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Thread: My turn to say adios.

  1. #1
    Regular Member sharkey's Avatar
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    My turn to say adios.

    When I joined OCDO I had a sincere hope that I could be part of a change, an awakening, a better future.

    Sometimes we place unreasonable expectations on a simple means of communication.

    I realize my presence here, along with others is contributing nothing to the movement. OCDO has become about entertainment, nothing more.

    This site is actually counter to our goals in my opinion. It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.

    I believe change is better effected through state organizations than a message board on the internet.

    We left our Sunday best a long time ago for a reality show.

    I wish you all the best.
    "Public opinion and votes have nothing to do with this. The challenge of the Court is not what they're going to do with votes. The challenge-- of the Court is are they going to protect people's rights." - Al Sharpton


  2. #2
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    When I joined OCDO I had a sincere hope that I could be part of a change, an awakening, a better future.

    Sometimes we place unreasonable expectations on a simple means of communication.

    I realize my presence here, along with others is contributing nothing to the movement. OCDO has become about entertainment, nothing more.

    This site is actually counter to our goals in my opinion. It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.

    I believe change is better effected through state organizations than a message board on the internet.

    We left our Sunday best a long time ago for a reality show.

    I wish you all the best.
    Sorry to see you go, but I think you are selling OCDO short. With all of the downfalls, as other social media sites have, it does bring awareness to issues. It gives those who are new to OC a place to belong instead of being outcasts of the community, maybe someday we will not be looked on as such. We are a family, and families have disagreements, difference of opinion, but they remain a family. Yes we have one or two nutcases, but then every family has at least one. If it were not for sites such as OCDO, the CC lobbyists would have completely outlawed OC, they are still trying though.

    I ask you to reconsider...
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
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    I guess he's off to reddit .... farewell to a 2nd amendment brethren

    If he thought that through persuasion that all would come to a single consensus , his expectations were too great.

    And I would completely disagree that this sight does noting. It informs. It brings out ideas. It advises of governmental meetings & activities.

    This is not a democrat only, GOP only, Libertarian only site ... so don't expect folks to agree...

    Some of my viewpoints have actually been changed due to arguments posted here...

    Nobody or nothing is perfect ...

  4. #4
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    (snip)
    Nobody or nothing is perfect ...
    NOW wait just a minute, I am close if not perfect. Just ask my wife and she will tell you I am a perfect a$$.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

  5. #5
    Regular Member fjpro2a's Avatar
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    Reconsider, please

    Sharkey, I, too, ask you to reconsider. You have conveyed wisdom over the years, especially to me. Reading all the input from other members, I have laughed, cried, been optimistic, pessimistic, etc. I agree with WalkingWolf that the CC lobbyists would have been successful in outlawing OC if not for this forum. However, I must admit that I see our cause losing the battle. For every victory, there are 2 or 3 defeats. If you reconsider, great. If you don't, we all wish you Godspeed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.
    I was thinking the same thing just a few minutes ago when I found this thread

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...tch-this-video


    If the poster of that thread posted it with an anti agenda, I bet he's sitting there going "nuff said" with a sh*t eating grin on his face.

    Rather than lock the thread, if I was grapeshot I would've deleted the thread - it's embarassing.

  7. #7
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molonlabe821 View Post
    I was thinking the same thing just a few minutes ago when I found this thread

    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...tch-this-video


    If the poster of that thread posted it with an anti agenda, I bet he's sitting there going "nuff said" with a sh*t eating grin on his face.

    Rather than lock the thread, if I was grapeshot I would've deleted the thread - it's embarassing.
    But you are not Grapeshot, and it is not your soapbox. If it bothers you so much there is the door. Why in the world would you bring up a thread to restart that conversation while trying to poke at the good members here? Never mind I know the answer.
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    Why in the world would you bring up a thread to restart that conversation
    I was backing up Sharkey's sentiments with what I see as proof that his argument is true. I did not pay attention to any of the names involved in that thread (except for who locked it), so there was no "poking". Furthermore I'm pretty sure grapeshot is smart enough to realize that I wasn't criticizing his actions in moderating that thread.

    Some of you guys are unnecessarily argumentative. Are yall so insecure that you assume that if someone disagrees that you need to go into attack mode?

    Utilizing that door now.

  9. #9
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by molonlabe821 View Post
    I was backing up Sharkey's sentiments with what I see as proof that his argument is true. I did not pay attention to any of the names involved in that thread (except for who locked it), so there was no "poking". Furthermore I'm pretty sure grapeshot is smart enough to realize that I wasn't criticizing his actions in moderating that thread.

    Some of you guys are unnecessarily argumentative. Are yall so insecure that you assume that if someone disagrees that you need to go into attack mode?

    Utilizing that door now.
    Don't let it hit you in the backside on your way out. IMO you brought that thread to incite/troll, stir up brown, demonstrating exactly what Sharkey was complaining about. Again nobody forced you to sign up, nobody is forcing you to stay. Supposed newbie with a handful of posts, bring up old brown sandwiches is problem all sites have, and a problem all sites don't need.

    "the door is thataway!"
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

  10. #10
    Regular Member sudden valley gunner's Avatar
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    So we all must be nice and get along?

    I use the arguments and disagreements to show we are not a bunch of robot, NRA, brainwashed, people we vary in our opinions, we disagree, I don't think this makes us look bad at all.
    I am not anti Cop I am just pro Citizen.

    U.S. v. Minker, 350 US 179, at page 187
    "Because of what appears to be a lawful command on the surface, many citizens, because
    of their respect for what only appears to be a law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their
    rights, due to ignorance." (Paraphrased)

  11. #11
    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    ... It gives those who are new to OC a place to belong instead of being outcasts of the community, maybe someday we will not be looked on as such. ...
    Sorry, but I have to firmly disagree with this. I see this forum as pretty unwelcoming.

    I mean - in THIS VERY THREAD you tell someone "there's the door" and "don't let it hit you on the way out"

    What part of that is friendly or inviting? What part of that doesn't serve to create yet another outcast who could have been a valuable supporter of OC and perhaps learned something from this site had they not be ridiculed and driven away by counter productive rules and confrontation?

    At least two of the most significant threads on these boards in the past couple of weeks have been goodbye threads. What do you think that says about these forums? Do you REALLY think this forum has the activity and member base to support the idea that everything is being run in the best way possible?

    Moreover, if the forum owners and leaders are looking to only allow the perfect statements and the perfect conversations, never discuss the same things twice, and only talk about a select list of topics, then they shouldn't have created a forum, they should have created a wiki. It is against everything a forum serves to be. Do they have the right to do it wrong? Sure, absolutely. But as the OP said, it's going to be ineffective and unrepresentative.
    Last edited by stealthyeliminator; 05-25-2013 at 10:43 AM.

  12. #12
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    Sorry, but I have to firmly disagree with this. I see this forum as pretty unwelcoming.

    I mean - in THIS VERY THREAD you tell someone "there's the door" and "don't let it hit you on the way out"

    What part of that is friendly or inviting? What part of that doesn't serve to create yet another outcast who could have been a valuable supporter of OC and perhaps learned something from this site had they not be ridiculed and driven away by counter productive rules and confrontation?

    At least two of the most significant threads on these boards in the past couple of weeks have been goodbye threads. What do you think that says about these forums? Do you REALLY think this forum has the activity and member base to support the idea that everything is being run in the best way possible?

    Moreover, if the forum owners and leaders are looking to only allow the perfect statements and the perfect conversations, never discuss the same things twice, and only talk about a select list of topics, then they shouldn't have created a forum, they should have created a wiki. It is against everything a forum serves to be. Do they have the right to do it wrong? Sure, absolutely. But as the OP said, it's going to be ineffective and unrepresentative.
    This forum encourages views from both sides of the fence. An exchange of ideas, sharing of thoughts, can be educational. Treading new territory can be enlightening. In the final analysis one will only gain proportionate to their investment in time and effort.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  13. #13
    Regular Member MNMGoneShooting's Avatar
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    My turn to say adios.

    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    When I joined OCDO I had a sincere hope that I could be part of a change, an awakening, a better future.

    Sometimes we place unreasonable expectations on a simple means of communication.

    I realize my presence here, along with others is contributing nothing to the movement. OCDO has become about entertainment, nothing more.

    This site is actually counter to our goals in my opinion. It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.

    I believe change is better effected through state organizations than a message board on the internet.

    We left our Sunday best a long time ago for a reality show.

    I wish you all the best.
    Strange, I started OCing only AFTER coming to OCDO and becoming enlightened to my rights and the cause. Further, I got my first AR15 only after going to an OCDO dinner and becoming enlightened to my rights and the cause.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sharkey View Post
    When I joined OCDO I had a sincere hope that I could be part of a change, an awakening, a better future.

    Sometimes we place unreasonable expectations on a simple means of communication.

    I realize my presence here, along with others is contributing nothing to the movement. OCDO has become about entertainment, nothing more.

    This site is actually counter to our goals in my opinion. It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.

    I believe change is better effected through state organizations than a message board on the internet.

    We left our Sunday best a long time ago for a reality show.

    I wish you all the best.
    Says the guy who joined in Aug 2010.

    In the early days of this forum:

    cops got bashed harshly
    personal attacks--and I mean harsh, vilifying verbal assaults--were not uncommon
    there were off-beat threads about monster trucks and gosh-knows-what
    unsophisticated, jingoistic pap about Founders and Bill of Rights regularly dripped from our screens

    OCDO has come a long ways. I don't agree with all the rules, nor all the behaviors, but this place has become almost genteel compared to what it once was.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    SNIP I think you are selling OCDO short.
    Agreed. There are what? 20K registered members? And yet these complainers see posts they don't like from a tiny fraction of that membership, and paint the whole forum as bad.

    Seriously skewed perspective--extremely short-sighted.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  16. #16
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    My turn to say adios.

    Quote Originally Posted by MNMGoneShooting View Post
    Strange, I started OCing only AFTER coming to OCDO and becoming enlightened to my rights and the cause. Further, I got my first AR15 only after going to an OCDO dinner and becoming enlightened to my rights and the cause.
    I too started OCing after signing up here. I dragged the posters in the Alabama forum through Hell to prove to me that OC was legal in Alabama before I'd try it. Without this forum, I'd've ignorantly been insisting that OC was illegal and that LEOs should be required to stop and arrest OCers.

    I learned a lot about the law and how to read it and use it. I have met some rational and thoughtful posters with whom sometimes I agree and sometimes I disagree. All of this is worth tolerating a handful of people who are incapable of handling harsh disagreement without getting personal, the two remaining progressives, and one of the most colossal idiots I have ever run across in my life!

    I did not like the advent of the Social Lounge as it has turned out to be a huge distraction from OC, but I have come to accept it part of the price we have to pay to discuss OC.

    OCDO will remain the premier place to foster the practice. If a few members choose to flounce and pout, the site will remain flawed but strong.


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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    SNIP I did not like the advent of the Social Lounge as it has turned out to be a huge distraction from OC, but I have come to accept it part of the price we have to pay to discuss OC.
    The Social Lounge was a bit of inspired problem-solving.

    For a long time, there was no rule against off-topic threads.

    Then off-topic threads started getting out of hand, so a rule was created requiring all threads to be on the subject of guns or gun rights. This was only partially successful. There was always somebody who wanted to talk about the latest variable valve timing for car engines or the best recipe for glazed snipe with watercress.

    So, the Social Lounge was born to channel the off-topic stuff into one location. Rather liberty-minded actually. Instead of trying to stop something that can't be stopped like the government would do, John chose to channel it.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  18. #18
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    My turn to say adios.

    My point being that it seems to dominate the site, taking the focus off OC. We even seem to attract posters who don't care a whit about OC or even carry. They just bring their pet crap here.

    Oh, and if "pet crap" takes off as come kind of craze, leading to commercial success that rivals rocks, I expect a nickel for each turdle sold.


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  19. #19
    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    This site is actually counter to our goals in my opinion. It exposes our division, our derision, our weakness. It shows there is no solidarity among us.
    Translation: Where is the group think? how dare anyone have differing opinions, we should agree in complete harmony with no disagreement.

    ignorance is strength!
    they love our milk and honey, but they preach about some other way of living, when they're running down my country man they're walkin' on the fightin side of me

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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    My point being that it seems to dominate the site, taking the focus off OC. We even seem to attract posters who don't care a whit about OC or even carry. They just bring their pet crap here.

    Oh, and if "pet crap" takes off as come kind of craze, leading to commercial success that rivals rocks, I expect a nickel for each turdle sold.


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    How the devil can it dominate the site if its all channeled into one sub-forum?

    And, you--of all people!--the master of 'moving on' are griping about it? And how the devil can it take the focus off of OC? Its dots on a computer screen, for pete's sake. You control your focus--I hope. If you don't like it, don't look at it.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

  21. #21
    Regular Member WalkingWolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    How the devil can it dominate the site if its all channeled into one sub-forum?

    And, you--of all people!--the master of 'moving on' are griping about it? And how the devil can it take the focus off of OC? Its dots on a computer screen, for pete's sake. You control your focus--I hope. If you don't like it, don't look at it.
    He has never really mastered the art of "Moving on".
    It is well that war is so terrible otherwise we would grow too fond of it.
    Robert E. Lee
    The patriot volunteer, fighting for country and his rights, makes the most reliable soldier on earth.
    Thomas Jonathan "Stonewall" Jackson
    What separates the winners from the losers is how a person reacts to each new twist of fate.
    President Donald Trump

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by WalkingWolf View Post
    He has never really mastered the art of "Moving on".
    Explained here http://civility.eye95.org Come on downnnnn, snrrrkkk, snore ...

    Here's a favorite http://libertypost.org/cgi-bin/index.cgi Goldie does a good job of balanced moderation, better than Jim Robinson's moderating me since 1998 - damn fifteen years!
    Last edited by Nightmare; 05-26-2013 at 05:53 PM.
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  23. #23
    Regular Member stealthyeliminator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    My point being that it seems to dominate the site, taking the focus off OC. We even seem to attract posters who don't care a whit about OC or even carry. They just bring their pet crap here.

    Oh, and if "pet crap" takes off as come kind of craze, leading to commercial success that rivals rocks, I expect a nickel for each turdle sold.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

    <o>
    I can see that a disproportionation amount of on-topic to off-topic conversation seems like a bad thing, but I don't think that prohibiting off-topic conversation will help increase on-topic conversation - it'll only reduce overall activity, which is generally not good for forums in my opinion. If something needs to be done to improve proportions, it should be something other than restricting off-topic conversation, in my opinion.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    How the devil can it dominate the site if its all channeled into one sub-forum?

    And, you--of all people!--the master of 'moving on' are griping about it? And how the devil can it take the focus off of OC? Its dots on a computer screen, for pete's sake. You control your focus--I hope. If you don't like it, don't look at it.
    It dominates the site because a tremendously large number of the new posts, my chosen way to view the site, are off the topic of OC.

    I am not bemoaning any one individuals ability to focus. If you read carefully, it is the site whose focus is being lost.

    Anyway, moving on is a rational way to deal with individual sub-discussions when the posts or the posters have become annoying and the discussion is no longer worth my effort. This being the current case, I will move on to discussing this and other topics with other people.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by stealthyeliminator View Post
    I can see that a disproportionation amount of on-topic to off-topic conversation seems like a bad thing, but I don't think that prohibiting off-topic conversation will help increase on-topic conversation - it'll only reduce overall activity, which is generally not good for forums in my opinion. If something needs to be done to improve proportions, it should be something other than restricting off-topic conversation, in my opinion.
    Wow. A post discussing a comment without stooping to discussing the poster instead. Refreshing!

    Seriously. Thank you.

    My point is that, before the Social Lounge, there was no problem with the volume of posts. They just tended to be more about OC.

    Anyway, I'll live with the Social Lounge. Just making a passing comment about something I thought made the site a little bit worse.

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