OC'ers harassed in Marshfield!

logunowner said:

I will be going to Marshall opening carrying. If the same thing happens to me as happened with the first jackass cop, he will be greeted with a whole different scenario than he faced with these kids. His boss and him are typical cops that are anti-open carry. They need to get over it.

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I look forward to seeing the videos of your encounters.

As one of the two girls who were open carrying in this incident in Marshfield, I will be the first to admit that there are some things we wish we would've done differently. After open carrying for awhile now and never getting stopped, this was the last thing I expected to happen.

I think it would be great for more OC'ers to go to that WalMart and open carry. They need to get educated.

Police Cheif's Response

I just spent 16 minutes on the phone with Police Chief Doug Fannen of Marshfield, Mo. about my concerns about how this incident was handled. First I have never talked to this guy til today. I found him to be very sincere and totally behind the 2nd amendment.

What happened at Walmart that day had underlying circumstances. A call came in that seven individuals had got out of two vehicles armed and then hudled in the parking lot for a while then entered the building. Another person phoned in and said a women with a gun was chasing two other people.
Of course, there are more details but the bottom line, I beleive the police had cause to suspect they needed to get to the bottom of the matter.

I asked the Chief if the demeanor of his officer was warranted and he told me of course it did seem a little over the top, but people need to know that the background of why he was there.

I beleive him and I think maybe this was a set up, trying to get a response from law enforcement. I hope I am wrong as that sort of thing will only hurt our pursuit to educate the masses.

"...did seem a little over the top, but..."

Code for "nothing to see here move along folks...move along."

So, what are the identities of the "callers"? Those seem to be some serious allegations.
What facts were in evidence the lead those cops to the citizens detained as being the subject called in?
What, if any, facts did the cops have other than a pistol on a hip?
Is a pistol on a hip the same as the acts described by the caller(s).

That chiefs needs a raking over the coals so as to train his cops to use their brains and not their brawn. Also to train himself that OCers are easy targets for prank calls and that a LAC could have been killed by a overzealous cop.

Note to self....drive right on past Marshfield.

logunowner said:

...What happened at Walmart that day had underlying circumstances. A call came in that seven individuals had got out of two vehicles armed and then hudled in the parking lot for a while then entered the building. Another person phoned in and said a women with a gun was chasing two other people.
Of course, there are more details but the bottom line, I beleive the police had cause to suspect they needed to get to the bottom of the matter.

I asked the Chief if the demeanor of his officer was warranted and he told me of course it did seem a little over the top, but people need to know that the background of why he was there.

I beleive him and I think maybe this was a set up, trying to get a response from law enforcement. I hope I am wrong as that sort of thing will only hurt our pursuit to educate the masses.

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The communications center will have a copy of the calls, as well as the number they came from. At minimum, you ought to find out what they are, who they are (if possible), and what other calls they've made for emergency services.

If something is amiss, you ought to go after it and publish your findings, as well as speak to elected officials, in public at a public meeting, about the matter.

OC for ME said:

"...did seem a little over the top, but..."

Code for "nothing to see here move along folks...move along."

So, what are the identities of the "callers"? Those seem to be some serious allegations.
What facts were in evidence the lead those cops to the citizens detained as being the subject called in?
What, if any, facts did the cops have other than a pistol on a hip?
Is a pistol on a hip the same as the acts described by the caller(s).

That chiefs needs a raking over the coals so as to train his cops to use their brains and not their brawn. Also to train himself that OCers are easy targets for prank calls and that a LAC could have been killed by a overzealous cop.

Note to self....drive right on past Marshfield.

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We are a long way from living is a perfect OC world, I for one will make an effort to go to Marshfield. This police chief is calling every one that calls him about the incident and he said he is getting calls from all parts of the country. He is taking the time to try to get the truth out about the incident and is agreement that some things could have been done different.
I normally call officials involved in these videos I see on the internet. Most of the time I do not get a call back, but when I do they try to justify the incident with B/S This guy called me back right away and talked to me for 16 minutes about what happened and how he felt about OC (which was positive). I really don't think we can expect much more from a Police Chief that is caught up in one of these incidents.

BB62 said:

The communications center will have a copy of the calls, as well as the number they came from. At minimum, you ought to find out what they are, who they are (if possible), and what other calls they've made for emergency services.

If something is amiss, you ought to go after it and publish your findings, as well as speak to elected officials, in public at a public meeting, about the matter.

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The Chief told me to do just that. I told him I believed him and that I am satisfied that he was telling the truth and that if the Open Carries had the openness that he and I had this morning all of us would have a better experience.

Nightmare said:

Yes, low expectations are easily met. Once the horse is out of the barn there isn't much more that can be done other than wear the failure.

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What would you like to see done???? The guy tied to a horse and dragged in front of town square?

logunowner said:

We are a long way from living is a perfect OC world, I for one will make an effort to go to Marshfield. This police chief is calling every one that calls him about the incident and he said he is getting calls from all parts of the country. He is taking the time to try to get the truth out about the incident and is agreement that some things could have been done different.
I normally call officials involved in these videos I see on the internet. Most of the time I do not get a call back, but when I do they try to justify the incident with B/S This guy called me back right away and talked to me for 16 minutes about what happened and how he felt about OC (which was positive). I really don't think we can expect much more from a Police Chief that is caught up in one of these incidents.

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I seem to recall that it is a crime to make a false police report in MO, especially where it is done in malice. The two situations reported to the cops certainly seem to have been in malice if the chief is telling the truth based on the alleged acts.

Where are the seven armed individuals? Where are the witnesses from within the store who saw seven armed individuals enter the store? Where is the woman who is alleged to have chased two other people? Where are those two citizens who were chased by a armed woman, and will they be providing a description of the woman? Where is the video of the seven armed individuals entering the store?

BigBoreBoy said:

Why are you even on here larueman if you think these kids did ANYTHING wrong?!?! You're trolling...get lost!

Well we all know that, generally speaking, Walmart is ok w/ OC...so who called the fuzz w/ the attitude? Subway? Citizen? Does anybody know the OC status of Marshfield? (No OC? OC w/ CCW? WTF?) I would like to find out and then promptly organize a little OC shopping trip to that exact same store.

He had no right to ask for their ID unless OC is banned and/or CCW is required and he damn sure had no right to ask for it with a ***** attitude! This gets my blood boiling. Glad the OCer's handled it so well.

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He has every right to ASK for ID. What matters is they were under NO obligation to provide it to him unless Missouri law requires it. I don't know if it is a stop and identify state. This absolutely gets me upset though. These "cops" are a bunch of thugs that need to get into a different line of work if they don't know what their purpose is. Anyone that would treat a citizen like this, much less a lady, needs a reality check.

Refusal to identify as a witness.

575.190. 1. A person commits the crime of refusal to identify as a witness if, knowing he has witnessed any portion of a crime, or of any other incident resulting in physical injury or substantial property damage, upon demand by a law enforcement officer engaged in the performance of his official duties, he refuses to report or gives a false report of his name and present address to such officer.

2. Refusal to identify as a witness is a class C misdemeanor.

False reports.

575.080. 1. A person commits the crime of making a false report if he knowingly:

(1) Gives false information to any person for the purpose of implicating another person in a crime; or

(2) Makes a false report to a law enforcement officer that a crime has occurred or is about to occur; or

(3) Makes a false report or causes a false report to be made to a law enforcement officer, security officer, fire department or other organization, official or volunteer, which deals with emergencies involving danger to life or property that a fire or other incident calling for an emergency response has occurred or is about to occur.

2. It is a defense to a prosecution under subsection 1 of this section that the actor retracted the false statement or report before the law enforcement officer or any other person took substantial action in reliance thereon.

3. The defendant shall have the burden of injecting the issue of retraction under subsection 2 of this section.

4. Making a false report is a class B misdemeanor.

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What is the chief's position on this?

KYGlockster said:

He has every right to ASK for ID. What matters is they were under NO obligation to provide it to him unless Missouri law requires it. I don't know if it is a stop and identify state. This absolutely gets me upset though. These "cops" are a bunch of thugs that need to get into a different line of work if they don't know what their purpose is. Anyone that would treat a citizen like this, much less a lady, needs a reality check.

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That cop did not "ask" for ID he demanded ID. Technically those citizens were under arrest because they submitted to the authority of that cop.

Arrest 544.180. An arrest is made by an actual restraint of the person of the defendant, or by his submission to the custody of the officer, under authority of a warrant or otherwise. The officer must inform the defendant by what authority he acts, and must also show the warrant if required.

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A refusal to present ID would have been a poor decision in that situation if my ability to read that cop's intentions are anywhere near accurate.

My observations though out my life have been that those that demand utopia for their clause usually hurt that clause more than they help.

Equal application of the law is demanded. The chief needs to find the caller(s), charge them with the applicable crimes, and then the city needs to prosecute to the fullest extent of the law. Then the chief needs to get on every area news station, radio and TV, the local papers and inform the citizenry that these crimes will not be tolerated.

Demanding that the chief do his job is not seeking utopia.

Nightmare said:

Welcome to OCDO QFish and sorry it had to be under these circumstances.

The call needs to be pursued for the false and hyperbolic content of the call. The call might be subject to an FOIA demand, if only for the entertainment value.

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Thank you. We are looking into getting the call and any other data we can receive via FOIA & the Missouri Sunshine Law. It would certainly be entertaining to hear what the call said.

logunowner said:

I just spent 16 minutes on the phone with Police Chief Doug Fannen of Marshfield, Mo. about my concerns about how this incident was handled. First I have never talked to this guy til today. I found him to be very sincere and totally behind the 2nd amendment.

What happened at Walmart that day had underlying circumstances. A call came in that seven individuals had got out of two vehicles armed and then hudled in the parking lot for a while then entered the building. Another person phoned in and said a women with a gun was chasing two other people.
Of course, there are more details but the bottom line, I beleive the police had cause to suspect they needed to get to the bottom of the matter.

I asked the Chief if the demeanor of his officer was warranted and he told me of course it did seem a little over the top, but people need to know that the background of why he was there.

I beleive him and I think maybe this was a set up, trying to get a response from law enforcement. I hope I am wrong as that sort of thing will only hurt our pursuit to educate the masses.

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Still no RAS or PC in that phone call.

Really, if you hold a group meeting in a parking lot before going into a huge retailer then you are what? Gathering illegally? Plotting on what you are going to eat, still no crime.

Screwing around, while bad form, is not illegal yet. Was she chasing him with gun drawn or was it safely holstered and not mentioned? The 911 call and probable lack of intelligent questions by dispatch would be enlightening and probably bolster a lawsuit and payout, which is what the police chief is trying to prevent. His budget is most likely the only thing on his mind.

If you ar eon Facebook you'll want to read this post by Sheriff Dixon of Osage county, he is a supporter of OC:
Michael Dixon


My heart goes out to the families of those killed in today's act of domestic terrorism, and I am so proud of our Armed Forces personnel, our resilient Law Enforcement, Fire Fighters, and EMS responders. But I must say that I am sick and tired of seeing these scenes being played out weekly in this great nation's streets.

As a law enforcement officer and a Sheriff I took an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States of America and I have made every effort to ensure I do just that for my fellow citizens who elected me. For I realize that I only have these authorities because the people have consented such authority over them.

But I must share with you that my heart is deeply troubled by these disturbing acts of violence and I am sure the focus from this terrible tragedy will be diverted to instigate another assault on our rights to bear arms. I wonder if todays acts of terror or those which occurred in Fort Hood in 2009 would have happened had Fmr. President Clinton made the decision to disarm military personnel on US bases. According to the Washington Times,

'' In March 1993, the Army imposed regulations forbidding military personnel from carrying their personal firearms and making it almost impossible for commanders to issue firearms to soldiers in the U.S. for personal protection. For the most part, only military police regularly carry firearms on base, and their presence is stretched thin by high demand for MPs in war zones. Because of Mr. Clinton, terrorists would face more return fire if they attacked a Texas Wal-Mart than the gunman faced at Fort Hood, home of the heavily armed and feared 1st Cavalry Division. That’s why a civilian policewoman from off base was the one whose marksmanship ended Maj. Nidal Malik Hasan’s rampage''

I think it's time American citizens and our military personnel take a stand, exercise their second amendment rights, and liberal politicians and bureaucrats need to stop their assault and efforts to restrict those rights because they took the same oath that I did, and WE THE PEOPLE are fed up!

The other day I saw a video of how a law enforcement officer treated a group of younger women in a Missouri city who were carrying their firearm openly. I was disgusted at how they were treated as violent aggressive killers. They were at Walmart probably buying nail polish and a Subway sandwich. Its a shame people feel frightened by normal citizens being good patriots, vigilant neighbors, and responsible gun owners who take pride exercising their second amendment RIGHTS.

I feel that Americans need to responsibly exercise their rights and the people WE ELECT to ensure our freedoms and rights need to do just that or its time to send true patriots to represent us. I am honored for having true patriots like Paul Curtman and Brian Nieves who serve their constituents excellently, uphold their oath, and make every effort to ensure our God given rights are never stripped away.

America.... I ask you this: What else is it going to take to wake up our nation? How much more tragedy must today's children have to witness? This is my challenge: Be responsible, Exercise your rights, Vote for true defenders of liberty, and if you see something suspicious contact law enforcement.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...77.2089518.69601037&type=1&comment_id=3378699

This is Sheriff Dixon talking about "gun control:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bj6AT2n2tlw

Too bad the members of the group the deputies harassed aren't members of this fine group so they could give us their own insight on the matter.

I know if I was there I may have done things differently. But then, I wasn't there nor was any of you (it appears), so saying that "yes I would" or "No I would not" do things differently is a moot point. The best part they did perfectly is they got it on video. THAT counts.

Insight from those that were actually there is crucial, I feel.

INnnnn the mean time folks, I give a double thumbs up to the young ladies for doing what they could to keep the situation from getting hostile!

Logan 5 said:

Too bad the members of the group the deputies harassed aren't members of this fine group so they could give us their own insight on the matter.

I know if I was there I may have done things differently. But then, I wasn't there nor was any of you (it appears), so saying that "yes I would" or "No I would not" do things differently is a moot point. The best part they did perfectly is they got it on video. THAT counts.

Insight from those that were actually there is crucial, I feel.

INnnnn the mean time folks, I give a double thumbs up to the young ladies for doing what they could to keep the situation from getting hostile!

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Actually one of them has posted here in this very thread. See posts #22 & #39 from QFish.

mspgunner said:

If you ar eon Facebook you'll want to read this post by Sheriff Dixon of Osage county, he is a supporter of OC:...

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...77.2089518.69601037&type=1&comment_id=3378699

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The Facebook link doesn't work, but if you have another one, or better yet, one not on Facebook, I'd be glad to pass it on to one of my gun-hating family members.