BriKuz
Regular Member
I have a thread going over in OFCC's 9.68 compliance thread, but I wanted to get some input from the Open Carry crowd, of which I consider myself one of. I will try to give a concise overview of events that have transpired up to now.
Aug. 2
I sent a message to the Morrow County Fair Board, stating that I believed the signs posted "No Carry" at the fair were illegal.
Aug. 13
I placed a call to follow up with the fair board, and was given the number for Dan Rogers, President of the Morrow County Fair Board. I called Mr. Rogers, and stated that my wife and I planned on attending, and we WOULD be open carrying, as that is the law. I also stated that my emails to him and others were all public record, and could show that the relevant laws and court decisions WERE known to them ahead of time, and that any harassment could lead to a 1984 federal civil rights lawsuit. He told me NOT to threaten him. He said that he was a CHL holder, but he feels the signs are okay, and referred me to the Morrow County Prosecutor and Sheriff.
I then spoke with Mr. Charles Howland, the Morrow County Prosecutor. Mr. Howland stated that he does NOT represent the Fair Board, but that his understanding of the law showed that the fair could NOT post the open areas of the fair, but he wasn't sure about the buildings. (In Ohio, public buildings ARE forbidden, excepting dedicated restroom, open air pavilions, and parking garages.)
I sent a version of My Wife Said Yes' letter to the fair board:
We are a group of concerned citizens here in Ross County. It has come to our attention that the parking lots and entrances to the Ross County Fairgrounds are posted with “No Gun” signs in clear violation of Ohio Revised Code 9.68.
In response to this discovery, one of our members contacted the Sheriff to discuss the issue. The Sheriff stated that the Ross County Agricultural Society leases the fairgrounds from Ross County for $1 per year and considers itself to be a private organization, thereby allowing it to post the fairgrounds as a No Gun Zone. After contacting Ohioans for Concealed Carry and doing a little research, we discovered that this is not correct. The Ohio Attorney General has determined in Ohio Attorney General Opinion 88-034 that Agricultural Societies are political subdivisions. Furthermore, the Ohio Supreme Court ruled in Greene County Agricultural Society v. Liming (2000), 89 Ohio St. 3d 551 that Agricultural Societies are political subdivisions. Political subdivisions can NOT violate Ohio’s Concealed Carry Law and specifically ORC 9.68. We have enclosed the Attorney General’s Opinion 88-034 and the Supreme Court Case “Greene County Agricultural Society v. Liming (2000), 89 Ohio St. 3d 551” for your review.
Therefore, we request that you promptly remove the “No Gun” signs at the entrances to the parking lots and entrances to the fair itself. It is our hope that we can resolve this issue amicably and our only goal is to have the signs removed in accordance with the law.
Aug. 14th
I received the following e-mail from Mr. Rogers in reply:
The Morrow County Sherriff will be in contact with you on this issue.
A copy of your e mail will be forwarded to the Ohio Attorney General’s Office.
Dan Rogers, Morrow County Agricultural Society
This reply was also cced to Sheriff Brenneman.
I spoke with Sheriff Brenneman, and he stated that he has not had enough time to look into all of the details as of yet, as he is VERY busy with the NASCAR Nationwide Series race at Mid-Ohio this weekend. He told me he would be in touch at the beginning of next week.
Aug 15th
I received a call from:
Michael A. Vartorella
Chief Inspector
Assistant Division Chief
Amusement Ride Safety.
Director of Fairs
He stated that he had not yet run me through the DHS database yet, but that the M. Cty. Fair Board was concerned with some "extremist" coming down from Cleveland to "their" fair. He stated that he thinks the signs are improper, but that I should just carry concealed. I responded that my wife and I are still waiting on our CHLs, and would not generally choose to carry that way (discreetly) regardless... He mentioned "putting a target on your back" at least 8 times... he then said that the Fair Board was also contacting the Ohio AGs office...
MWSY, my wife and I were planning on attending the fair... but I am beginning to feel concern for the response we may receive.. Any comments or feedback?
Aug. 2
I sent a message to the Morrow County Fair Board, stating that I believed the signs posted "No Carry" at the fair were illegal.
Aug. 13
I placed a call to follow up with the fair board, and was given the number for Dan Rogers, President of the Morrow County Fair Board. I called Mr. Rogers, and stated that my wife and I planned on attending, and we WOULD be open carrying, as that is the law. I also stated that my emails to him and others were all public record, and could show that the relevant laws and court decisions WERE known to them ahead of time, and that any harassment could lead to a 1984 federal civil rights lawsuit. He told me NOT to threaten him. He said that he was a CHL holder, but he feels the signs are okay, and referred me to the Morrow County Prosecutor and Sheriff.
I then spoke with Mr. Charles Howland, the Morrow County Prosecutor. Mr. Howland stated that he does NOT represent the Fair Board, but that his understanding of the law showed that the fair could NOT post the open areas of the fair, but he wasn't sure about the buildings. (In Ohio, public buildings ARE forbidden, excepting dedicated restroom, open air pavilions, and parking garages.)
I sent a version of My Wife Said Yes' letter to the fair board:
We are a group of concerned citizens here in Ross County. It has come to our attention that the parking lots and entrances to the Ross County Fairgrounds are posted with “No Gun” signs in clear violation of Ohio Revised Code 9.68.
In response to this discovery, one of our members contacted the Sheriff to discuss the issue. The Sheriff stated that the Ross County Agricultural Society leases the fairgrounds from Ross County for $1 per year and considers itself to be a private organization, thereby allowing it to post the fairgrounds as a No Gun Zone. After contacting Ohioans for Concealed Carry and doing a little research, we discovered that this is not correct. The Ohio Attorney General has determined in Ohio Attorney General Opinion 88-034 that Agricultural Societies are political subdivisions. Furthermore, the Ohio Supreme Court ruled in Greene County Agricultural Society v. Liming (2000), 89 Ohio St. 3d 551 that Agricultural Societies are political subdivisions. Political subdivisions can NOT violate Ohio’s Concealed Carry Law and specifically ORC 9.68. We have enclosed the Attorney General’s Opinion 88-034 and the Supreme Court Case “Greene County Agricultural Society v. Liming (2000), 89 Ohio St. 3d 551” for your review.
Therefore, we request that you promptly remove the “No Gun” signs at the entrances to the parking lots and entrances to the fair itself. It is our hope that we can resolve this issue amicably and our only goal is to have the signs removed in accordance with the law.
Aug. 14th
I received the following e-mail from Mr. Rogers in reply:
The Morrow County Sherriff will be in contact with you on this issue.
A copy of your e mail will be forwarded to the Ohio Attorney General’s Office.
Dan Rogers, Morrow County Agricultural Society
This reply was also cced to Sheriff Brenneman.
I spoke with Sheriff Brenneman, and he stated that he has not had enough time to look into all of the details as of yet, as he is VERY busy with the NASCAR Nationwide Series race at Mid-Ohio this weekend. He told me he would be in touch at the beginning of next week.
Aug 15th
I received a call from:
Michael A. Vartorella
Chief Inspector
Assistant Division Chief
Amusement Ride Safety.
Director of Fairs
He stated that he had not yet run me through the DHS database yet, but that the M. Cty. Fair Board was concerned with some "extremist" coming down from Cleveland to "their" fair. He stated that he thinks the signs are improper, but that I should just carry concealed. I responded that my wife and I are still waiting on our CHLs, and would not generally choose to carry that way (discreetly) regardless... He mentioned "putting a target on your back" at least 8 times... he then said that the Fair Board was also contacting the Ohio AGs office...
MWSY, my wife and I were planning on attending the fair... but I am beginning to feel concern for the response we may receive.. Any comments or feedback?