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Thread: Minnesotan crossing the border.

  1. #1
    Regular Member Irish.40's Avatar
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    Minnesotan crossing the border.

    Hello neighbors,

    I am a Minnesota resident and I have a Minnesota Permit to Carry. My family and I will be heading to Menominee for some fishing this weekend. I know my permit is recognized by Wisconsin law. My question is about OC. I OC daily and I am having trouble finding out if I can OC while driving with a Permit. I have found that OC while driving without a permit is prohibited. And OC without a permit is legal outside of a vehicle. And CC is legal only with a permit. Can someone put my mind at ease please. Again, I OC daily and dont want to give up my right to carry. However, I do need to be to work on Monday, so I am trying to stay out of jail.

    Appreciate the help!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Irish.40 View Post
    Hello neighbors, I am a Minnesota resident and I have a Minnesota Permit to Carry. My family and I will be heading to Menominee for some fishing this weekend. I know my permit is recognized by Wisconsin law. My question is about OC. I OC daily and I am having trouble finding out if I can OC while driving with a Permit. I have found that OC while driving without a permit is prohibited. And OC without a permit is legal outside of a vehicle. And CC is legal only with a permit. Can someone put my mind at ease please. Again, I OC daily and dont want to give up my right to carry. However, I do need to be to work on Monday, so I am trying to stay out of jail. Appreciate the help!
    Do you have a citation for, "I have found that OC while driving without a permit is prohibited."?

    http://www.doj.state.wi.us/sites/def...cw/ccw-faq.pdf

    http://dnr.wi.gov/emergency/document...Wis_ACT_51.pdf
    I am responsible for my writing, not your understanding of it.

  3. #3
    Regular Member Irish.40's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Do you have a citation for, "I have found that OC while driving without a permit is prohibited."?

    http://www.doj.state.wi.us/sites/def...cw/ccw-faq.pdf

    http://dnr.wi.gov/emergency/document...Wis_ACT_51.pdf


    No I don't have a citation. Thanks for the links. I must say that Wisconsin laws a quite a bit more confusing than Minnesota's. But maybe that's because I'm Minnesotan.

  4. #4
    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    This thread is sticked in the WI forum:
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ou-should-know
    Not too far down in post #1 is a short list of WI laws, with links to read the actual text.
    Here's an informative pamphlet: https://www.box.com/s/82a6b45492dc70cda09b
    The second page is almost entirely laws, which you should at least be aware of... things like prohibited places.
    Signs have the force of law - you can be ticketed for trespassing if they're properly posted & you go in anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by Irish.40
    I am having trouble finding out if I can OC while driving with a Permit
    Yes.
    With a license/permit, you're fine.
    And according to the transport law (167.31) you're allowed to have a loaded unencased pistol in the car even without a permit.

    The "grey area" (some people still see it as grey) is that some officers, some jurisdictions, are relying on very old case law to say that any gun in a car (esp. below the window line) is automatically concealed because it can't be seen by someone standing anywhere outside the car.

    That judge's ruling was made before our transport law was changed, and before our cc law was in effect, and before our state Constitution was amended in 1998 to protect RKBA. (Which it does even more clearly & strongly than the federal Constitution.)
    But there are officers & DA's who will arrest/charge you for cc anyway. They don't get in trouble if they're wrong...

    I have found that OC while driving without a permit is prohibited
    Where'd that come from?
    No law says you must have a license/permit to OC in your car.
    And take the info in the DOJ FAQs with a large container of salt... they've been shown to be misleading, stating opinions, or just outright wrong several times. It's much safer to start with their opinions, then read the actual laws.

    And OC without a permit is legal outside of a vehicle
    Except in a school zone (within 1000' of the edge of a grade 1-12 school property) or in a taxpayer-owned building.
    For those you must have a permit/license, and you MAY NOT step onto school grounds (not even in your car) unless it's unloaded & encased. Locked would be better. Avoiding schools completely is safest.

    And CC is legal only with a permit
    Except in your dwelling, which includes your motel room, campsite, RV, and so on.
    (Or your place of business, which you probably don't have in WI, or land you "own, lease, or legally occupy", which you probably also don't have here.)

  5. #5
    Regular Member Irish.40's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    This thread is sticked in the WI forum:
    http://forum.opencarry.org/forums/sh...ou-should-know
    Not too far down in post #1 is a short list of WI laws, with links to read the actual text.
    Here's an informative pamphlet: https://www.box.com/s/82a6b45492dc70cda09b
    The second page is almost entirely laws, which you should at least be aware of... things like prohibited places.
    Signs have the force of law - you can be ticketed for trespassing if they're properly posted & you go in anyway.


    Yes.
    With a license/permit, you're fine.
    And according to the transport law (167.31) you're allowed to have a loaded unencased pistol in the car even without a permit.

    The "grey area" (some people still see it as grey) is that some officers, some jurisdictions, are relying on very old case law to say that any gun in a car (esp. below the window line) is automatically concealed because it can't be seen by someone standing anywhere outside the car.

    That judge's ruling was made before our transport law was changed, and before our cc law was in effect, and before our state Constitution was amended in 1998 to protect RKBA. (Which it does even more clearly & strongly than the federal Constitution.)
    But there are officers & DA's who will arrest/charge you for cc anyway. They don't get in trouble if they're wrong...


    Where'd that come from?
    No law says you must have a license/permit to OC in your car.
    And take the info in the DOJ FAQs with a large container of salt... they've been shown to be misleading, stating opinions, or just outright wrong several times. It's much safer to start with their opinions, then read the actual laws.


    Except in a school zone (within 1000' of the edge of a grade 1-12 school property) or in a taxpayer-owned building.
    For those you must have a permit/license, and you MAY NOT step onto school grounds (not even in your car) unless it's unloaded & encased. Locked would be better. Avoiding schools completely is safest.


    Except in your dwelling, which includes your motel room, campsite, RV, and so on.
    (Or your place of business, which you probably don't have in WI, or land you "own, lease, or legally occupy", which you probably also don't have here.)

    You are right, I don't own a business or land in Wisconsin. Thank you very much for the education.

  6. #6
    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MKEgal View Post
    With a license/permit, you're fine.
    And according to the transport law (167.31) you're allowed to have a loaded unencased pistol in the car even without a permit.

    But there are officers & DA's who will arrest/charge you for cc anyway. They don't get in trouble if they're wrong...
    167.31 does not say you are allowed to do anything. 167.31 does not grant you authority to do anything. 167.31 simply does not prohibit you from transporting a loaded handgun or an unloaded shotgun or rifle in your car. You can state that it is not prohibited by this statute but that this action is still governed by other Statutes.
    941.23 and 948.605 are still in full effect and are in no way curtailed by 167.31. You are taking exception with the definition of "concealed". You can debate it all day long here, but why do you insist on giving a mixed message when you advise someone who asks a simple question? By your own admission and experience, you may be cited for a 941.23 violation if you strap a handgun on your hip and drive down the road without a license. That is the advice we should be giving people.

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