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Thread: Is a flap holster OC?

  1. #1
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    Is a flap holster OC?

    My boss came over to my desk this morning to ask me some questions about what ID is needed for a FFL transfer. It seems that he finally decided to take the plunge and buy a handgun, and is getting ready to go pick it up from a local FFL. It's a nice looking Walther P1, and it is coming with two magazines and a flap-style holster.

    Now, I don't expect that he's planning to carry it (based on what he's said so far), but it got me thinking, would a flap-style holster (which completely covers the gun, much like this one) be considered OC? My gut says no, because it would essentially be hidden from "common observation" and could look just like a pouch on your belt, disguising its nature.

    But, what my gut says and what the law would say aren't always the same thing. Any thoughts?
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  2. #2
    Founder's Club Member Tess's Avatar
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    My opinion is the holster you linked to is OC; it's shaped like a gun and rather obvious - to me. After all, if a pop tart can look like a gun, surely a holster will.

    On the other hand, something like this would be CC.

  3. #3
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Here we go again. Seems we have this discussion at least once a year.

    18.2-308. Carrying concealed weapons; exceptions; penalty.
    A. If any person carries about his person, hidden from common observation, (i) any pistol, revolver, or other weapon designed or intended to propel a missile of any kind by action of an explosion of any combustible material;....
    A very literal interpretation would say that the handgun itself must be visable to common observation or it is considered to be concealed. Just as the item Tess has linked to removes the handgun from common observation, a flap holster might be said to do the same. But that is a very literal interpretation.

    A flap holster suggests that there is a handgun inside. Although quite rare and IMHO rather stupid I have met someone who thought it would be "cool" to carry their cellphone in such a holster. As far as I know they have never been shot when reaching to make a call.

    The question is how much of a chance does your boss want to take that he runs up against a very literal-minded cop? And then goes in front of a very literal-minded judge? I do not recall any case law that addresses the issue. Now, if it had been saddlebags, or handbags, or even saddle holsters we could point to previous court decisions for guidance. Unfortunately, flap holsters seem to be uncharted territory.

    If your boss is looking for "discrete", as opposed to actially concealed, carry I would suggest that a flap holster would draw more attention to the presence of what is probably a gun inside, as opposed to a cellphone or lipstick or the proverbial ham sandwhich. Flap holsters of the type you show are, at least in the minds of folks of a certain age, associated with being worn when in uniform and often with the wearing of a Sam Browne belt - which is just moderately more ostentatious than a 1911 in a M1916 holster and cotton corded lanyard.

    stay safe.
    Last edited by skidmark; 08-06-2013 at 02:00 PM.
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    Accomplished Advocate peter nap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    Here we go again. Seems we have this discussion at least once a year.
    Yep!
    Next up..."Can a cop take my gun for officer safety"

  5. #5
    Campaign Veteran skidmark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peter nap View Post
    Yep!
    Next up..."Can a cop take my gun for officer safety"
    I thought cops had their own guns for their safety. Was there a change I have not heard about?

    stay safe.
    "He'll regret it to his dying day....if ever he lives that long."----The Quiet Man

    Because stupidity isn't a race, and everybody can win.

    "No matter how much contempt you have for the media in all this, you don't have enough"
    ----Allahpundit

  6. #6
    Campaign Veteran marshaul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark View Post
    ...which is just moderately more ostentatious than a 1911 in a M1916 holster
    BTDT. Granted, the holster was a reproduction.

    It better not be illegal.

    Of course, it's kind of moot as the M1916 doesn't actually cover the whole gun.

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