Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: OFF TOPIC: .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge .

  1. #1
    Regular Member Bill45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, Washington, USA
    Posts
    160

    OFF TOPIC: .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge .

    Has anyone heard of the .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge ? I just saw one demostrated by Hickock45 on Youtube.

    It is a Mossberg shotgun remanufactured with a pistol grip and a 6.5 inch barrel. Overall length is about 17 inches. It is classified as a AOW (Any Other Weapon) by the BATFE. Only requires a $5 transfer stamp. I have heard.

    Is it legal to own in Washington?

    Seems it would make a great home defense weapon.

    Bill

  2. #2

  3. #3
    Regular Member Bill45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, Washington, USA
    Posts
    160
    The link is interesting but everyone on it except one is in Virginia or N. Carolina.
    Interesting that one of them quotes RCW 9.41. How does that impact a Virginian?

    But I take it that this thing is legal to own in Wa. as it is a pistol.
    Last edited by Bill45; 07-31-2013 at 11:57 PM.

  4. #4
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Kent, Washington, USA
    Posts
    398

    Re: OFF TOPIC: .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge .

    It wouldn't be in my top 10 for home defense, probably not even top 20.

    3 shots if one is already in the chamber? No thanks. It is too easy to miss in a defensive situation, 3 shots just isn't enough for me to be comfortable. I would much rather have an AR pistol with 20 or 30 shots. Same maneuverability, similar effectiveness per shot, but 10 times as many shots.

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Philipsburg, Montana
    Posts
    3,137
    I have seen them in gunshops here in bellingham. They were in the US$750 range. Hard to get holsters for them.
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  6. #6
    Regular Member tombrewster421's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Roy, WA
    Posts
    1,329

    OFF TOPIC: .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge .

    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    I have seen them in gunshops here in bellingham. They were in the US$750 range. Hard to get holsters for them.
    Blade-Tech would make one for you.
    Guns don't kill people, bullets do!

  7. #7
    Regular Member massivedesign's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Olympia, Washington, USA
    Posts
    866
    Completely legal and fun as hell!
    www.WaGuns.org

    Currently mapping locations of Shooting Areas as well as Gun Stores - Let me know what is missing!

  8. #8
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Slightly right of center
    Posts
    166
    How are they with those Aguila mini-shells? Can you fit 4 of them in there?

  9. #9
    Regular Member Mainsail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Silverdale, Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,532
    Quote Originally Posted by Flopsweat View Post
    How are they with those Aguila mini-shells? Can you fit 4 of them in there?
    I don't know the answer to this question however...

    I tried the mini shells in my 590A1 and they had a tendency to roll over during feeding from the magazine so that the primer was facing forward.

    Since the receiver on the Serbu is the same as the full size model (Maverick or 870) I have to think they'd do the same thing.
    Last edited by Mainsail; 08-03-2013 at 12:59 PM.

  10. #10
    Regular Member Bill45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, Washington, USA
    Posts
    160
    Quote Originally Posted by arentol View Post
    It wouldn't be in my top 10 for home defense, probably not even top 20.

    3 shots if one is already in the chamber? No thanks. It is too easy to miss in a defensive situation, 3 shots just isn't enough for me to be comfortable. I would much rather have an AR pistol with 20 or 30 shots. Same maneuverability, similar effectiveness per shot, but 10 times as many shots.

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
    The problem with high power rifle ammo is it has a tendancy to penatrate walls and kill targets at great distance. Not what you need for home defense or any use in a urban environment.

    But if it takes some people 20 or 30 shots to do the job, well a "Mans gotta do what a mans gotta do."

  11. #11
    Regular Member tombrewster421's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Roy, WA
    Posts
    1,329

    OFF TOPIC: .Serbu Super Shorty 12 Gauge .

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill45 View Post
    The problem with high power rifle ammo is it has a tendancy to penatrate walls and kill targets at great distance. Not what you need for home defense or any use in a urban environment.

    But if it takes some people 20 or 30 shots to do the job, well a "Mans gotta do what a mans gotta do."
    Remember that an AR is not high powered but medium powered. At least in the most common .223 form. Also, if an AR is of no use in an urban environment then why do police and military use them there?

    Personally I much prefer my full size home defense shotty that holds 7+1 over that novelty gun. A lot of flash out of a 6" barrel with not a lot of velocity or accuracy.
    Guns don't kill people, bullets do!

  12. #12
    Regular Member Bill45's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Tacoma, Washington, USA
    Posts
    160
    Quote Originally Posted by tombrewster421 View Post
    Remember that an AR is not high powered but medium powered. At least in the most common .223 form. Also, if an AR is of no use in an urban environment then why do police and military use them there?

    Personally I much prefer my full size home defense shotty that holds 7+1 over that novelty gun. A lot of flash out of a 6" barrel with not a lot of velocity or accuracy.
    Oh, I agree that the usablility of a 6.5 in barreled shotgun is quite low, recovery after recoil,accuracy all make it a very short range weapon. I too will take my 11/87 police over this novelty. But it looks like a fun gun.

    As for the .223 issue, the police have vastly better fire disipline (I hope) than the average spray and pray civilian. And the military don't mind wiping out the bad guy through 3 mud walls.
    Tell the kid on the bicycle half a mile a way(or your own child 3 house walls away) who is crippled that the .223 is ONLY a medium power round.
    Last edited by Bill45; 08-03-2013 at 02:06 PM.

  13. #13
    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Bremerton, Washington, United States
    Posts
    884
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill45 View Post
    Oh, I agree that the usablility of a 6.5 in barreled shotgun is quite low, recovery after recoil,accuracy all make it a very short range weapon. I too will take my 11/87 police over this novelty. But it looks like a fun gun.

    As for the .223 issue, the police have vastly better fire disipline (I hope) than the average spray and pray civilian. And the military don't mind wiping out the bad guy through 3 mud walls.
    Tell the kid on the bicycle half a mile a way(or your own child 3 house walls away) who is crippled that the .223 is ONLY a medium power round.
    Having tried a recreation of the police qualification course don't get your hopes up. Even a poor shooter could pass it. The reason they use .223 is that the round is far less likely to penetrate a wall than even a pistol round. The .223 fragments easily. There's a youtube video where they shot different calibers through varying degrees of wall thickness and the .223 had the least amount of overpenetration. It's not going to go through a wall and go half a mile or even 20 feet. Especially if you use hollow points.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

  14. #14
    Regular Member Mainsail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Silverdale, Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,532
    Quote Originally Posted by arentol View Post
    It wouldn't be in my top 10 for home defense, probably not even top 20.

    3 shots if one is already in the chamber? No thanks. It is too easy to miss in a defensive situation...
    Can you please cite even ONE occurrence where a bad guy breaking into someone's house kept coming after the homeowner fired a round in their direction? Just regular folks like us; not a mob hit, drug dealer money laundering house, or something you saw on a movie.

  15. #15
    Regular Member gsx1138's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Bremerton, Washington, United States
    Posts
    884
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainsail View Post
    Can you please cite even ONE occurrence where a bad guy breaking into someone's house kept coming after the homeowner fired a round in their direction? Just regular folks like us; not a mob hit, drug dealer money laundering house, or something you saw on a movie.
    I was going to give you an example but I guess Bad Boys 2 doesn't count given the last part of your statement.
    "Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world." ~ Musashi

  16. #16
    Regular Member bmg50cal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    WA - North Whidbey/ Deception Pass
    Posts
    307
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill45 View Post
    But I take it that this thing is legal to own in Wa. as it is a pistol.
    It is not a pistol...

  17. #17
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Slightly right of center
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainsail View Post
    I don't know the answer to this question however...

    I tried the mini shells in my 590A1 and they had a tendency to roll over during feeding from the magazine so that the primer was facing forward.

    Since the receiver on the Serbu is the same as the full size model (Maverick or 870) I have to think they'd do the same thing.
    Thanks!

  18. #18
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Slightly right of center
    Posts
    166
    Quote Originally Posted by Mainsail View Post
    Can you please cite even ONE occurrence where a bad guy breaking into someone's house kept coming after the homeowner fired a round in their direction? Just regular folks like us; not a mob hit, drug dealer money laundering house, or something you saw on a movie.
    You were so nice to me with that previous post, and now I'm going to pull this. What's become of me?

    This lady shot a burglar 5 times and threatened to shoot again before the guy finally left:
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1234400

    There are a lot more stories where it seems as though they must have stuck around for a bit, but it never specifically says that they didn't leave after the first shot from the homeowner. At least not the 8 of them that I read through before I got bored. Well, there are ones where the bad guy is shot multiple times, but that doesn't mean he didn't leave as soon as he figured out that he'd been shot. But the lady counts as one, right?

  19. #19
    Campaign Veteran MSG Laigaie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Philipsburg, Montana
    Posts
    3,137
    Quote Originally Posted by bmg50cal View Post
    It is not a pistol...
    26 U.S.C. § 5845(E)
    For the purposes of the National Firearms Act, the term “Any Other Weapon” means:

    Any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive;
    A pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell;
    Weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading; and
    Any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire.
    Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition.

    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/guides/i...n-nfa-aow.html
    "Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the people's liberty teeth (and) keystone... the rifle and the pistol are equally indispensable... more than 99% of them by their silence indicate that they are in safe and sane hands. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference .When firearms go, all goes, we need them every hour." -- George Washington

  20. #20
    Regular Member Batousaii's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Kitsap Co., Washington, USA
    Posts
    1,234

    Interesting... But...

    I thought SBR/SBS is not legal in WA.
    - So, is it NOT classed as an SBS since it only has a pistol grip??? AOW is legel in WA???
    - Can other, slightly longer versions with say 4+1 be found?

    - If this is legal, could a double bbl coach gun version be had? (I like old skooll stuff).

    I think a small shogun would be a blast if one can own it
    Last edited by Batousaii; 08-04-2013 at 01:10 PM.
    ~ ENCLAVE vmc ~
    The Enclave is looking for patriotic motorcycle riders in Washington State who support liberty and freedom for all. ~ Check us out!
    ~
    * " To be swayed neither by the opponent nor by his sword is the essence of swordsmanship." - Miyamoto Musashi.

  21. #21
    Regular Member bmg50cal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    WA - North Whidbey/ Deception Pass
    Posts
    307
    Quote Originally Posted by MSG Laigaie View Post
    26 U.S.C. § 5845(E)
    For the purposes of the National Firearms Act, the term “Any Other Weapon” means:

    Any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive;
    A pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell;
    Weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading; and
    Any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire.
    Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition.

    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/guides/i...n-nfa-aow.html
    According the manufacturer it is considered an "AOW pump shotgun." When it was redesigned it was neither a pistol nor a revolver to begin with so the second USC definition does not apply. The first applies.

  22. #22
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Kent
    Posts
    747
    Quote Originally Posted by Bill45 View Post
    Oh, I agree that the usablility of a 6.5 in barreled shotgun is quite low, recovery after recoil,accuracy all make it a very short range weapon. I too will take my 11/87 police over this novelty. But it looks like a fun gun.

    As for the .223 issue, the police have vastly better fire disipline (I hope) than the average spray and pray civilian. And the military don't mind wiping out the bad guy through 3 mud walls.
    Tell the kid on the bicycle half a mile a way(or your own child 3 house walls away) who is crippled that the .223 is ONLY a medium power round.
    I am an instructor for cops and also civilians, so I think I have some relevant observations here

    1) the AVERAGE cop is a "just ok" shooter at best. A small %age, maybe 10 % are very good, but most cops are just ok. A LOT of new recruits come into this job having never fired a gun. I suggest cops in shall issue states are better shots than those in may issue, since the former locales make it easier for people to get access to guns and go shooting when one grows up. This part is speculation

    2) the average civilian ime is not 'spray and pray'. The average civilian who goes through the trouble to get a permit etc. is usually a pretty decent shot. My agency runs qualifications twice a year, mandatory. Most officers ONLY shoot at those times. However our union contract entitles us to also have 1 hr shooting session per month. Very few take advantage of this. We also get issued 2 boxes of ammo a month!!! which is a wicked pissah perk, but a surprising # of officers don't request their ammo each month - it's not just given to you; you have to request it and sign a log book and the sgt. hands you two boxes. I have NO idea what ammo costs because I've never had to buy it

  23. #23
    Regular Member FMJ 911's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    People's Republic of Snohomishia
    Posts
    351
    What are the rules on the Super Shorty for Vehicle Carry? Ya know, storing inside a car for when it might be needed.
    Last edited by FMJ 911; 08-06-2013 at 04:02 PM.
    "May God have mercy upon my enemies, because I won't." — George Patton

  24. #24
    Regular Member 509rifas's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Yakima County
    Posts
    253
    How is that not a short-barreled shotgun?
    It's short-barreled, and it's a shotgun...
    LIVE FREE OR DIE TRYING

  25. #25
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    earth's crust
    Posts
    17,838
    Quote Originally Posted by arentol View Post
    It wouldn't be in my top 10 for home defense, probably not even top 20.

    3 shots if one is already in the chamber? No thanks. It is too easy to miss in a defensive situation, 3 shots just isn't enough for me to be comfortable. I would much rather have an AR pistol with 20 or 30 shots. Same maneuverability, similar effectiveness per shot, but 10 times as many shots.

    Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2
    http://www.outdoorlife.com/files/pho...gunshotgun.jpg


    put in an extension tube - a 10 rounder ! Shooting slugs, you're fine.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •