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Thread: Trip to MO

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    Regular Member donsadlerjr's Avatar
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    Trip to MO

    Hey guys, I am active open carrier in Oklahoma and licensed. I see so much action in your forum I wanted to ask. I am going to be taking a week trip to Joplin then Branson. I would like to know the cliff notes version of your open carry or concealed. Per Oklahoma and the Missouri site I see it is conceal carry and they honor each states lic.

    Kind of wanting to just make sure.

  2. #2
    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donsadlerjr View Post
    Hey guys, I am active open carrier in Oklahoma and licensed. I see so much action in your forum I wanted to ask. I am going to be taking a week trip to Joplin then Branson. I would like to know the cliff notes version of your open carry or concealed. Per Oklahoma and the Missouri site I see it is conceal carry and they honor each states lic.

    Kind of wanting to just make sure.
    Branson is a NO! Also if you are going to Silver Dollar City, it is an amusement park (Not legal for firearms in Missouri) and it is posted.
    I believe Joplin is OK. Hopefully one of the Joplin people wil chime in.
    We do not have State wide preemption for OC like you lucky folks do. I went to Broken Arrow, OK to help folks there ring in their new found freedom!

    Ok is OK! We are an OC legal State but the Municipal governments can still prohibit. There is a law cooking, if it clears the Governor, it would be effective August 28th for State wide OC with a CCW in Municipalities that prohibit OC. One day we'll be as free you guys!
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    As mspgunner stated, Branson city is not OC friendly, unless you have a CCW....however, they are not real friendly to OC with the CCW. You may have the right, legally, however, the harassment is probably more than you want to endure, at this time. Sorry.
    "I can live for two weeks on a good compliment."
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    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redbaron007 View Post
    As mspgunner stated, Branson city is not OC friendly, unless you have a CCW....however, they are not real friendly to OC with the CCW. You may have the right, legally, however, the harassment is probably more than you want to endure, at this time. Sorry.
    Here is the Branson Muni-code:
    http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=13699

    As stated, not illegal, but not wecomed either.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    Also if you are going to Silver Dollar City, it is an amusement park (Not legal for firearms in Missouri) and it is posted.
    According to every lawyer I've ever spoken with, technically, CCW is legal there. That being said, there's never been any kind of court case to set a precedent, so it's very unwise to do so. Especially at this point.

    TL;DR: if traveling in MO, just CC and avoid places that are posted no guns.
    "Somebody ever tries to kill you, you try and kill em right back!" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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    I enjoy my right to open carry in the state of Missouri. As I travel the state I do a couple of things to try to protect myself.
    1) I call the police department of the city I am in and ask.
    2) I have sent emails to the cities I plan to visit and ask.

    If you open carry and wish to do so in the state of Missouri, just be aware that it is not welcomed everywhere. I hope you will exercise you Constitutional right to open carry in most of the state.

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    Regular Member NG19's Avatar
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    Re: Trip to MO

    Quote Originally Posted by logunowner View Post
    I enjoy my right to open carry in the state of Missouri. As I travel the state I do a couple of things to try to protect myself.
    1) I call the police department of the city I am in and ask.
    2) I have sent emails to the cities I plan to visit and ask.

    If you open carry and wish to do so in the state of Missouri, just be aware that it is not welcomed everywhere. I hope you will exercise you Constitutional right to open carry in most of the state.


    The only problem with asking leo's is that they can lie. Never ask law enforcement. Always do research for yourself. Worst case, if you can't find it on the web updated, have them mail you a copy.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by NG19 View Post
    The only problem with asking leo's is that they can lie. Never ask law enforcement. Always do research for yourself. Worst case, if you can't find it on the web updated, have them mail you a copy.
    I fully understand what you have said. For me, I merely want to exercise a Constitutional Right. I try my best to protect myself and feel comfortable in how I am doing that. Can they lie to me...yes they can. Can I go to the internet and get a copy of the ordinates that are in force when I printed them..yes, can they be changed at the council meeting two weeks before I visit a city...yes.

    I will open carry without that constant threat in the back of my mind, I hope I never see this great country get so bad that I have to be scared that at every turn someone will entrap me. Will some due that now...yes.

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    I am almost 100% certain Joplin is ok. I will double check that and get back to you. seems Branson is a no go though. Sorry about that.

    As far as asking local LEO's....I do that all the time. It helps me gauge how a MWAG encounter might go. Though I always research and double check before I go anywhere. I know my facts but look to see what the local LEOs will say. I just moved to Springfield and just did the same thing tonight.

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    Re: Trip to MO

    Since you are licensed, you may carry concealed anywhere you like, as long as you leave when asked, except for federal facilities and buses. You can also carry most anywhere in public, but some places can be illegal depending on what city are are in. Right now, we have a bill that has passed the Legislature and is sitting on our Democratic governor's desk. We would like very much for this law to be signed. So, if you can avoid rocking the boat, that would be appreciated.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

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    Quote Originally Posted by kcgunfan View Post
    we would like very much for this law to be signed. So, if you can avoid rocking the boat, that would be appreciated.
    qft.
    "Somebody ever tries to kill you, you try and kill em right back!" - Captain Malcolm Reynolds

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    Regular Member Redbaron007's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by kcgunfan......
    we would like very much for this law to be signed. So, if you can avoid rocking the boat, that would be appreciated.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oramac View Post
    qft.
    ^^
    This x2!
    "I can live for two weeks on a good compliment."
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    Always ask law enforcement

    Quote Originally Posted by NG19 View Post
    The only problem with asking leo's is that they can lie. Never ask law enforcement. Always do research for yourself. Worst case, if you can't find it on the web updated, have them mail you a copy.
    I ALWAYS call and ask local pd's. After I have read the laws. I do this just to gauge the reaction. If I know it is legal and the officer says it isn't, then I know they will not be friendly about it. And if they say no, I talk to a superior officer about making sure his officers know the updated laws... They usually don't like that, but I'm always polite.

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    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Castillo View Post
    I ALWAYS call and ask local pd's. After I have read the laws. I do this just to gauge the reaction. If I know it is legal and the officer says it isn't, then I know they will not be friendly about it. And if they say no, I talk to a superior officer about making sure his officers know the updated laws... They usually don't like that, but I'm always polite.
    It has been proven time and time agin "Never ask the police". You are getting one person's opionion, that means nothing if you are a legal situation. Always check the local laws yourself to be 100% sure.
    The Sullivan page can run years behind, many muni's have web sites with everything you need on them. I have chacked those sites before, then called the City Clerk and asked "Has any local law changed since yourweb site was last updated?" I don't get specific, changes to muni-codes are not common.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

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    Despite the fact that there are a few folks responding to this thread indicating that they seek the permission of the police, it really lacks wisdom.

    1. The police have proven time and time again that they are indeed NOT a well schooled authority on the laws within the state or even the jurisdiction that they serve.
    2. The police are NOT on your side, they are in fact on the OPPOSITE side, if they feel any infraction or criminal behavior has taken place, they will clearly define that for you with the "anything you say can and WILL be used AGAINST YOU, they work for and report to the prosecutor, no one else.
    3. Police officers are not judges or lawyers and NOTHING they say can they be held accountable for if things go bad later.
    4. The theory that this is some type of scale as to how a MWG call may be responded to is inherently flawed as this would indeed be ONE officer's opinion and the odds of that particular officer being the one to respond are almost nil since he/she is answering the phone not working the beat.
    5. Even in states where there are no restrictions what so ever there have indeed been misinformed officers go through a variety of harassment methods up to and including drawing and pointing a firearm at a legal citizen.
    6. In MO, because of poor choices in the 80's the law is not state wide, many areas have the potential to change the laws weekly, bi-weekly etc. No matter the method used, what applies today, it may not apply within as little as one day.

    I would not suggest that an out of state person who holds a CCW practice open carry in MO unless they can afford the legal battle that could become reality and long distance legal battles are not cheap, there would be wisdom in concealing until which time the laws become uniform across the state and you are not at the mercy of some pathetic muni-court trying to retain your freedom.

    Do as you wish, I am simply providing the advice and opinion you requested, if you want an accurate answer, contact a bar approved lawyer in the jurisdictions you intend to travel.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Quote Originally Posted by logunowner View Post
    Can I go to the internet and get a copy of the ordinates that are in force when I printed them..yes, can they be changed at the council meeting two weeks before I visit a city...yes.
    This is 100% false. There are no provisions what so ever to indicate that any ordinance you see on the internet is in effect at the time of printing at all and you should NEVER believe that to be true.

    Maplewood MO is a perfect example. They took over a YEAR to update their ordinances. They are not alone either, several of the ones that changes two years ago took over 4 months before it was reflected in their system.

    A couple of years ago a state law was proposed to have a central location used to indeed update them however since it was a voluntary participation there was no need to support it.

    The ONLY way to know for sure is to visit the government office you wish to visit and review their PRINTED version and amended sections, or pay a lawyer to do so for you.

    Don't want to believe me, up to you, but I can assure you that right at this very moment there are indeed ordinance listings online that are wrong and it fails the test when it comes down to "ignorance of the law does not excuse" defense.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

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    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    There was recently a question of "legal" vs. "Not legal" in Ballwin and Manchester. I went to both of the City Halls and looked at the "BOOK". while it is "legal" it is not widley, much at all, practiced. I know of no LEO encounteres even though some have OC'd there. For now best practice - Don't break new ground for 10 days, then if you want to "push the envelope, go crazy". The very last thing "WE" need right now is some one doing something really "S-T-U-P-I-D".

    Be aware the "new" law if it ever happens does not do into effect till Aug. 28th. The LEOs can still arrest you for OC where prohibited by municipal laws even if you do a have a CCW.

    I sincerely hope that the Honorable Governor of the Great State of Missouri JEREMIAH W. (JAY) NIXON will just sit and let HB436 happen Aug. 28th.

    Stay tuned or follow along at:http://governor.mo.gov/actions/

    Let freedom ring!

    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    This is 100% false. There are no provisions what so ever to indicate that any ordinance you see on the internet is in effect at the time of printing at all and you should NEVER believe that to be true.

    Maplewood MO is a perfect example. They took over a YEAR to update their ordinances. They are not alone either, several of the ones that changes two years ago took over 4 months before it was reflected in their system.

    A couple of years ago a state law was proposed to have a central location used to indeed update them however since it was a voluntary participation there was no need to support it.

    The ONLY way to know for sure is to visit the government office you wish to visit and review their PRINTED version and amended sections, or pay a lawyer to do so for you.

    Don't want to believe me, up to you, but I can assure you that right at this very moment there are indeed ordinance listings online that are wrong and it fails the test when it comes down to "ignorance of the law does not excuse" defense.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

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    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    Despite the fact that there are a few folks responding to this thread indicating that they seek the permission of the police, it really lacks wisdom.
    .
    I said I always ask the local PD's AFTER I HAVE READ AND UNDERSTOOD THE LAWS. I NEVER call and ask them permission, or to understand the LAW. I call and ask to gauge their REACTION. I will FULLY agree with the fact that you should NEVER call and ask the local Pd's for permission or to seek legal advice. But IMO, I think it is wise to talk to an officer to see if they will be friendly, or not.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    It has been proven time and time agin "Never ask the police". You are getting one person's opionion, that means nothing if you are a legal situation. Always check the local laws yourself to be 100% sure.
    The Sullivan page can run years behind, many muni's have web sites with everything you need on them. I have chacked those sites before, then called the City Clerk and asked "Has any local law changed since yourweb site was last updated?" I don't get specific, changes to muni-codes are not common.
    I ALWAYS check first. I never said I call them for legal advice.

  20. #20
    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Castillo View Post
    I ALWAYS check first. I never said I call them for legal advice.
    Best youtube video on thepolice ever made:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo2GG...&feature=share
    Long, but heed thelesson of an expert.
    Last edited by mspgunner; 07-03-2013 at 07:06 PM.
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

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    Quote Originally Posted by mspgunner View Post
    Best youtube video on thepolice ever made:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zo2GG...&feature=share
    Long, but heed thelesson of an expert.
    I have seen this video. I think you posted it on the FB page.... I don't Hve to give them my name on the phone... lol I am just saying it is good to know the climate of the city you are going to OC'ing in. Cheack the weather before you head out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Castillo View Post
    I said I always ask the local PD's AFTER I HAVE READ AND UNDERSTOOD THE LAWS. I NEVER call and ask them permission, or to understand the LAW. I call and ask to gauge their REACTION. I will FULLY agree with the fact that you should NEVER call and ask the local Pd's for permission or to seek legal advice. But IMO, I think it is wise to talk to an officer to see if they will be friendly, or not.
    And I simply said what you read may or may not be accurate and quoted KNOWN examples of where it is not. I also clearly stated that when you call, you get ONE officers thoughts which all too often are OPINIONS not facts and the odds of THAT officer stopping you are almost nil, they are likely a dispatch or desk jockey.

    you can call it "friendly or not" if you like, it is seeking permission in my opinion and since you are not talking to the beat cop who is going to respond, you have learned nothing about how an encounter may go.

    The government does not grant rights, all it does is try and take them away. IMHO part of the reason they have made it so muni's can restrict is to discourage it across the state.

    You are a free man, you may call them as you see fit, I am just saying it does no good what so ever to do so and will have no bearing on the outcome of an encounter.
    John C. Eastman Associate Dean of Chapman University’s School of Law "the Second Amendment, like its sister amendments, does not confer a right but rather recognizes a natural right inherent in our humanity."

  23. #23
    Regular Member mspgunner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMTD View Post
    And I simply said what you read may or may not be accurate and quoted KNOWN examples of where it is not. I also clearly stated that when you call, you get ONE officers thoughts which all too often are OPINIONS not facts and the odds of THAT officer stopping you are almost nil, they are likely a dispatch or desk jockey.

    you can call it "friendly or not" if you like, it is seeking permission in my opinion and since you are not talking to the beat cop who is going to respond, you have learned nothing about how an encounter may go.

    The government does not grant rights, all it does is try and take them away. IMHO part of the reason they have made it so muni's can restrict is to discourage it across the state.

    You are a free man, you may call them as you see fit, I am just saying it does no good what so ever to do so and will have no bearing on the outcome of an encounter.
    Exactly. There is no reason to call and talk to them........... It's like asking permission to walk down the street, their "opinon" is useless.........
    If you pull it, you use it. If you pull it and you don't use it, you've done some thing wrong and you might not get another chance. Think about it before you pack it!
    I worked 24/7 for 2A OC rights! Don't like what I did? Try it yourself, it was my full time job!
    Certified NRA Range Safety Officer - RSO

  24. #24
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    Has the trip occurred? If so, how did it go? If not, can you delay your trip until August?

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