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Thread: State Firearm Carry Summary

  1. #1
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    State Firearm Carry Summary

    Hello my fellow carriers. Over the past couple of months, I have used various resources including opencarry.org, handgunlaw.us, usacarry.com, and a few others to put in writing a high level summary of the conditions of carry laws throughout the US - without the legalese. It is similar to the state travel guide in this sense. I am now putting it on this public forum so some of my fellow gun owners can review, provide feedback, or even keep a copy of it themselves. This is a personal project with no intention to distribute for profit - so feel free to make any changes you see fit. I am open to constructive criticism and I know I am not a lawyer (I included a disclaimer as such on the first page.) It is a document that I keep with me when I travel so I can see at a glance how I can carry across the country without sifting through a bunch of legal stuff online. I am particularly interested in refining the definitions I included and ensuring the "caveats" section is accurate for each state. If you think there is something I should add, please let me know. I look forward to your responses.

    (Feel free to download and distribute at your leisure)

    https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B2WA...it?usp=sharing
    Last edited by acmariner99; 09-27-2013 at 04:38 PM. Reason: version update

  2. #2
    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Something for Ohio that should be changed. You say:

    School Carry: Not allowed; it is permissible to leave an unloaded firearm in a locked vehicle or carry
    while picking up a student. If you do not have a permit, it is illegal to go into a school safety zone,
    defined as school property, buildings, and buses with a firearm.
    As I understand it, you are permitted to have a loaded firearm in the vehicle with you when picking up or dropping off a child, but cannot leave the loaded or unloaded firearm in the vehicle and exit the vehicle, nor can you carry it on your person and exit the vehicle.

    From ORC 2923.122 (emphasis mine):
    (4) This section does not apply to a person who conveys or attempts to convey a handgun into, or possesses a handgun in, a school safety zone if at the time of that conveyance, attempted conveyance, or possession of the handgun all of the following apply:

    (a) The person is carrying a valid concealed handgun license.

    (b) The person is the driver or passenger in a motor vehicle and is in the school safety zone while immediately in the process of picking up or dropping off a child.

    (c) The person is not in violation of section 2923.16 of the Revised Code.
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  3. #3
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustaShooter View Post
    Something for Ohio that should be changed. You say:



    As I understand it, you are permitted to have a loaded firearm in the vehicle with you when picking up or dropping off a child, but cannot leave the loaded or unloaded firearm in the vehicle and exit the vehicle, nor can you carry it on your person and exit the vehicle.

    From ORC 2923.122 (emphasis mine):
    Much obliged. I have made the appropriate correction and will post an updated doc when all those interested have had a chance to voice feedback.

  4. #4
    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Much obliged. I have made the appropriate correction and will post an updated doc when all those interested have had a chance to voice feedback.
    Glad to help. Also, Ohio says: "Parking Lot Storage Law: Yes"

    Although some might wish it to be so, that is currently not the case.

    And finally: "Caveats: When carrying in a vehicle, a firearm must be carried in a manner that prevents unauthorized persons (children and prohibited persons) from accessing it. Carrying in a glove box does not count."

    According to ORC 2923.16
    (B) No person shall knowingly transport or have a loaded firearm in a motor vehicle in such a manner that the firearm is accessible to the operator or any passenger without leaving the vehicle.
    (C) No person shall knowingly transport or have a firearm in a motor vehicle, unless the person may lawfully possess that firearm under applicable law of this state or the United States, the firearm is unloaded, and the firearm is carried in one of the following ways:

    (1) In a closed package, box, or case;

    (2) In a compartment that can be reached only by leaving the vehicle;

    (3) In plain sight and secured in a rack or holder made for the purpose;

    (4) If the firearm is at least twenty-four inches in overall length as measured from the muzzle to the part of the stock furthest from the muzzle and if the barrel is at least eighteen inches in length, either in plain sight with the action open or the weapon stripped, or, if the firearm is of a type on which the action will not stay open or which cannot easily be stripped, in plain sight.
    and
    (K)(5)

    (a) "Unloaded" means, with respect to a firearm other than a firearm described in division (K)(6) of this section, that no ammunition is in the firearm in question, no magazine or speed loader containing ammunition is inserted into the firearm in question , and one of the following applies:
    (i) There is no ammunition in a magazine or speed loader that is in the vehicle in question and that may be used with the firearm in question.
    (ii) Any magazine or speed loader that contains ammunition and that may be used with the firearm in question is stored in a compartment within the vehicle in question that cannot be accessed without leaving the vehicle or is stored in a container that provides complete and separate enclosure.

    (b) For the purposes of division (K)(5)(a)(ii) of this section, a "container that provides complete and separate enclosure" includes, but is not limited to, any of the following:
    (i) A package, box, or case with multiple compartments, as long as the loaded magazine or speed loader and the firearm in question either are in separate compartments within the package, box, or case, or, if they are in the same compartment, the magazine or speed loader is contained within a separate enclosure in that compartment that does not contain the firearm and that closes using a snap, button, buckle, zipper, hook and loop closing mechanism, or other fastener that must be opened to access the contents or the firearm is contained within a separate enclosure of that nature in that compartment that does not contain the magazine or speed loader;
    (ii) A pocket or other enclosure on the person of the person in question that closes using a snap, button, buckle, zipper, hook and loop closing mechanism, or other fastener that must be opened to access the contents.
    So, loaded firearms cannot be accessible to anyone that does not have a concealed handgun license (not just minors or prohibited persons), and unloaded firearms must be transported in a specific way - I'd probably just say "unloaded and properly stored"
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Hello my fellow carriers. Over the past couple of months, I have used various resources including opencarry.org, handgunlaw.us, usacarry.com, and a few others to put in writing a high level summary of the conditions of carry laws throughout the US - without the legalese. It is similar to the state travel guide in this sense. I am now putting it on this public forum so some of my fellow gun owners can review, provide feedback, or even keep a copy of it themselves. This is a personal project with no intention to distribute for profit - so feel free to make any changes you see fit. I am open to constructive criticism and I know I am not a lawyer (I included a disclaimer as such on the first page.) It is a document that I keep with me when I travel so I can see at a glance how I can carry across the country without sifting through a bunch of legal stuff online. I am particularly interested in refining the definitions I included and ensuring the "caveats" section is accurate for each state. If you think there is something I should add, please let me know. I look forward to your responses.

    (Feel free to download and distribute at your leisure)

    https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B2WA...it?usp=sharing
    Florida.
    Vehicle Carry: Must be in glove-box. Wrong. Read up on 'securely encased' and not "Readily accessible for immediate use".

    "Readily accessible for immediate use" means that a firearm or other weapon is carried on the person or within such close proximity and in such a manner that it can be retrieved and used as easily and quickly as if carried on the person.

    "Securely encased" means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.
    Carry in Public Area: Allowed in Rest Areas and State Parks. All other public buildings including police stations and government buildings are prohibited to carry. Wrong.
    go read 790.06(12)(a) again.
    1. Any place of nuisance as defined in s. 823.05;
    2. Any police, sheriff, or highway patrol station[/B];
    3. Any detention facility, prison, or jail[/B];
    4. Any courthouse;
    5. Any courtroom, except that nothing in this section would preclude a judge from carrying a concealed weapon or determining who will carry a concealed weapon in his or her courtroom;
    6. Any polling place;
    7. Any meeting of the governing body of a county, public school district, municipality, or special district;
    8. Any meeting of the Legislature or a committee thereof;
    9. Any school, college, or professional athletic event not related to firearms;
    10. Any elementary or secondary school facility or administration building;
    11. Any career center;
    12. Any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises, which portion of the establishment is primarily devoted to such purpose;
    13. Any college or university facility unless the licensee is a registered student, employee, or faculty member of such college or university and the weapon is a stun gun or nonlethal electric weapon or device designed solely for defensive purposes and the weapon does not fire a dart or projectile;
    14. The inside of the passenger terminal and sterile area of any airport, provided that no person shall be prohibited from carrying any legal firearm into the terminal, which firearm is encased for shipment for purposes of checking such firearm as baggage to be lawfully transported on any aircraft; or
    15. Any place where the carrying of firearms is prohibited by federal law.

  6. #6
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustaShooter View Post
    Glad to help. Also, Ohio says: "Parking Lot Storage Law: Yes"

    Although some might wish it to be so, that is currently not the case.

    And finally: "Caveats: When carrying in a vehicle, a firearm must be carried in a manner that prevents unauthorized persons (children and prohibited persons) from accessing it. Carrying in a glove box does not count."

    According to ORC 2923.16

    and

    So, loaded firearms cannot be accessible to anyone that does not have a concealed handgun license (not just minors or prohibited persons), and unloaded firearms must be transported in a specific way - I'd probably just say "unloaded and properly stored"
    Got it - see why I find such a summary useful? The intent is to condense the meaning of what the law says in a manner that the average person can interpret it.

    I will change the parking lot storage section to "No" and change the Caveat piece to: "When carrying in a vehicle, a firearm must be carried in a manner that prevents any unlicensed person from accessing it. Unloaded firearms must be stored in an appropriate manner; properly encased, the action open, or field stripped firearms are accessible modes of transport."

  7. #7
    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Got it - see why I find such a summary useful? The intent is to condense the meaning of what the law says in a manner that the average person can interpret it.

    I will change the parking lot storage section to "No" and change the Caveat piece to: "When carrying in a vehicle, a firearm must be carried in a manner that prevents any unlicensed person from accessing it. Unloaded firearms must be stored in an appropriate manner; properly encased, the action open, or field stripped firearms are accessible modes of transport."
    Absolutely!

    Oh, I think you meant "acceptable" in that last sentence.
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  8. #8
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustaShooter View Post
    Absolutely!

    Oh, I think you meant "acceptable" in that last sentence.
    Good catch, thanks. How would carrying on your person apply when there is an unlicensed person in the vehicle? I added a comment for a person to use caution in that instance.

    I added the following for Florida:

    Vehicle Carry: Must be securely encased (glove box, snapped in a holster, or in a gun case) or not readily accessible for immediate use.

    Carry in Public Areas: Allowed in rest areas and state parks. Police stations, courthouses, detention centers, and meeting sessions of school districts, local, county, or state government are prohibited to carry.

  9. #9
    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Good catch, thanks. How would carrying on your person apply when there is an unlicensed person in the vehicle? I added a comment for a person to use caution in that instance.
    I don't think any caution would be necessary, I would think that it being on your person would allow you to prevent access to an unlicensed individual - though that could very well be a grey area in the law.
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    IANAL and anything I say is not intended to be nor should it be taken as legal advice.

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    On the Ohio page you have Magazine Limits set to "None". ORC 2923.11(E) states that:
    "Automatic firearm" means any firearm designed or specially adapted to fire a succession of cartridges with a single function of the trigger. "Automatic firearm" also means any semi-automatic firearm designed or specially adapted to fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading, other than a firearm chambering only .22 caliber short, long, or long-rifle cartridges.
    Therefore, a de facto magazine limit of 30 rounds exists, as any magazine with higher capacity combined with the one in the chamber would allow you to "fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading", thereby making it an 'automatic weapon' (BS, I know, but law is law). Since you can't have an automatic weapon without an Class 3 FFL, and Ohio says a semi-auto that can fire 32 rounds or more without reloading is an automatic firearm, the technical magazine limit is 30 rounds.

  11. #11
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJack View Post
    On the Ohio page you have Magazine Limits set to "None". ORC 2923.11(E) states that:

    Therefore, a de facto magazine limit of 30 rounds exists, as any magazine with higher capacity combined with the one in the chamber would allow you to "fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading", thereby making it an 'automatic weapon' (BS, I know, but law is law). Since you can't have an automatic weapon without an Class 3 FFL, and Ohio says a semi-auto that can fire 32 rounds or more without reloading is an automatic firearm, the technical magazine limit is 30 rounds.
    That is bizzare - I added that as a caveat since it doesn't technically affect general possession and carry. Ohio has some strange laws.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJack View Post
    On the Ohio page you have Magazine Limits set to "None". ORC 2923.11(E) states that:
    "Automatic firearm" means any firearm designed or specially adapted to fire a succession of cartridges with a single function of the trigger. "Automatic firearm" also means any semi-automatic firearm designed or specially adapted to fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading, other than a firearm chambering only .22 caliber short, long, or long-rifle cartridges.
    Therefore, a de facto magazine limit of 30 rounds exists, as any magazine with higher capacity combined with the one in the chamber would allow you to "fire more than thirty-one cartridges without reloading", thereby making it an 'automatic weapon' (BS, I know, but law is law). Since you can't have an automatic weapon without an Class 3 FFL, and Ohio says a semi-auto that can fire 32 rounds or more without reloading is an automatic firearm, the technical magazine limit is 30 rounds.
    Yeah, I forgot about that - there's been discussion on this topic over in (I think) OFCC and the conclusion was, because of the way the law was written you could possess them, and even have them loaded, and be fine. But as soon as you insert them into a firearm you have broken the law. That said, I wouldn't want to be the test case for that one, I'd rather work toward striking that from the ORC (which is one of the initiatives underway for this legislative session, BTW).
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  13. #13
    Regular Member JustaShooter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Ohio has some strange laws.
    Yes we do, thank you for noticing!
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  14. #14
    Regular Member dmatting's Avatar
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    I have a couple minor points for the North Carolina page.

    On Tuesday October 1, carry in places that sell and serve alcohol will be allowed if one has a CHP. Up until that date, though, the page is correct.

    Under "Carry in Public Areas" you list State Parks. I would amend that to read concealed carry in State Parks with a valid CHP.
    Reference Cite would be NC GS 14-415.11(c1)

    Also, a lot of the BS laws pertaining to storing a handgun in a vehicle on state property requires a valid CHP.

    In the "Must Inform" section you state that one must disclose to law enforcement that they are carrying whether it is concealed or not concealed. The law only applies to concealed carry (NC GS 14-415.11(a)). There is no law that states one must disclose if OCing. Since it doesn't exist, I can't cite.

  15. #15
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    I updated the link in the first post with the latest version which includes all suggestions up to and including North Carolina.

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    Sorry I didn't notice this earlier, but on the Ohio page you list
    Trespass: Must leave if signage is posted prohibiting carry.
    While this is true, you also must leave if asked, whether posted or not.

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    You're Mississippi and Louisiana notes are a mess. I'll try to give you some detail in the next few days.

    I recommend you make a separation between OC and CC in each state. They/re usually handled entirety different.

  18. #18
    Regular Member Gil223's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acmariner99 View Post
    Hello my fellow carriers. Over the past couple of months, I have used various resources including opencarry.org, handgunlaw.us, usacarry.com, and a few others to put in writing a high level summary of the conditions of carry laws throughout the US - without the legalese. It is similar to the state travel guide in this sense. I am now putting it on this public forum so some of my fellow gun owners can review, provide feedback, or even keep a copy of it themselves. This is a personal project with no intention to distribute for profit - so feel free to make any changes you see fit. I am open to constructive criticism and I know I am not a lawyer (I included a disclaimer as such on the first page.) It is a document that I keep with me when I travel so I can see at a glance how I can carry across the country without sifting through a bunch of legal stuff online. I am particularly interested in refining the definitions I included and ensuring the "caveats" section is accurate for each state. If you think there is something I should add, please let me know. I look forward to your responses.

    (Feel free to download and distribute at your leisure)

    https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B2WA...it?usp=sharing
    There has been much said in this thread about the accuracy of your document. About the only thing that HASN't been said is - THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR TAKING THE INITIATIVE, AND SHARING YOUR BETA VERSION WITH US!

    You are aware that it may not be perfect, and have solicited input from the OC folks to help increase the accuracy/understandability of some of the translated legalese. This says quite a bit about your character! THANK YOU VERY MUCH, acmariner99! Pax...
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  19. #19
    Regular Member Gil223's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustJack View Post
    Sorry I didn't notice this earlier, but on the Ohio page you list
    Trespass: Must leave if signage is posted prohibiting carry.
    While this is true, you also must leave if asked, whether posted or not.
    Actually, if signage is properly posted, in plain view upon the entrance door, you should not enter in the first place. If the signage is inside the building, only then must you "leave". Pax...
    Last edited by Gil223; 09-28-2013 at 12:17 PM.
    MOLON LABE
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  20. #20
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gil223 View Post
    There has been much said in this thread about the accuracy of your document. About the only thing that HASN't been said is - THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR TAKING THE INITIATIVE, AND SHARING YOUR BETA VERSION WITH US!

    You are aware that it may not be perfect, and have solicited input from the OC folks to help increase the accuracy/understandability of some of the translated legalese. This says quite a bit about your character! THANK YOU VERY MUCH, acmariner99! Pax...
    Thank you for your comment. I appreciate the encouragement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gil223 View Post
    Actually, if signage is properly posted, in plain view at the entrance, you should not enter in the first place. If the signage is inside the building, only then must you "leave". Pax...
    I think what I will do to clean up this trespass issue is to update the definition at the top of the document. It stands to reason that if signage is present and you choose to ignore it, then being verbally asked to leave also applies - blatantly ignoring such signage is in poor taste IMO, but legally that is how it would stand. The definition as it stands now is the "first level" at which it becomes illegal to remain or enter into a place while armed.

    For example: in Washington, no gun signs have no force of law unless it is in a place that is statutorily deemed to be off limits (should probably add that piece of clarification as well). Therefore, trespass only applies when being verbally asked to leave.

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    Thanks for doing this. I'm not where I can pull the verbiage for Oklahoma. For school zones, people with a handgun permit can have a weapon on them while picking up or dropping off at the door. You can not exit the vehicle with a firearm nor store a firearm in your vehicle on school property. Effective Nov 1st 2013, private schools will be allowed to develop their own firearms policies. Public schools will remain the same.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

  22. #22
    Regular Member acmariner99's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DamnYankeeOk View Post
    Thanks for doing this. I'm not where I can pull the verbiage for Oklahoma. For school zones, people with a handgun permit can have a weapon on them while picking up or dropping off at the door. You can not exit the vehicle with a firearm nor store a firearm in your vehicle on school property. Effective Nov 1st 2013, private schools will be allowed to develop their own firearms policies. Public schools will remain the same.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4
    I re-read some of the Oklahoma Statutes on this subject and I found that you can have firearms stored in a vehicle on the campuses of Colleges and Universities (21-1277 (D)) but you cannot leave your vehicle unattended if you are on primary or secondary school property. (21-1280.1 (C)) you must be licensed in either case.

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