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Thread: Edmonds police shoot individual carrying rifle

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    Campaign Veteran slapmonkay's Avatar
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    Edmonds police shoot individual carrying rifle

    Don't know any circumstances around it yet.

    http://q13fox.com/2013/09/07/edmonds...arrying-rifle/

    Edmonds police shot a 27-year old man who was reportedly walking down the street and carrying a rifle Saturday morning. Everett police spokesman Aaron Snell confirmed that a 911 call came in around 7:30am reporting that the man was walking eastbound on Olympic View Drive. Edmonds police officers responded and told the man to put down the rifle. The man reportedly refused to comply with the officers request and police shot the man. Snell would not say how many shots were fired, or if the man fired his rifle.
    Last edited by slapmonkay; 09-07-2013 at 02:54 PM.
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    Campaign Veteran slapmonkay's Avatar
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    http://www.king5.com/home/Edmonds-po...222808221.html

    Edmonds Chief of Police Al Compaan says at around 7:30 a.m. Saturday, police received multiple 911 calls about a man walking the streets with a rifle.
    Two Edmonds police officers approached the man and ordered him to put down his rifle. When the man did not comply with the officers orders the officers shot the man.
    Police are still investigating what happened after officers ordered the man to drop his weapon, but witnesses say they heard what sounded like rifle shots before the officers shot the man.
    I Am Not A Lawyer, verify all facts presented independently.

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    Last edited by Nightmare; 09-07-2013 at 03:06 PM.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    No question but that this bears watching - details needed.

    ...... walking down the street and carrying a rifle - 911 call - police officers responded - told the man to put down the rifle - man reportedly refused - police shot the man............Very informative media report....NOT.
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    Campaign Veteran slapmonkay's Avatar
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    http://www.komonews.com/news/local/P...222811551.html

    The armed man, a 27-year-old from Edmonds, was hit at least once. He was taken to Harborview Medical Center in serious condition, according to Aaron Snell with the Snohomish County Multiple Agency Response Team.

    The two officers involved are both veterans of the Everett Police Department. Neither man is being identified, but Snell said one is a sergeant with 15 years on the force, and the second is a corporal with 14 years experience.
    I Am Not A Lawyer, verify all facts presented independently.

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    Sure, they gave him a chance ... sure they did....who is saying this? Oh, the cops. Well, their word is not the word of an unbiased witness so I give it the weight it deserves (which is zilch).

    I'll wait to pass judgment on this one when actual reliable facts are known.

    Now when a cop tells you to touch your weapon..DO NOT DO IT...he'll shoot you and say you had the gun in your hand(s). (Not a lie, right?). Just put your hands in the air away from the gun and wait. If you want to play it this way.

    Hope the guy survives and some witnesses come forth..

    Who knows, this may be an acceptable shooting....but maybe not.

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    from linky:

    Snell said that police don’t yet know the motive for the man carrying the rifle nor whether he had a mental illness.

    Well, we don't know if the cops have a mental illness either, right? What an a--hole.

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    Campaign Veteran slapmonkay's Avatar
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    From SeattleTimes:

    Police spokesman Aaron Snell, who is with the Everett police, said the Edmonds man had been walking in an area near Edmonds Elementary waving a rifle. His behavior prompted two 911 calls from nearby residents, Snell said. It doesn’t appear the man discharged the weapon. he added.
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    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    I'm willing to wager..... that it's a clean shoot.

    let's think, police (two officers who apparently are upper ranking and each have 15 years of experience) encounter an armed man and order him to put down a rifle.

    would an experienced officer order a man to put his hand on the weapon? unlikely... so we can reason the rifle wasn't slung on his back since ordering someone to unsling a rifle would involve the man being ordered so to put the rifle in hand. if they intended to disarm a man with a slung rifle they would've proned him and taken off his rifle after getting adaquate backup.

    so we have most likely someone carrying this rifle in his hands... which can be construed as a violation of RCW 9.41.270. especially since according to the article the site was near an elementary school, so guy walking in public with rifle in hand gets called in by 911 caller, dispatcher fears a sandy hook copycat, dispatches officers, officers confront guy, and detain him under probable cause of a criminal violation, man refuses to comply with officer safety instructions, maybe points weapon towards them? they fire....

    I'm willing to wager I'm right about the rifle in hand.... I see no reason why a seasoned officer would demand someone to unsling a rifle.... and thus make their rifle ready to be used against the officer. If the rifle was slung the carrier would've been confronted and if disarming was needed, held at gunpoint until enough backup arrived so the police could safely disarm....the command to "put it down" would make most sense if the rifle was being carried in hand at ready...
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    I'm willing to wager..... that it's a clean shoot.

    let's think, police (two officers who apparently are upper ranking and each have 15 years of experience) encounter an armed man and order him to put down a rifle.

    would an experienced officer order a man to put his hand on the weapon? unlikely... so we can reason the rifle wasn't slung on his back since ordering someone to unsling a rifle would involve the man being ordered so to put the rifle in hand. if they intended to disarm a man with a slung rifle they would've proned him and taken off his rifle after getting adaquate backup.

    so we have most likely someone carrying this rifle in his hands... which can be construed as a violation of RCW 9.41.270. especially since according to the article the site was near an elementary school, so guy walking in public with rifle in hand gets called in by 911 caller, dispatcher fears a sandy hook copycat, dispatches officers, officers confront guy, and detain him under probable cause of a criminal violation, man refuses to comply with officer safety instructions, maybe points weapon towards them? they fire....

    I'm willing to wager I'm right about the rifle in hand.... I see no reason why a seasoned officer would demand someone to unsling a rifle.... and thus make their rifle ready to be used against the officer. If the rifle was slung the carrier would've been confronted and if disarming was needed, held at gunpoint until enough backup arrived so the police could safely disarm....the command to "put it down" would make most sense if the rifle was being carried in hand at ready...
    ......walking in an area near Edmonds Elementary waving a rifle.

    http://blogs.seattletimes.com/today/...ng-with-rifle/
    Last edited by Grapeshot; 09-07-2013 at 03:53 PM.
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    Hmm, earlier there was a suggestion that the rifle may have been fired. Now, now that that appears not to be so, it was described as being waved. Next I expect it to have been being carried slung in an aggressive manner. Let's wait for the probable cause preliminary hearing, OK?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmare View Post
    Hmm, earlier there was a suggestion that the rifle may have been fired. Now, now that that appears not to be so, it was described as being waved. Next I expect it to have been being carried slung in an aggressive manner. Let's wait for the probable cause preliminary hearing, OK?
    One time they say someone believes they heard rifle shots.

    Interim Police Chief Al Compaan said two Edmonds officers responded to a report of a man in the street with a shotgun or rifle about 7:30 a.m.

    How many rifles look like shotguns and how many shotguns look like rifles?
    The ones that I can think of are mostly either single shots or break open actions. There are/were some bolt action shotguns I guess.
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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freedom1Man View Post
    --snipped--
    How many rifles look like shotguns and how many shotguns look like rifles?
    The ones that I can think of are mostly either single shots or break open actions. There are/were some bolt action shotguns I guess.
    Saiga SLG41, 410, semi-automatic
    http://www.militaryfactory.com/small...allarms_id=541

    Even the Browning A5 shotgun strongly resembles the Browning BAR Safari Rifle.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training.” Archilochus, 650 BC

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    Regular Member ()pen(arry's Avatar
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    .410 shotguns can look like rifles. More significantly, the typical, ignorant civilian would have no idea how to distinguish a rifle from a shotgun. They don't bat an eye when movie stars fire 20+ shots from a revolver.

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    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ()pen(arry View Post
    .410 shotguns can look like rifles. More significantly, the typical, ignorant civilian would have no idea how to distinguish a rifle from a shotgun. They don't bat an eye when movie stars fire 20+ shots from a revolver.
    I seem to remember that high capacity revolvers have been made with 10 to 30 round capacity - they were monstrosities though
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    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    ......walking in an area near Edmonds Elementary waving a rifle.

    http://blogs.seattletimes.com/today/...ng-with-rifle/
    That detail was not in the media when I made that comment....
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    Regular Member EMNofSeattle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    I seem to remember that high capacity revolvers have been made with 10 to 30 round capacity - they were monstrosities though
    a French revolver was made as a "30 round revolver" but it really wasn't a thirty shot revolver. it had three barrels and three rows of cylinder chambers. each pull of the trigger put off three rounds (which means that today that type of revolver would require registration under the NFA, unless you own an original it's not possible since the registry is closed since 86)
    they love our milk and honey, but they preach about some other way of living, when they're running down my country man they're walkin' on the fightin side of me

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grapeshot View Post
    Saiga SLG41, 410, semi-automatic
    http://www.militaryfactory.com/small...allarms_id=541

    Even the Browning A5 shotgun strongly resembles the Browning BAR Safari Rifle.
    A Henry 22 in the eyes of an anti:

    http://cdn3.warhistoryonline.com/wp-...4/a-bomb57.jpg

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    Regular Member tombrewster421's Avatar
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    Edmonds police shoot individual carrying rifle

    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    I'm willing to wager..... that it's a clean shoot.

    let's think, police (two officers who apparently are upper ranking and each have 15 years of experience) encounter an armed man and order him to put down a rifle.

    would an experienced officer order a man to put his hand on the weapon? unlikely... so we can reason the rifle wasn't slung on his back since ordering someone to unsling a rifle would involve the man being ordered so to put the rifle in hand. if they intended to disarm a man with a slung rifle they would've proned him and taken off his rifle after getting adaquate backup.

    so we have most likely someone carrying this rifle in his hands... which can be construed as a violation of RCW 9.41.270. especially since according to the article the site was near an elementary school, so guy walking in public with rifle in hand gets called in by 911 caller, dispatcher fears a sandy hook copycat, dispatches officers, officers confront guy, and detain him under probable cause of a criminal violation, man refuses to comply with officer safety instructions, maybe points weapon towards them? they fire....

    I'm willing to wager I'm right about the rifle in hand.... I see no reason why a seasoned officer would demand someone to unsling a rifle.... and thus make their rifle ready to be used against the officer. If the rifle was slung the carrier would've been confronted and if disarming was needed, held at gunpoint until enough backup arrived so the police could safely disarm....the command to "put it down" would make most sense if the rifle was being carried in hand at ready...
    It's quite easy to put down a slung rifle without touching the gun. It has a sling so you simply reach to your shoulder, grab the sling and slip it off, then lower it to the ground. Of course I'm not saying that is what happened because I wasn't there, just that it's a possibility.
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    Regular Member hermannr's Avatar
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    I would suspect the real happening would be on one of the in-car camera's...No? Unless you can view what happened. and hear what was said, judgment cannot be made.

    If the officers over reacted, (I find that a real possibility) it will never make the news.

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    Regular Member ()pen(arry's Avatar
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    Re: Edmonds police shoot individual carrying rifle

    We can't yet know what happened. One of these times, though, it's going to be a law-ignorant anti who thinks he's making a statement and gets a shelacking. We need to be ready to jump on that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hermannr View Post
    I would suspect the real happening would be on one of the in-car camera's...No? Unless you can view what happened. and hear what was said, judgment cannot be made.

    If the officers over reacted, (I find that a real possibility) it will never make the news.
    Well, they did have witnesses .. didn't they interview them before talking to the press?

    I would assume so .... very suspicious ...

    As Homer Simpson said "We'll see ... we'll see"

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    Quote Originally Posted by davidmcbeth View Post
    Now when a cop tells you to touch your weapon..DO NOT DO IT...he'll shoot you and say you had the gun in your hand(s). (Not a lie, right?). Just put your hands in the air away from the gun and wait. If you want to play it this way.
    And if you don't touch the weapon, then you've refused to comply and might get shot anyway.
    Last edited by Difdi; 09-08-2013 at 08:57 AM.

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    I agree with waiting for all the facts to come out before jumping to conclusions; however, I do find it a bit suspect that the Police are not revealing an actual reason why he was shot. As far as the reports are saying he was shot after a verbal confrontation. I was not aware that a verbal confrontation was a lawful reason the Police can use deadly force on someone...

    A verbal confrontation could simply be him saying that he doesn't consent to any searches or seizures.

    This is a little too close to home for me. If he was pointing his weapon at people, I would assume (and perhaps I shouldn't assume) that the Police would be happy to release that information. I suppose we will see when all the facts come out about the situation.

    Is anyone aware of what the Man's name is and if he is still in serious condition?
    Last edited by iMack; 09-08-2013 at 03:32 PM.

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    "Officer Safety" is good cause for shooting.

    Hello All,

    Do any of you remember the Chris Dorner incident from LA? It was last February, 2013.

    Two ladies were shot-up while delivering newspapers and a surfer was shot-up after the surfer left a police checkpoint. Officer Safety was used as an excuse. Attempted murder charges have not been brought against the LEOs involved. Misdemeanor charges for illegal discharge in a prohibited area have not been brought against the LEOs involved.

    One more thing...Chris Dorner was dangerous; however, not one LEO bullet hit him, grazed him, or killed him. Dorner had to kill himself. When a real threat exists LEO is inefective. Law abiding citizens are much easier targets for LEO.

    We will probably find out that the man with the rifle in Everett was looking for suicide by cop. If that is the case, it is a bad deal for everybody involved.

    If it was not a legitimate shoot, the police officers will be shielded by "officer safety" and "protecting the public." They will finish their careers and retire somewhat wealthy.

    markm

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