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Thread: A certain other retired police officer

  1. #1
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    A certain other retired police officer

    Someone came in today and started to grill a certain other retired police officer about the open carry of an AR in a McDonalds. He kept pressing the guy for firm answers whether that would be OK or legal. The retired police officer refused (rightly) to answer the question directly. Instead he correctly (IMO) predicted that the police would be called and would respond. He also gave the person a handout we have made that gives the web references for the relevant sections of the ORC, and told him to look for the answers there.

    I post this thread to make the following judgments:

    1. The retired police officer handled the situation well. He is not a lawyer. When asked a question of law, he referred the person to the ORC. When asked about what his experience tells him, he honestly replied that the police would be called and would respond. 10/10

    2. The person who challenged him clearly had no intention to conduct a legitimate transaction. For whatever reason, he seemed to want to engage the retired police officer in a debate on AR OC. 0/10

    3. I hope to Hell it wasn't anyone from OCDO, because I will not allow this to happen again. Anyone challenging my guys on the law will be met by ME. That person will be offered assistance with the business we normally conduct. Any questions of law will be met with the handout.

    4. Questions of law will come up during transactions. As part of these transactions, they are normal. We will, in those cases, share our understanding based on our experiences. However, in all cases, a copy of the references to the ORC will be provided. My standard statement is, "But don't take anyone's word for the law, not even mine. I am not a lawyer. Read the law for yourself."

    Let me make this perfectly clear: There are places for confrontational advocacy, and there are places where it is inappropriate. I will react to inappropriateness appropriately and with calm resolve.

    I really pray that this was not any of you guys. If it was, I hope he has the intestinal fortitude to apologize to me for the position he put me in and, more importantly, to the person trying to help him for the way he was treated.

  2. #2
    Accomplished Advocate BB62's Avatar
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    It wasn't me!

    Seriously, though, why would you think it might be someone here? (except davidmbeth, that is?)

    Direct such individuals to OCDO and we will tear 'em up and spit 'em out, I mean, answer their questions fully and completely.
    Last edited by BB62; 09-16-2013 at 06:16 PM.

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    This guy seemed to have advocacy for his only reason for the encounter. He clearly was not there to conduct business with us.

    That is NOT OK.

    Anyway, since so many of us here are passionate advocates, I worry that (don't know if, have no idea whether) the person is associated with OCDO. I hope to Hell not!

  4. #4
    Moderator / Administrator Grapeshot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eye95 View Post
    Someone came in today and started to grill a certain other retired police officer about the open carry of an AR in a McDonalds. He kept pressing the guy for firm answers whether that would be OK or legal. The retired police officer refused (rightly) to answer the question directly. Instead he correctly (IMO) predicted that the police would be called and would respond. He also gave the person a handout we have made that gives the web references for the relevant sections of the ORC, and told him to look for the answers there.

    I post this thread to make the following judgments:

    1. The retired police officer handled the situation well. He is not a lawyer. When asked a question of law, he referred the person to the ORC. When asked about what his experience tells him, he honestly replied that the police would be called and would respond. 10/10

    2. The person who challenged him clearly had no intention to conduct a legitimate transaction. For whatever reason, he seemed to want to engage the retired police officer in a debate on AR OC. 0/10

    3. I hope to Hell it wasn't anyone from OCDO, because I will not allow this to happen again. Anyone challenging my guys on the law will be met by ME. That person will be offered assistance with the business we normally conduct. Any questions of law will be met with the handout.

    4. Questions of law will come up during transactions. As part of these transactions, they are normal. We will, in those cases, share our understanding based on our experiences. However, in all cases, a copy of the references to the ORC will be provided. My standard statement is, "But don't take anyone's word for the law, not even mine. I am not a lawyer. Read the law for yourself."

    Let me make this perfectly clear: There are places for confrontational advocacy, and there are places where it is inappropriate. I will react to inappropriateness appropriately and with calm resolve.

    I really pray that this was not any of you guys. If it was, I hope he has the intestinal fortitude to apologize to me for the position he put me in and, more importantly, to the person trying to help him for the way he was treated.
    Admit to being somewhat perplexed.

    There does not appear to be any past reference/post/thread to this alleged incident on OCDO (at least none linked); it therefore becomes most difficult to form an unbiased opinion. Then you respond here with the suggestion of authority which you clearly do not have.

    Even as to places and times for confrontational advocacy (appropriate or not), that is not solely yours to decide - you are one voice with one opinion.

    OTOH - if there is perceived transgression on another forum, then I suggest the admonition would be correctly posted there.
    You will not rise to the occasion; you will fall back on your level of training. Archilochus, 650 BC

    Old and treacherous will beat young and skilled every time. Yata hey.

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