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Thread: fire mission: Sun. 08SEP OC in Appleton, WI

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    fire mission: Sun. 08SEP OC in Appleton, WI

    .


    Saturday afternoon (07SEP13) 2 men OC (both pistols & long guns) were felony stopped at gunpoint by Appleton PD officers, cuffed & stuffed, their property seized, searched, serial #s run, they were held about an hour - all with no RAS of a crime - and it's clear that the police were trying every trick in the book & searching for any little thing to ticket or arrest them for.

    It's clear that the officers were enforcing their own opinions - they can be heard directing each other to go to local businesses and tell employees that they don't want guns on their property. (Which isn't a legally-enforcable prohibition anyway.)

    And one of the first things an officer did was to turn off the camera of one of the victims. Can you say "guilty conscience"?

    Over on the WI Carry FB page we're discussing a OC meet-n-greet at the Starbuck's at 3314 W College Ave., Appleton (just east of I-41) from 1-3pm SUNDAY 08SEP (that's tomorrow, as I'm writing this).
    Here's the event page.

    Here's the thread in the WI Carry page.

    Here's audio from one of the victims (long).

    Join us if you can.
    We may go downtown to protest at the cop shop, but that's not a firm plan yet.

    (And please, no "I can't make it" or "I don't do facebook". I've given you all the information - place, time, date. If you can be there, great. If you can't, we'll miss you but don't need to know about it.)





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    Last edited by MKEgal; 09-07-2013 at 10:42 PM.
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    Are they singing if I were a rich man now?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isSXzbPByks
    Last edited by davidmcbeth; 09-07-2013 at 11:16 PM.

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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Apparently there's also going to be a gathering there on the 22nd.
    (2 weeks further on)

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Is the Appleton Farmers Market on Private Property?

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Hmm, I guess those cops will enjoy some fines and spend some time in jail for excessive force.

    (ar) Any law enforcement officer who uses excessive
    force based solely on an individual’s status as a licensee
    may be fined not more than $500 or sentenced to a term
    of imprisonment of not more than 30 days or both. The
    application of the criminal penalty under this paragraph
    does not preclude the application of any other civil or
    criminal remedy.
    (b) Any person who violates sub. (16) may be fined
    not more than $500 or imprisoned for not more than 30
    days or both.


    How was the get together? I was out of the state and couldn't make it.
    Last edited by protias; 09-08-2013 at 08:59 PM.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Regular Member Motofixxer's Avatar
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    The farmers market was apparently a general open air blocked off street typical kind of market

    The meet was uneventful really other than the officers that kept circling the building approximately 4-5 times and were seen repeatedly after that for maybe an hour or so. Then they seemed to have disappeared. I think a couple of people chatted with them as they parked in back and walked by. Apparently one officer asked that we please don't bring out the rifles or something like that.

    Then after Starbucks for a while we drove to the PD and the two gentlemen went into the station to do a records request, with another witness. Nothing really happened then either. Then we walked for a while downtown and got invited into a bar for a football pig roast party. Then the guy had to ask employees if we could be in there with firearms(there was no sign) the door guy said the policy was no. But if he had his way, we could. He said he would carry too and be like hey guys, pull up his shirt saying see look it guys I got one too and saying lets do this come on in. He was a funny lil hispanic guy with a strong accent. He apologized for the owner rules. We told him tell management and owners they just lost a bunch of business but we left some info for em to review.
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    Regular Member MKEgal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by protias
    I guess those cops will enjoy some fines and spend some time in jail for excessive force.
    (ar) Any law enforcement officer who uses excessive force based solely on an individual’s status as a licensee may be fined not more than $500 or sentenced to a term of imprisonment of not more than 30 days or both.
    Except that they didn't know the 2 victims were licensees until after they'd been held at gunpoint (rifle), then cuffed & stuffed.
    The excessive force came about simply because they were exercising RKBA.
    That's a federal crime.

    ETA: and I think they're only now discovering that one of the victims has audio of their conversations, which reveals their attitudes... which stink.
    Pretty sure John Monroe will make mincemeat out of those officers in short order.

    ETA2: short video and long audio posted in this thread
    Last edited by MKEgal; 09-09-2013 at 12:58 AM.

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    What kind of buffoon would walk around a farmers market with ARs? Then get all teary eyed whiny when the cops check them out? Give me a break.

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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    What kind of buffoon would walk around a farmers market with ARs? Then get all teary eyed whiny when the cops check them out? Give me a break.
    What kind of troll would come to a gun rights site and speak out against gun rights?

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    What kind of troll would come to a gun rights site and speak out against gun rights?
    The same troll as we've had before on the site. It is quite childish it likes to come back for more abuse.
    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    What kind of troll would come to a gun rights site and speak out against gun rights?
    I guess the thinking isn't that complicated here, so I may have to back up a little.

    I saw a picture of someone dressed all in black with even a black fedora with a pistol gripped shotgun over his back, surrounded by reporters of course. It looked like it was in a commercial district, retail.
    Do gun owners dress up in their head to toe black tactical outfits to go window shopping for photo ops? While his fedora was funny--his dad may get mad if he found out what he did with his hat--I've never found a reason to put an 870 across my back to stroll around malls.

    You must shop in bad areas.

    What's a "fire mission"? Isn't that a military term?

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    Regular Member Plankton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    I guess the thinking isn't that complicated here, so I may have to back up a little.

    I saw a picture of someone dressed all in black with even a black fedora with a pistol gripped shotgun over his back, surrounded by reporters of course. It looked like it was in a commercial district, retail.
    Do gun owners dress up in their head to toe black tactical outfits to go window shopping for photo ops? While his fedora was funny--his dad may get mad if he found out what he did with his hat--I've never found a reason to put an 870 across my back to stroll around malls.

    You must shop in bad areas.

    What's a "fire mission"? Isn't that a military term?
    Gun owners dress however THEY want to. Just as you do. Free country, and all................
    Liberty or death. We're sorry, there are no other options available at this time..........
    "Safety is the new Liberty, and recklessness is the new Freedom, and alcoholism is the new Doug Huffman."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Plankton View Post
    Gun owners dress however THEY want to. Just as you do. Free country, and all................
    Seeing as you're close to madison, then I guess you understand laughing at how absurd people look when they dress to express themselves. (For those not from wisconsin, madison is full of liberal/progressive fruitloops, gay parades, and all sorts of weird stuff).

    How you present yourselves is how you are received. Why do you think there are so many photographers at gun rallys? You guys are feeding your enemy.

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    Regular Member Plankton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    Seeing as you're close to madison, then I guess you understand laughing at how absurd people look when they dress to express themselves. (For those not from wisconsin, madison is full of liberal/progressive fruitloops, gay parades, and all sorts of weird stuff).

    How you present yourselves is how you are received. Why do you think there are so many photographers at gun rallys? You guys are feeding your enemy.
    Your opinion. You have no idea how I dress.
    Liberty or death. We're sorry, there are no other options available at this time..........
    "Safety is the new Liberty, and recklessness is the new Freedom, and alcoholism is the new Doug Huffman."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Plankton View Post
    Your opinion. You have no idea how I dress.
    What is your opinion of how one should dress while OCing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky View Post
    What is your opinion of how one should dress while OCing?
    People can dress anyway they want if they are just going about their normal activities. But if one is doing open carry (with a pistol), one should be adult enough to comprehend that when people see him/her/it, that oc-er is a representative of our community.

    So dressing up like some basement dwelling role playing gamer will make that person/kid look like they do--silly. Just like the pictures of the freaks at the gay pride parades are passed around and shown to normal people with the "this is who they are", same applies here.

    Now throw on an 'assault weapon' or a pistol gripped shotgun, etc. and now those not into guns, or those that are, or those that just use them to hunt, or well, most people will look at that thing walking down the street and wonder if that person is trying to be dylan klebold or eric harris. Or any of the following socially challenged weirdos that went off.

    Here in WI, we have a really, REALLY good thing. Kids out playing ninja army won't help things out at all and very well will be used to turn this state into new york, or more recently, colorado.

    Want sport utility rifles banned here? Want standard capacity mags banned? You little dumbasses playing your stupid games will be the poster children for that movement.
    But we will be able to carry our single shot pistols.....

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    Regular Member Plankton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Franky View Post
    What is your opinion of how one should dress while OCing?
    My opinion is not the issue. I have no say on the way others should dress. Nor do I insult them.
    Liberty or death. We're sorry, there are no other options available at this time..........
    "Safety is the new Liberty, and recklessness is the new Freedom, and alcoholism is the new Doug Huffman."

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    Chowda we have it better then it was and better then some states but the new law doesn't follow the constitution.

    You maybe willing to stop with what we have.

    But the states with constitutionally carry have it better.

    Remain seated in the back of the bus and don't eat at certain lunch counters if you want.

    Worry about making anti gunners mad at you. Wow they don't like are guns and well do every thing in their power to ban them any no matter how much you kiss their butts and say please don't.

    They take and take and expect us to give and give.

    We tried for years to be nice and say please don't take all of our guns just leave my hunting guns alone.

    They want them all give in to one ban they well come up with excuses to ban another just look to CA. and see what happens.
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    Regular Member Interceptor_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    You guys are feeding your enemy.
    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    You little dumbasses playing your stupid games will be the poster children for that movement....
    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    ....clearly, walking around with long guns in public places is exponentially stupid.
    I mean.....really.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    You maybe willing to stop with what we have.
    But the states with constitutionally carry have it better.
    Remain seated in the back of the bus and don't eat at certain lunch counters if you want.
    Worry about making anti gunners mad at you. Wow they don't like are guns and well do every thing in their power to ban them any no matter how much you kiss their butts and say please don't.
    We tried for years to be nice and say please don't take all of our guns just leave my hunting guns alone.
    This.. We need to show a unified front better than the gun grabbers do. We need less Zumbos and more unapologetic gun rights supporters...
    Last edited by Interceptor_Knight; 09-23-2013 at 12:48 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    Worry about making anti gunners mad at you. Wow they don't like are guns and well do every thing in their power to ban them any no matter how much you kiss their butts and say please don't.
    +1

    Incrementalism is their modus operandi.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Plankton View Post
    You have no idea how I dress.
    Never said I did. And I don't care how you dress, if you wear a dress, if you go buff, or some british knigh or anything between.

    Ever wonder why no one in the mainstream media play with their 'junk' with one hand while they flail with the other, saying "know what I be sayin" every third word?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firearms Iinstuctor View Post
    Remain seated in the back of the bus and don't eat at certain lunch counters if you want.

    Worry about making anti gunners mad at you. Wow they don't like are guns and well do every thing in their power to ban them any no matter how much you kiss their butts and say please don't.
    I really hope you aren't a "firearms iinstructor".
    With rights come responsibilities. I can only assume all the black clad long rifle toting heroes never shot anyone, nor pulled their "assault rifle" on any family as they were shopping. I've not read about it, so I'll just take it as so.
    However, implicit in being responsible is common sense. In WI, you have the right to have a firearm in your house and use it in self defense. It's assumed you will be responsible enough to follow the castle doctrine and defend your home with your firearm. However, if you hear something in your house, you don't just open up with your deer hunting rifle, etc. Why not? Common sense.

    Maybe I'm giving gun owners too much credit for having common sense regarding things outside of their house?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Interceptor_Knight View Post
    We need less Zumbos and more unapologetic gun rights supporters...
    Wasn't he ignorant to sport utility rifles, thus was afraid/against them?
    Then what changed his mind was calm rational people talking to him and eventually going out with them shooting.
    So how do you think he would have reacted if some black clad thing adorned with an "assault weapon" was walking around in safe haven BFE, whereever he lives, with his family?

    Clowns that walk around with rifles/shotguns in public places for the shock value reinforce anti gunners, and also, turn a lot of pro second amendmant people away, or at least have the latter sit at home during the next election, so the antis win.
    Then they sit at home, stating how this is proof how they are surrounded and people are unreasonable, coming after them to take away their rights.

    I guess there are big picture people and little picture, it's all about me picture people.

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    Founder's Club Member protias's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chowda View Post
    I really hope you aren't a "firearms iinstructor".
    With rights come responsibilities. I can only assume all the black clad long rifle toting heroes never shot anyone, nor pulled their "assault rifle" on any family as they were shopping. I've not read about it, so I'll just take it as so.
    However, implicit in being responsible is common sense. In WI, you have the right to have a firearm in your house and use it in self defense. It's assumed you will be responsible enough to follow the castle doctrine and defend your home with your firearm. However, if you hear something in your house, you don't just open up with your deer hunting rifle, etc. Why not? Common sense.

    Maybe I'm giving gun owners too much credit for having common sense regarding things outside of their house?
    Really? Point me to the WI and/or Federal Constitution (or court cases) that limits firearms to the house? However...

    No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. Thomas Jefferson (1776)

    If you go into a store, with a gun, and rob it, you have forfeited your right to not get shot - Joe Deters, Hamilton County (Cincinnati) Prosecutor

    I ask sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few politicians. - George Mason (father of the Bill of Rights and The Virginia Declaration of Rights)

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    Quote Originally Posted by protias View Post
    Really? Point me to the WI and/or Federal Constitution (or court cases) that limits firearms to the house?
    I guess you missed the point of me being all for concealed carry and open carry, but think people wandering around downtown shopping areas with 'assault weapons' (especially if dressed in dumbass head to toe black) are, well, not only dumbasses, but about as helpful to the second amendment community as al sharpton/obama/jackson are to race relations.........

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