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Thread: I DEMAND charges be filed

  1. #1
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    I DEMAND charges be filed

    http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...story-edition/

    This porker broker the law. I'd be charged, you'd be charged. He better be charged and fired!
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Addding FUQ -

    ...he stopped in the bathroom en route to watch a movie, put the weapon on top of a toilet paper dispenser, then forgot about it and left.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by 77zach View Post
    http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/201...story-edition/

    This porker broker the law. I'd be charged, you'd be charged. He better be charged and fired!

    Better to get rid of the stupid law. For the entirely human act of forgetting a consitutionally protected piece of property, a person should be caged? Nope.

    Consider for a moment: the only reason this law exists is because the painty-waists and limp-wrists got scared of guns. And, in their refusal to connect rationality with experience, decided its better to criminalize predictable human forgetfulness than to just teach kids from the second grade forward about firearm safety.

    I just can't imagine there would be all that much concern about .45 Peacemake left in an outhouse in 1885 where a kid could find it.

    Get rid of the dumb law. Teach kids about firearm safety.
    I'll make you an offer: I will argue and fight for all of your rights, if you will do the same for me. That is the only way freedom can work. We have to respect all rights, all the time--and strive to win the rights of the other guy as much as for ourselves.

    If I am equal to another, how can I legitimately govern him without his express individual consent?

    There is no human being on earth I hate so much I would actually vote to inflict government upon him.

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    Before they know who it is....
    "We believe that this would meet the standard of willful and wanton disregard for the safety of others, to leave a loaded weapon where a child -- and in this case a 9-year-old found the gun -- that certainly put others at risk and we're just thankful that a very responsible abiding law abiding citizen found the gun and did the right thing," said Tampa Police Spokesperson Laura McElroy.
    http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/artic...eater-bathroom

    After they know who it is...
    “But late Tuesday police said they would not pursue charges after it was revealed the gun was owned by Hussey. Today, McElroy told 10 News the decision not to pursue charges against Hussey has nothing to do with his role as a Hillsborough County Sheriff's detective.”
    http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story...storyid=321385
    Last edited by jgullock; 06-21-2013 at 04:11 PM.

  5. #5
    Regular Member 77zach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Get rid of the dumb law. Teach kids about firearm safety.
    Of course.

    The problem is we would be charged with a crime and the jury would be told they have to convict. Government "workers" are always given a pass.
    “If the natural tendencies of mankind are so bad that it is not safe to permit people to be free, how is it that the tendencies of these organizers are always good? Do not the legislators and their appointed agents also belong to the human race? Or do they believe that they themselves are made of a finer clay than the rest of mankind? ” -Bastiat

    I don't "need" to openly carry a handgun or own an "assault weapon" any more than Rosa Parks needed a seat on the bus.

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    Regular Member ADulay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgullock View Post
    Before they know who it is....
    "We believe that this would meet the standard of willful and wanton disregard for the safety of others, to leave a loaded weapon where a child -- and in this case a 9-year-old found the gun -- that certainly put others at risk and we're just thankful that a very responsible abiding law abiding citizen found the gun and did the right thing," said Tampa Police Spokesperson Laura McElroy.
    http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/article/ ... r-bathroom

    After they know who it is...
    “But late Tuesday police said they would not pursue charges after it was revealed the gun was owned by Hussey. Today, McElroy told 10 News the decision not to pursue charges against Hussey has nothing to do with his role as a Hillsborough County Sheriff's detective.”
    http://www.wtsp.com/news/local/story.as ... yid=321385
    Well, this is good information to know.

    Now if I should ever do such a thing, I won't have to worry about an arrest or anything.

    Very cool!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Citizen View Post
    Better to get rid of the stupid law. For the entirely human act of forgetting a consitutionally protected piece of property, a person should be caged? Nope.

    .
    I agree ... civil law can take care of this ... not criminal

    Who hasn't left a gun in a public bathroom, come-on!

    And does anyone know where my .45 is right now? Crap! Again?

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    Regular Member CCinMaine's Avatar
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    Re: I DEMAND charges be filed

    How do you go 90 minutes before realizing your edc is gone?

    Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

  9. #9
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CCinMaine View Post
    How do you go 90 minutes before realizing your edc is gone?
    Not an unreasonable question, but not germane to the problem.

    He may have been overly tired or just in a hurry to get seated. Once into the movie, he stayed in the white zone of total immersion in the performance. As kids, our parents referred to watching TV as being hypnotized by the one-eyed monster = same thing.

    Now before someone accuses me of being a police apologist, it just ain't so. What we have is a larger problem of a law that punishes those that commit an act where there is no actual harm - THAT is the problem. Others before me here have said much the same thing.

    Do we have a disparency in how this man is being handled as opposed to how non-LE would likely be handled? - no question, yes. So what do we do, hang 'em high, because others have been hanged? Interesting moral dilemma demanding that we educate others in the foolishness of feel good laws and laws that punish those that might be the cause of injury to others, but no such harm has occurred.

    At the least, he should have a negative report in his file be retrained. Maybe a reduction in grade would be in order. Best case may be all of the forgoing AND get such laws removed from the books. That unfortunately will be a long time coming I fear.

    How many times have I heard, "I get so used to it being there, that I just don't notice it any more." I think this might be easier to do when CCing. Surely should not be the case though.

    Tell a tale on myself, I once left home to attend an OC dinner some 30+ minutes away. Upon arriving in the parking lot, I discovered to my great shock that my 1911 was not in my holster. Fortunately, I had my BUG with me. Point is I broke with my normal routine in my rush not to be late and left my EDC at home. That was no one's fault but mine. There are those that won't let me forget that transgression - and I lead that pack of hounds - but was also reminded that there was no harm, no foul.

    I completely understand equal treatment under the law and have no wish to see anyone "more equal." Think that we should all be given the "break" that this officer received.
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 06-21-2013 at 07:24 AM.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Superlite27's Avatar
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    I have a mounted holster in the console of my vehicle which I use to provide both more comfort while driviing, and easier access should I need it while seated in my vehicle. During entrance/egress from my vehicle, it is a smooth transition from vehicle to holster.

    Only one problem with this set-up that is easily forseen:

    I once went into a convenience store for coffee, whereupon I was approached by another patron and asked, "What's with that empty holster strapped to your belt?".

    (cue uncomfortable lightbulb)

    That was both the first, and last time I left my firearm unattended in my vehicle. Even though it was in my vehicle, and not a public venue, I can see a plausible explanation to "How can a person forget their EDC?": A person just does. If there's any occasion where one does not have their firearm on their person, there is an occasion to potentially forget to put it there.

    This is why removing a firearm in public is a very bad idea. I fully realize that this is a downfall of my mode of vehicle carry, however, I am comfortable with the "odds". I do not plan on forgetting to transition again, but the potential to do so still remains. The risk is also mitigated by the fact that it would be left in a locked vehicle instead of a public restroom for anyone to encounter. Much less of a risk, but still a risk, none the less. However, removing it in a public location? Nope. THAT'S a risk I, and everyone else, should not be comfortable in taking.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Do we have a disparency in how this man is being handled as opposed to how non-LE would likely be handled? - no question, yes. So what do we do, hang 'em high, because others have been hanged?
    Yes. It is no injustice to subject special people to the laws the rest of us are subject to. You might even get their support to repeal bad laws.

  12. #12
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    You can jump up and down and shout from the rooftops all you want. He is not going to have charges filed as if he were some common serf.

    Of course, if someone were to go to the city counsil meetings and ask why the police did not charge him when any non-LEO LAC would have been arrested as soon as they were ID'd as the owner of the gun, something might happen. Especially if someone kept going and asking the question until this LEO was finally charged just to stop the embarassment of having to duck the question at every meeting.

    Is "willful and wanton disregard for the safety of others" a misdemeanor or a felony? If a misdemeanor there may be some discression allowedwhether to charge or not. If a felony I do not believe there is any discression allowed. If a felony and the top cop/state attorney are not filing charges, why not either seek a Writ of Mandamus (a long and complex affair) or file charges of mis- , mal- , and non-feasance? It may become easier for the city to throw the cop under the bus than to keep protecting the Thin Blue Line.

    But it's going to take more than jumping up and down and shouting from the rooftops. Go get them, tiger!

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    You can jump up and down and shout from the rooftops all you want. He is not going to have charges filed as if he were some common serf.

    Of course, if someone were to go to the city counsil meetings and ask why the police did not charge him when any non-LEO LAC would have been arrested as soon as they were ID'd as the owner of the gun, something might happen. Especially if someone kept going and asking the question until this LEO was finally charged just to stop the embarassment of having to duck the question at every meeting.

    Is "willful and wanton disregard for the safety of others" a misdemeanor or a felony? If a misdemeanor there may be some discression allowedwhether to charge or not. If a felony I do not believe there is any discression allowed. If a felony and the top cop/state attorney are not filing charges, why not either seek a Writ of Mandamus (a long and complex affair) or file charges of mis- , mal- , and non-feasance? It may become easier for the city to throw the cop under the bus than to keep protecting the Thin Blue Line.

    But it's going to take more than jumping up and down and shouting from the rooftops. Go get them, tiger!

    stay safe.
    First off, the police do not make charging decisions, the State Attorney does. LEO may only arrest based on PC of a crime being committed. It appears that the PD's first statement, before they knew the identity of the idiot who lost his gun, believed they had such PC.

    784.05
    Whoever, through culpable negligence*, exposes another person to personal injury commits a misdemeanor of the second degree. . .
    Yes, only frequent, continued, public attention (read: embarrassment to the City of Tampa PD, Hillsborough County SO and the State of Florida State Attorney's Office) to this will result in any significant action.

    * Florida Standard Jury Instruction for Culpable Negligence:
    Each of us has a duty to act reasonably toward others. If there is a violation of that duty, without any conscious intention to harm, that violation is negligence. But culpable negligence is more than a failure to use ordinary care for others. In order for negligence to be culpable, it must be gross and flagrant. Culpable negligence is a course of conduct showing reckless disregard for human life, or for the safety of persons exposed to its dangerous effects, or such an entire want of care as to raise a presumption of a conscious indifference to consequences, or which shows wantonness or recklessness, or a grossly careless disregard for the safety and welfare of the public, or shows such an indifference to the rights of others as is equivalent to an intentional violation of such rights.

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