep their real guns or handle them except when using them supervised! But what is appropriate for each child should remain with the parents, with lots of encouragement from people like us to use extra caution with kids and guns, and not groups like the AAP exploiting these events to attack freedom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Sorry, but I see nothing wrong with toy guns.
    Guns should be secured? By whose definition ~~~ so I disagree.
    etc mantra of the antis .....
    I agree~

    On a further note, I recall getting my first firearm, when I was 6 years old, 410 gauge stevens single barrel shotgun, by the time I was 8, I was going squirrel, deer, and turkey hunting by myself on my family's land. I've never had a mis-fire, or handled a weapon improperly in my life. Heck, I'd clean it once a day with or without my mom or dad watching. If a kid is taught right in an atmosphere that pays no special treatment to firearms other than its a tool and your taught responsibly then there shouldnt be a problem with kids using them for hunting and targetting, of course adult supervision is recommended. But then again, some kids, much like how some adults, are not cut out for that responsibility.

    But, t'was a different time, a time when my dad would load me and my cousins in the back of his truck, we'd sit down and he'd drive us a few miles to our favorite swimming hole, past cops and no one cared, and a root beer from a vending machine was 25cents. I miss the early 90's.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    This horror out of Kentucky:

    Apparently unsupervised 5 year old shoots two year old with rifle that looked like a toy:

    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...rifle/2128573/

    Simple stuff folks:

    1. firearms should not be designed to look like toys;

    2. Firearms should be properly secured;

    3. Children should not be allowed to play with firearms as if they were toys;

    4. All young children, including those in households where the family is supposedly familiar with guns, should be taught these basics about firearms in the absence of a responsible supervising adult:

    Don't touch it.

    Get away.

    Tell an adult.

    Point 4 is what is taught by the NRA in its "Eddie Eagle" program.

    Sometimes, even the NRA gets it right.
    1. Cricketts look like rifles. But, no matter, the problem is not how it looks.

    2. Firearms don't need to be secured. Steps should be taken to ensure that immature and untrained children don't use them without supervision. Securing them is just one option.

    3. Again, immature and untrained children should not handle firearms without supervision.

    4. Again, immature and untrained children should not handle firearms without supervision.

    As others have pointed out, this is not a failure on the part of the firearm for looking any particular way. It is a human failure, specifically a failure of parenting that may well be criminal in nature. Someone is dead because these parents did not do the most basic parts of the parenting job, not because a rifle looked like a little rifle.

  17. #17
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Donkey View Post
    I too used to watch Glenn Beck on Fox.

    He was also rather fond of applying what he must think is a "Progressive" smear to anyone he disagreed with.

    From my perspective, the "Progressive" archetype was Teddy Roosevelt -- he earned it through his rather great work busting up the trusts that were dominating American political and economic life at the turn of the century, at great cost to people like you and me.

    I admire some of Teddy's economic ideas, his ideas about public administration, his robust writing, his assertive internationalism and his gusto for life. And like Teddy, I am an outdoorsman and a gun nut and damn proud of it.

    If you think that makes me a Progressive, that is fine.

    If you send your 5 year old out unsupervised with a firearm, whether or not it has the pink stock shown in the Cricket commercial, you are not only really stupid, but are criminally reckless, and I feel sorry for your children, who are not yet old enough to be responsible for their choices.

    But you are, and in these circumstances, natural selection may take care of your offspring's problems.
    I didn't say any thing about Teddy nor do I watch Glen Beck, you are a LIAR. Not surprising from a progressive when their emotional babbling, and gibberish are not taken as gospel they resort to lying. I also do not have a 5 year old, so it is impossible for me to send them out with anything. When I did have a 5 year old my firearms were never a problem and they were not locked up. I believed in teaching children responsibility even at a young age, something wacky progressives cannot grasp.
    Last edited by WalkingWolf; 05-16-2013 at 12:08 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    I didn't say any thing about Teddy nor do I watch Glen Beck, you are a LIAR. Not surprising from a progressive when their emotional babbling, and gibberish are not taken as gospel they resort to lying. I also do not have a 5 year old, so it is impossible for me to send them out with anything. When I did have a 5 year old my firearms were never a problem and they were not locked up. I believed in teaching children responsibility even at a young age, something wacky progressives cannot grasp.
    and what did you do with your five year old? lol

  19. #19
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    and what did you do with your five year old? lol
    They all grew up, without shooting anyone, or becoming pathetic progressives.
    Last edited by WalkingWolf; 05-16-2013 at 02:27 PM.
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    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
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