Car carry laws, regarding unloaded OC within vehicle

This seems like an answer I should know, from all the studying of laws I have done around this. However, being in possession of a CPL, I have never had to face this...

From the basics:
1. OC is legal outside a vehicle.
2. Loaded OC is legal inside a vehicle, provided that the carrier has a CPL.

My question is here...
3. Unloaded OC (sidearm in holster) with a full magazine nearby is legal without a CPL.
That is what I have learned from reading a lot on this site and in WA laws, but here are where my questions arise (let's assume that I forgot my CPL at home).

A ->Is car OC only legal if the sidearm is within the carrier's holster? I suspect, but don't know if, it is NOT legal without a CPL to have the sidearm visible on the passenger seat, or visible in any other manner? What about in a holster, off the person's body (on seat, on floor...)?

B ->Does this mean that anyone traveling through WA with a sidearm (not a long-arm) can simply have it carried in an OC holster, on their person, unloaded, rather than locked in an opaque container, in the trunk, etc.? I thought states usually required unlicensed car carry to be locked away, out of reach of the occupants of the car.

Thanks.

The RCW just says you can't have a LOADED gun in a vehicle without a CPL. It also says you can't conceal it on your person without a CPL. If it isn't loaded and isn't concealed on your person then it doesn't matter what you do with it. You could actually tape the mag to the grip of the gun and it would still meet the definition for unloaded.

In the holster

I believe you cannot carry it on your person without a CPL in a vehicle. When it is in the holster while sitting in the car it is not visible enough.
Even unloaded. I know in OR it must be in the open like your dash or pass seat and not on your person period. I think that is how it is in WA.

TheGunMan said:

I believe you cannot carry it on your person without a CPL in a vehicle. When it is in the holster while sitting in the car it is not visible enough.
Even unloaded. I know in OR it must be in the open like your dash or pass seat and not on your person period. I think that is how it is in WA.

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This is not Oregon. Can the gun be loaded in Oregon if it's out in the open on the dash or seat? In Washington it cannot be loaded unless you have a CPL. Don't make up extra requirements just because another state does it differently.

Wow, this is the reason why I'm glad I have my CHL.

I had this same conversation at the Kitsap sheriff's office today. I was getting my Washington ccl now that they won't accept my Florida ccl. My question was if I run the risk of being charged with brandishing for loading and unloading every time I got in or out of my truck. Openly carried firearm is fine in vehicle but it can't be loaded in vehicle. I was told it won't be a problem even if someone calls in a mwag call. I'm not sure I trust that response but that's what the Lt. said.

There is NO BRANDISHING LAW IN WA!

golddigger14s said:

There is NO BRANDISHING LAW IN WA!

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RCW 9.41.270 unlawful carrying or handling. That's is just another way of calling it brandishing..

Really

tombrewster421 said:

This is not Oregon. Can the gun be loaded in Oregon if it's out in the open on the dash or seat? In Washington it cannot be loaded unless you have a CPL. Don't make up extra requirements just because another state does it differently.

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I did not say it was OR you XXXXX. I was giving an example. I also did not ad anything in. You must be board and trying to cause problems.

Why are so many on here always trying to start crap.

TheGunMan said:

I did not say it was OR you XXXXX. I was giving an example. I also did not ad anything in. You must be board and trying to cause problems.

Why are so many on here always trying to start crap.

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There are two requirements in this chapter.

1 do not conceal on your person.

2 do not carry or place a LOADED pistol in a vehicle.

That is all. Saying that Oregon requires it to be out in the open and you "THINK" Washington is the same way is most certainly adding more requirements to the law. If they wanted the gun in a specific place they would have specified it.

And no I'm not trying to start crap. I don't want people uninformed of what the law actually says and I will point out others errors just as most of the other folks here will do. Someone asked a question and I'd like him to have the correct answer. Not just a guess or "I think."

RCW 9.41.050
(1)(a) Except in the person's place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a concealed pistol.

(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.

TheGunMan said:

I did not say it was OR you XXXXX. I was giving an example. I also did not ad anything in. You must be board and trying to cause problems.

Why are so many on here always trying to start crap.

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The problem with your example is Oregon law does not apply in Washington.

I can tell you from personal experience that I once got pulled over by a police officer (for having an aftermarket exhaust system LOL) before I was issued my CPL. I had my unloaded pistol securely holstered on my person with a loaded magazine in my glove compartment. The officer told me that i was NOT allowed to have any ammunition in the same cab as the pistol, and instructed me for future reference that it needed to be in a locked container in a different compartment of the car (AKA the trunk). However, the officer was extremely nice and stated that he fully supported the 2A AND he did not give me a ticket. After the incident I went home and tried to find some kind of information/laws to clarify if I am allowed to have loaded magazines near by and I just got mixed reviews and information from various sources/people. Basically YMMW with different LEO's and people. It just doesn't make sense that you would have an unloaded pistol on your hip with your ammunition in the trunk because if SHTF and you need your defensive firearm, it is obviously not going to be available... However, the visual presence of your gun will most likely be a deterrent and may be "good enough" to ward off an attacker. That's just my $.02

The officer told me that i was NOT allowed to have any ammunition in the same cab as the pistol, and instructed me for future reference that it needed to be in a locked container in a different compartment of the car (AKA the trunk).

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He must have been raised up in another state. There's no such requirement in Washington law. To suit their personal biases cops, like everyone else, make up laws or cite laws they "thought" they heard about.

Did you know it's against federal law for a Commercial Driver's License holder to carry a gun in his truck? Well it's not, but it's apparently still taught (with no basis in fact) at Billy-Bob's Truck Drivin' School.

Did you know it's against federal law for a Commercial Driver's License holder to carry a gun in his truck? Well it's not, but it's apparently still taught (with no basis in fact) at Billy-Bob's Truck Drivin' School.


Its funny you would bring that up. I fight that claim all the time because I drive a cmv. You can prove them wrong and they still believe the lie..

deanf said:

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He must have been raised up in another state. There's no such requirement in Washington law. To suit their personal biases cops, like everyone else, make up laws or cite laws they "thought" they heard about.

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Exactly what I thought. It kind of makes me wonder if it is like a "loophole" to carry in your vehicle without a valid CPL. If someone were to not have a CPL and had to carry unloaded in their vehicle, i'm sure they would feel somewhat better about having a loaded magazine readily available and within arms reach, opposed to it being locked in their trunk. It is where practice, practice, practice is going to be important to load the magazine and possibly/most likely racking the slide if SHTF.

Any thoughts?

conandan said:

Did you know it's against federal law for a Commercial Driver's License holder to carry a gun in his truck? Well it's not, but it's apparently still taught (with no basis in fact) at Billy-Bob's Truck Drivin' School.


Its funny you would bring that up. I fight that claim all the time because I drive a cmv. You can prove them wrong and they still believe the lie..

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Doesn't speak well for the intelligence of those making the claim, does it?

TheGunMan said:

I believe you cannot carry it on your person without a CPL in a vehicle. When it is in the holster while sitting in the car it is not visible enough.
Even unloaded. I know in OR it must be in the open like your dash or pass seat and not on your person period. I think that is how it is in WA.

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Wrong for all the above stated reasons. When you make "claims" like this, you must cite.

conandan said:

I had this same conversation at the Kitsap sheriff's office today. I was getting my Washington ccl now that they won't accept my Florida ccl. My question was if I run the risk of being charged with brandishing for loading and unloading every time I got in or out of my truck. Openly carried firearm is fine in vehicle but it can't be loaded in vehicle. I was told it won't be a problem even if someone calls in a mwag call. I'm not sure I trust that response but that's what the Lt. said.

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I have found that I cannot trust ANY LEO to know or follow the law. This is a personal problem and I deal with it.


I have a russian friend that absolutely loves the fact that he can drive down the road with his pistol and separate magazine duct taped to his head (one on each side) and be amazingly legal. "Whatta Country!!"

RCW 9.41.050

conandan said:

You can prove them wrong and they still believe the lie..

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How do you prove them wrong, besides calling them on the absence to cite?

Dain Bramage said:

How do you prove them wrong, besides calling them on the absence to cite?

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Hand them the my FMCSA LAW book. And ask them to show me in the law where it says I can't carry a firearm in my cab. Its not there. There is no law on the federal books that make it illegal to carry. But with that said state law can. None of the state's I run in have any laws that expressly prohibit carry in my truck. But some states use the terms private vehicle, personal vehicle, privately owned vehicle or vessel. I own my truck and trailer even thou its use is commercial its privately owned. I know sooner or later I will have to fight that in court but I have carried in my truck for 20 years.

conandan said:

Did you know it's against federal law for a Commercial Driver's License holder to carry a gun in his truck? Well it's not, but it's apparently still taught (with no basis in fact) at Billy-Bob's Truck Drivin' School.


Its funny you would bring that up. I fight that claim all the time because I drive a cmv. You can prove them wrong and they still believe the lie..

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For those that don't know.....
http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/CommercialVehiclesAndFirerarms.pdf