The RIGHT to travel

Freedom1Man · Aug 30, 2013

I am creating this to move all RTT discussion to it's own dedicated thread.

I am starting with this news story.
http://news.antiwar.com/2013/08/29/in-blow-to-no-fly-list-us-judge-rules-air-travel-is-a-right/

In Blow to ‘No Fly’ List, US Judge Rules Air Travel Is a Right
Precedent Could Allow Fliers to Contest Travel Bans
by Jason Ditz, August 29, 2013
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Though the case itself is still far from over, a major victory was scored for opponents of the US “no fly” list when US District Judge Anna Brown ruled that the ability to travel internationally by airplane is a constitutionally protected right.

davidmcbeth · Aug 30, 2013

There have been other cases ~ we have a right to travel AND choose the mode

so this is no surprise ...

eye95 · Aug 30, 2013

The OP only cited an article, not a case. A later post cited a case, but nowhere in that ruling could I find that the court ruled that air travel is a right.

Can someone support the assertion that a court has ruled that air travel is a right?

davidmcbeth · Aug 30, 2013

Plenty of cases concerning the right to travel. I would not want to cite specific cases when so many are available.

Google scholar is your friend. I'm not a legal secretary.

eye95 · Aug 30, 2013

First of all, I am not addressing you, troll. You ain't worth getting into a discussion with. I was addressing the OP and the second poster, as should be obvious to anyone with a modicum of intelligence based on the posts I discussed--but is clearly not obvious to you.

Second, I am specifically asking for support of the specific contention that a "US Judge Rules Air Travel Is a Right."

Why don't you let the adults talk?

Moving on from your juvenile distraction.

Can someone (one of the adults around here) provide support for that specific contention?

davidmcbeth · Aug 30, 2013

eye95 said:
First of all, I am not addressing you,

OK your highness , sorry to have bothered you.

Thanks for playing though !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A

Freedom1Man · Aug 31, 2013

eye95 said:
The OP only cited an article, not a case. A later post cited a case, but nowhere in that ruling could I find that the court ruled that air travel is a right.

Can someone support the assertion that a court has ruled that air travel is a right?

The thread was created for discussion to shunt this level of discussion from being off topic on other threads and to suggest a place for moderators to re-condense this discussion onto it's own thread when brought up. I believed that the article would be a fun one to point for 'kick off.'

IF you really wanted some research I could link you do the research some legislators have done on this topic.

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

The following was quoted in the thread as though true, yet no cite for this very specific statement has been provided.

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

Freedom1Man · Aug 31, 2013

eye95 said:
The following was quoted in the thread as though true, yet no cite for this very specific statement has been provided.

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

You've failed to cite other requests, why should I even humor yours?

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

sudden valley gunner · Aug 31, 2013

davidmcbeth said:
I have the right to east spaghetti ... yet I cannot find a case that says I can.

That's a privilege because it's not enumerated.

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

Someone quoted the following bolded statement as though it were true. I am asking for a cite to a case that the claim says exists.

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

fjpro2a · Aug 31, 2013

Confused!!

I do not know why a few are "playing" with eye95. All he is asking for is a cite, and what does he get? Senseless responses and talk about "spaghetti." It would be wise to give him a cite. I, also, would like a cite to read. I am always amused by those who can dish it out, but can't take it. Come on, guys. Let's work together, and be more concerned with laws and rulings that hurt the open carry cause.

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

fjpro2a said:
I do not know why a few are "playing" with eye95. All he is asking for is a cite, and what does he get? Senseless responses and talk about "spaghetti." It would be wise to give him a cite. I, also, would like a cite to read. I am always amused by those who can dish it out, but can't take it. Come on, guys. Let's work together, and be more concerned with laws and rulings that hurt the open carry cause.

Thank you. I am not even contending that such a cite does not exist nor that it is not controlling. That the judge asserted that air travel is a right might well be a direct and accurate quotation from a controlling ruling. It could also be a conclusion of the author of the article. It could be from a dissenting opinion. It could be from a lower-court ruling that has been overturned. There are dozens of possibilities how that particular statement was made by the writer and then quoted here.

Intelligent discussion of the point is only possible if we know the provenance of the quotation.

Kinda why we have a rule around here about supporting assertions about the law.

Anyway, if they keep ducking their responsibility to cite, I will simply keep asking.

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

Nightmare said:
The OP is of the right to travel, of which there is one arguably.

The thread has been hijacked and narrowed to the demand for an opinion/decision on the right to air travel based on a related civil rights case in which the Ninth Circus Court of Appeals judge has said that she doesn't know when she will issue her opinion/decision.

The demand for the cite is based on a quote in the OP. Feel free to continue to assert that asking for a cite for something in the OP is somehow a "hijacking." That assertion looks pretty damned foolish.

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

MackTheKnife · Aug 31, 2013

Without taking anyone's side, what's wrong with sharing the info if you have it?

Razor Max Tapatalk.

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

If a judge has "ruled," there IS a case, so there IS something to cite. If there is no such case, then the assertion of a ruling is false.

More ducking.

So, once again, asked as simply as humanly possible, in what case did a "US Judge Rule[] Air Travel Is a Right"? Cite please. One single cite. Name the case or, preferably, link the one very specific decision.

Keep ducking, and I'll keep asking.

JamesCanby · Aug 31, 2013

According to the article linked in the OP, I believe that the judge has overstepped constitutional authority by implying that international travel by commercial aircraft is a constitutional right. There are alternate ways to travel internationally. One can drive into Canada and Mexico. One can board a ship and sail between continents. One can charter a private aircraft. The law does not preclude travel simply by being included on a no-fly list. Being able to travel on a commercial aircraft is a convenience.

"According to the article, the judge has not ruled finally on the case, having given the litigants until September 9th to provide additional testimony, so the "conclusions" reached are at best premature.

But the judge said she was not ready to decide on a proper remedy in the case, suggesting the answer hinged on whether the plaintiffs had an adequate avenue of appeal.

"The court is not yet able to resolve on the current record whether the judicial-review process is a sufficient, post-deprivation process under the ... Constitution," she wrote.

She gave both sides until September 9 to recommend a process "to better develop the record" so she can complete her ruling."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/08/29/us-usa-courts-nofly-idUSBRE97S1B820130829

eye95 · Aug 31, 2013

The problem is that neither the article nor the OP link the ruling.

So we have no idea whether or not a judge truly ruled the way the headline indicates.

It could simply be the erroneous conclusion of the article's author. Until someone decides to post a link to the ruling, rather than swallowing the conclusion whole, we won't know whether a judge even said such a thing, let alone whether the "ruling" is controlling.

So, discussing the statement is kind of pointless until we can read the "ruling."

Too many people read something they want to agree with, so they don't bother to check out its truth or its provenance. That is intellectual laziness.

sudden valley gunner · Sep 1, 2013

How sad so many want to wait for government to decide what a right is.

The RIGHT to travel

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