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Has anyone ever asked a LEO thier veiws of OC?

roushstang99

roushstang99

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Location
Kannapolis, NC
Has anyone ever asked a LEO their view of OC?

Since I just started to OC , I thought I would ask a cop friend of mine what his thoughts where on the subject. I asked him as a LEO would you rather see a citizen OC or CC? He said "OC of course, that way he already knows he is armed. If I see someone OC I leave them be unless we receive a call from someone about it. Then just because its part of my job to check it them out." Then I asked if you were not at LEO would you OC or CC. He said " OC because a criminal is less likely to mess with or attack if they see you are armed and go after some one who they think may not be armed. Criminals look for easy targets and don't want to be shot themselves. "

So has anyone ever asked ? What was their answer or concerns?
 
Grapeshot

Grapeshot

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Your friend is well informed beyond what the law might say.

Normally I wouldn't ask a LEO that question - at least not one I did not know well. To do so solicits a personal opinion which should not enter into the equation of how he will do his job.
 
WalkingWolf

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Besides the fact that you should not base your decisions, especially those that might have a major impact, on the personal opinions of others. There are hundreds of LEOs in NC, you would get hundreds of opinions. Research the law, then make a rational decision on what is best for you, based on logic.
 
skeith5

skeith5

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My dad, who was a LEO, isn't find of me oc'ing although he couldn't tell me exactly why. A friend of mine who is Everett pd told me it was a bad idea because you'd be the first victim in a crime. 2 other friends of mine who are police didn't care too much one way or another.
 
Grapeshot

Grapeshot

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skeith5 said:
My dad, who was a LEO, isn't find of me oc'ing although he couldn't tell me exactly why. A friend of mine who is Everett pd told me it was a bad idea because you'd be the first victim in a crime. 2 other friends of mine who are police didn't care too much one way or another.
Click to expand...
Not that urban myth again :banghead:

Ask him for a list of cites - just don't hold your breath waiting. Been disproven too many time before.
 
EMNofSeattle

EMNofSeattle

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S. Kitsap, Washington state
I live in Washington... but I have asked several LEOs the opinion on Open Carry....

the top 5 I got...

Police Chief of a small town near me: "open carry is legal, officers shouldn't harass people obeying the law"

Port Orchard (WA) Police Officer:"if anyone feels threatened I can make an arrest" (note: the law does not say that, and he's never actually carried out that threat to the best of my knowledge)

Kitsap County Deputy: "I don't understand why anyone would, I mean if you're hunting that's one thing, but I don't understand why anyone would in public, however it's not an issue for me and I won't harass people for it"

Washington State Trooper: I think concealed carry is better, but open carry is a right, and I support it as such

Seattle Police Officer (Sergeant): "I never had a problem with open carriers, I have a dislike of people who keep calling them in and wasting our dispatcher's time, I wish KING5 (the local news station) would run a PSA telling people not to do that"

so as you can see, most in my area do not prefer people open carry, but rarely does it actually make problems.

your mileage may vary.
 
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Grapeshot

Grapeshot

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EMNofSeattle said:
--snipped--

your mileage may vary.
Click to expand...
Not by much it won't.

It's a lot like patterning a shotgun. Some pellets may hit the X. Most won't, though many will be grouped to make the pattern obvious. Sometimes reading the flyers is just as important.
 
OC for ME

OC for ME

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Political leanings of the top cop and the city administration tend to set the tone for cops when they engage a OCer, or even if a cop will engage a OCer. It is up to the voting public to elect folks who respect our liberties. This will lead to elected officials appointing/hiring liberty respecting top cops. A good example is the county sheriff.
 
Grapeshot

Grapeshot

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OC for ME said:
Political leanings of the top cop and the city administration tend to set the tone for cops when they engage a OCer, or even if a cop will engage a OCer. It is up to the voting public to elect folks who respect our liberties. This will lead to elected officials appointing/hiring liberty respecting top cops. A good example is the county sheriff.
Click to expand...
Agree. The buck may stop at the top, but the chaff originates from on high.
 
C

Citizen

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Fairfax Co., VA
roushstang99 said:
Has anyone ever asked a LEO their view of OC?

Since I just started to OC , I thought I would ask a cop friend of mine what his thoughts where on the subject. I asked him as a LEO would you rather see a citizen OC or CC? He said "OC of course, that way he already knows he is armed. If I see someone OC I leave them be unless we receive a call from someone about it. Then just because its part of my job to check it them out." Then I asked if you were not at LEO would you OC or CC. He said " OC because a criminal is less likely to mess with or attack if they see you are armed and go after some one who they think may not be armed. Criminals look for easy targets and don't want to be shot themselves. "

So has anyone ever asked ? What was their answer or concerns?
Click to expand...


My, my. What a nice police officer. (slight sarcasm) He's willing to not bother people exercising an enumerated right. But, as soon as he has a slight pretext, he's willing to act like suspicion legitimately attaches to that activity. Using the Nuremburg justification--its part of his job.

I wonder if these cops have any clue they're indicting their entire chain of command by confessing its part of the job to cast suspicion on a fundamental human right.
 
Last edited:
MSG Laigaie

MSG Laigaie

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Philipsburg, Montana
OC for ME said:
Political leanings of the top cop and the city administration tend to set the tone for cops when they engage a OCer, or even if a cop will engage a OCer. It is up to the voting public to elect folks who respect our liberties. This will lead to elected officials appointing/hiring liberty respecting top cops. A good example is the county sheriff.
Click to expand...

Grapeshot said:
Agree. The buck may stop at the top, but the chaff originates from on high.
Click to expand...

This is Truth! The "City of Subdued Excitement" is currently being run by a MAIG member. There are city council members who have great disdain for Armed Citizens. I have sat in meetings with the Deputy Chief where she stated "gun=bad guy".

Does this mean we are getting resistance from above? Yes. Does this mean we should "back off"? No. We will persevere because we have the Constitution and the Law on our side.

The deputy Chief has come around a bit. She now defends OC law instead of impeding it. We are working on the mayor and the city council. Don't forget to vote in next weeks election.
 
W

woodypynes

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1
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Ayden, NC
I have asked our local LEOs.....

after asking about 5 or 6 of them (I'm in a very small town), the reply is a unanimous 'yes' to OC.
However, the last 2 I talked to about OC got very iffy about how to handle someone OC'ing and not willing to ID themselves (after they get a call).
I was told by a Sgt. (who was filling in for the evening...he doesn't work in this town) that I COULD (but "might not") be charged under NCGS 14-223, if I refuse to ID myself "after they get a call and an officer asks me for my information".
Well, not to be dissuaded ... I looked it up. It's a pretty easy Google search. It says if I "willfully AND unlawfully resist, delay, or obstruct (an officer's investigation)" then I am guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. Well, I find that to be quite interesting b/c NC is not a Stop and ID state, therefore I shall not be committing any unlawful act (by not ID'ing) if I am not suspected of committing a crime.
I will call our Chief next week (a very reasonable person, I might add) and ask "in what ways can I LAWFULLY resist, delay, or obstruct?". I can only think of a couple of ways: refusing a search of my person or property without a warrant (because that would definitely delay any investigation, 4th amendment anyone?), refusing to answer any questions I don't want to answer for any reason (because that would certainly delay any investigation, 5th amendment anyone?). There are probably other means by which I could lawfully resist, delay, or obstruct........I would just like to hear what he can come up with. If the answer is "you can NEVER lawfully do that", then I will inquire about the aforementioned amendments.
I know this is a little off the topic of this thread, and I'm not trying to derail it. So, please accept my apologies. Does anyone else have any experience or info on NCGS 14-223?

Stock up and stick together.
 
1245A Defender

1245A Defender

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north mason county, Washington, USA
Well,,,,

woodypynes said:
after asking about 5 or 6 of them (I'm in a very small town), the reply is a unanimous 'yes' to OC.
However, the last 2 I talked to about OC got very iffy about how to handle someone OC'ing and not willing to ID themselves (after they get a call).
I was told by a Sgt. (who was filling in for the evening...he doesn't work in this town) that I COULD (but "might not") be charged under NCGS 14-223, if I refuse to ID myself "after they get a call and an officer asks me for my information".
Well, not to be dissuaded ... I looked it up. It's a pretty easy Google search. It says if I "willfully AND unlawfully resist, delay, or obstruct (an officer's investigation)" then I am guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. Well, I find that to be quite interesting b/c NC is not a Stop and ID state, therefore I shall not be committing any unlawful act (by not ID'ing) if unless I am not suspected of committing a crime.
I will call our Chief next week (a very reasonable person, I might add) and ask "in what ways can I LAWFULLY resist, delay, or obstruct?". I can only think of a couple of ways: refusing a search of my person or property without a warrant (because that would definitely delay any investigation, 4th amendment anyone?), refusing to answer any questions I don't want to answer for any reason (because that would certainly delay any investigation, 5th amendment anyone?). There are probably other means by which I could lawfully resist, delay, or obstruct........I would just like to hear what he can come up with. If the answer is "you can NEVER lawfully do that", then I will inquire about the aforementioned amendments.
I know this is a little off the topic of this thread, and I'm not trying to derail it. So, please accept my apologies. Does anyone else have any experience or info on NCGS 14-223?

Stock up and stick together.
Click to expand...

Changed your quote to show that you cannot,, impede an investigation unless their is RAS of a crime worthy of investigating!
 
papa bear

papa bear

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mayberry, nc
it is my opinion to never, never, never, never, never ever, never ever, and one more time never, ask a LEO anything.
 
P

PALO

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Joined
Feb 12, 2012
Messages
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Location
Kent
roushstang99 said:
Has anyone ever asked a LEO their view of OC?

Since I just started to OC , I thought I would ask a cop friend of mine what his thoughts where on the subject. I asked him as a LEO would you rather see a citizen OC or CC? He said "OC of course, that way he already knows he is armed. If I see someone OC I leave them be unless we receive a call from someone about it. Then just because its part of my job to check it them out." Then I asked if you were not at LEO would you OC or CC. He said " OC because a criminal is less likely to mess with or attack if they see you are armed and go after some one who they think may not be armed. Criminals look for easy targets and don't want to be shot themselves. "

So has anyone ever asked ? What was their answer or concerns?
Click to expand...

I'm an LEO and I support OC. A lot of my coworkers do too. I live in an OC state. Some guys I work with OC.

This think about never talking to police is silly. We don't bite and we are people too. Go ahead and ask your local cop if he supports OC. You might be surprised at the result

If somebody calls on an OC'er in my state, we do not check them out. THat would be harassing. We inform the complainant that OC is legal and treat it as an education opportunity.
 
P

PALO

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Joined
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Messages
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Location
Kent
woodypynes said:
after asking about 5 or 6 of them (I'm in a very small town), the reply is a unanimous 'yes' to OC.
However, the last 2 I talked to about OC got very iffy about how to handle someone OC'ing and not willing to ID themselves (after they get a call).
I was told by a Sgt. (who was filling in for the evening...he doesn't work in this town) that I COULD (but "might not") be charged under NCGS 14-223, if I refuse to ID myself "after they get a call and an officer asks me for my information".
Well, not to be dissuaded ... I looked it up. It's a pretty easy Google search. It says if I "willfully AND unlawfully resist, delay, or obstruct (an officer's investigation)" then I am guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. Well, I find that to be quite interesting b/c NC is not a Stop and ID state, therefore I shall not be committing any unlawful act (by not ID'ing) if I am not suspected of committing a crime.
I will call our Chief next week (a very reasonable person, I might add) and ask "in what ways can I LAWFULLY resist, delay, or obstruct?". I can only think of a couple of ways: refusing a search of my person or property without a warrant (because that would definitely delay any investigation, 4th amendment anyone?), refusing to answer any questions I don't want to answer for any reason (because that would certainly delay any investigation, 5th amendment anyone?). There are probably other means by which I could lawfully resist, delay, or obstruct........I would just like to hear what he can come up with. If the answer is "you can NEVER lawfully do that", then I will inquire about the aforementioned amendments.
I know this is a little off the topic of this thread, and I'm not trying to derail it. So, please accept my apologies. Does anyone else have any experience or info on NCGS 14-223?

Stock up and stick together.
Click to expand...

You are never obligated of course to answer any questions that incriminate you. THere are rare examples where you can get in trouble for not answering a question if it rises to the level of "rendering criminal assistance", like if a fugitive just ran into your house, you know where he is hiding and you refuse to divulge that info.

As for refusing a search of your property w/o a warrant. There are plenty of warrant exceptions such as exigency, community caretaking function, hot pursuit, etc. that allow cops to enter your home w/o a warrant. If you obstruct cops who are entering your home and they have valid cause as listed, you can get charged with obstructing (or whatever similar charge your state has).

What is smart to do is ask. "are you demanding entry or asking for entry?" or something like that. But if the cops are demanding entry and they are lawfully doing so, you can't obstruct them unless you want to risk criminal charges.

In my experience, I enter homes without a warrant most commonly in DV cases. Mostly,. it's exigency/community caretaking reasons e.g. a neighbor calls because they hear a woman crying "help" in a residence and hear what sounds like something slamming against the wall. When the cops get there, the interior lights turn off and nobody will come to the door.

Something like that
 
Last edited:
davidmcbeth

davidmcbeth

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bc.cruiser said:
No. Instead ask "Why am I being detained?" You've now put him on the dime; if the answer is that you are not being detained, say goodbye and leave.
Click to expand...

I don't ask .. I start walking away .. if he says "you can't go anywhere" then you know for sure.

Last time I had a cop interaction, the cop did nothing and I walked away w/o further incident. Don't give him the option for a simple, quite, yes or no ... make him yell at you to stop you from moving. More witnesses.
 
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