Eviction Notice for Open Carrying in Spokane

Since I know Ben I would highly doubt that he threatened anyone, make them prove you threatened someone. If people are frightened by your wearing a properly holstered handgun that is not your fault or your problem. What about when Cops show up are they not allowed on the property with a firearm?

Would they evict a heavily tattooed 6-8 300 lb biker that always had a scowl on his face because people were afraid of him. Would they evict the black guy that wears a hoodie and pants falling off his hips hat sideways and a tear drop tattoo because someone is afraid of them.

I would plan on moving in the near future but I would also fight it as much as you possibly can.

Good Luck Ben you do not deserve this.

PS Since they are accusing you of something you are not doing you may have a defamation of character law suit that you could file. They can not say things about you that damages your reputation unless they are true. That person that filed the police report may have also defamed you depending on what they said, police reports are great in court BTW.

Have you seen the police report that was filed against you? Was the complaint just for open carrying or did you get into any verbal altercations with another tenant? From the letter it sounds like something more is going on than merely open carrying.

As much as I love a good fight you might really want to think about your options and what the repercussions could be. If you fight it and are evicted you will find getting a new place nearly impossible. Is that something you and the wife can live with? If there is anything else going on besides just oc'ing I'm sure you will have a hard time winning in court. Whether any other allegations are true or not it will be your word against theirs. I'm sure the court wouldn't come down in favor of the person oc'ing.

I'd also check with the ACLU. They love civil rights violations and although they seem generally anti-gun they might offer some advice.

I spoke with the police and there is no record of a report being filed.

See if the folks here http://www.nwcdl.org/ can provide you with info or direct assistance or a referral for assistance.

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Sorry but NWCDL never took off and got the backing needed.

bennie1986 said:

I spoke with the police and there is no record of a report being filed.

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Which is the surest proof of management's reckless exaggerations about boisterous and threatening conduct.

Very few people would omit to call the police if actually threatened with a gun. The fact police haven't come banging on your door to question you in connection to "threats" with a gun speaks volumes.

I went to go discuss the letter with the management but they are out for the day, they normally are open Saturdays. I called the afterhours number and the lady I spoke with said she will not discuss it over the phone and I would have to wait until probably Monday. I told her because the letter is so vague that I have no idea what they expect from me IF I was going to comply, she still wouldn't talk. I called the property management company and left a message for the people above the site management that I was issued this letter and that they refuse to explain it to me but expect me to comply. I guess we will wait and see if I get a call before Monday but I don't plan on changing any of my normal carrying habits.

Here's my non-lawyerly take on your situation. It seems everybody here is focusing on the gun, and the fact that case law, blah blah blah, has shown that lawful carry is not a cause for suspicion of criminal activity, or whatever. The way I see it, the issue is not the fact you are carrying, but rather the fact your neighbors don't feel comfortable, and are complaining about you. Whether carrying a gun is legal, or the fact that your neighbors's fears are likely unfounded (I say likely because I have no way of knowing otherwise), the problem is your visible carry of a firearm is, as the letter said, disturbing the harmony and peace, or whatever. That is what has you in danger of being booted if you don't comply.

If something you are doing, whether legal or not, goes against the "norm," and it bothers enough people to cause them to complain, you can be booted for violating their right to live peacefully. If you get into loud arguments with a roommate, play loud music, or just act like a moron to the point people feel they can no longer overlook it, then it can be argued you are showing disorderly conduct. It's like the old saying goes, your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins.

Basically, you are renting an apartment, and as such, are bound by a different set of rules than you would be if you owned your home. Heck, sometimes even homeowners are bound by very strict HOA rules. No different than if you had a roommate that decided they wanted to walk around the apartment naked all the time. Assuming this isn't a roommate you would ever want to see naked, their exhibitionism would likely disturb your enjoyment of the apartment you are paying for. If you were unable to settle things directly, you could take the matter to your apartment management.

Bottom line is, the apartment complex has to ensure they maintain an enjoyable environment for as many people as possible. When one person is causing several paying tenants to complain, the complex must do what is required to appease the most people.

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?Cite=59.18

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=59.18.130

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=59.18.140

Medic1210 said:

Bottom line is, the apartment complex has to ensure they maintain an enjoyable environment for as many people as possible. When one person is causing several paying tenants to complain, the complex must do what is required to appease the most people.

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Except that that's illegal. In a place with no landlord-tenant laws, you might have a point. This is not that place. The landlord has to follow the rules, and so far, doesn't seem to be.

Wearing a blue shirt might annoy people who hate the color blue. It's not grounds for an eviction of the shirt wearer.

I've left this topic alone up till now because I wanted to see what the general responses would be from the community. But speaking from experience, I will tell you that if/when the landlord does take this issue to court, the judge will most likely not give a rat's rearend about any of the important facts of the case. The judge will simply look at these facts... Did the landlord serve you with legal notice? Did you abide by said notice?

As of May 28th of this year, I was illegally evicted and terminated from my subsidized housing for the simple fact that I owned a gun and kept it in my home or on my person. No other reason. I paid my rent, I followed the law, and I followed my lease to the letter. But it didn't matter one bit to the judge. I had paperwork saying that my landlord was bound by certian rules and regulations above and beyond those found in state landlord tenant law. Specifically HUD rules and regulations. But the judge refused to even read the paperwork that I provided.

My one and only piece of advice to you is this. Get a lawyer if you can afford one. If you can't, find a new place to live. Why? Because the legal services out there availible to those without the means to afford them also do not care and will not help. I am currently left with the only option availible to me and that is to file a lawsuit against the agency that was providing my housing subsidy for violation of my rights and violation of the Unconstitutional Conditions Doctrine which states that the government nor a representative of the government may require an otherwise eligible citizen to sacrifice a RIGHT in return for public benefits.

Some have said that the 2nd amendment doesn't play a role in this and I respond by saying Bull! We all know that the SCOTUS has made 2 ground breaking rulings regarding the 2nd amendment. In 2008, they said that the 2nd amendment does in fact apply to individual citizens regarding the possession of commonly owned firearms for legal purposes of self defense and defense of ones HOME. And again they ruled in 2010 that the 2008 ruling does in fact apply to the states through the 14th amendment. Anybody that wants to say that because you are renting, the landlord can make rules and lease provisions that prohibit your possession of firearms on their "private" property and those people are wrong. The SCOTUS says otherwise. It is your RIGHT to possess firearms for lawful purposes IN your home and ON your person no matter if you rent or own. The fact that you rent means absolutely nothing. Some people have no choice but to rent due to lack of finances, job requirements preventing the ability to stay in one location for extended durations or whatever.

LINK

As you can see, I have actually been through this for quite some time and I did my homework. But in the end, I still ended up out on my a$$ because corrupt people will be corrupt.

I restate. Take a stand, get a lawyer, and above all else, don't let them get away with denying you your rights. If they do it to you and get away with it, they will do it to somebody else and they will keep doing it till somebody finally stands up and says "No more!"

PS. I haven't said anything on these forums about the current state of these affairs regarding myself because I have done some stupid things in the past and others have not approved. I have tried to change the way I go about handling certain issues and I have tried to help facilitate changes in my local community to the best of my ability. I don't expect help from anybody here though I know there are many that have the resources that I do not.

Grim, well put. I will repeat his advice. If you can't get a lawyer comply with the letter or move it.

Disclaimer: I've been lurking this forum for some time and felt compelled to register and comment. I do not currently open carry. I don't rent.

May I suggest,

1. Conceal carry in the meantime. The fellow tenants claim the "showing" of your gun as the basis of your "threatening" behavior (I'm assuming you did nothing more than open carry with your firearm safely holstered). Doing this will comply with their request until you can pursue the legal open carry rights.

2. As Grim says, exhaust legal options and get a lawyer. I read his thread and was surprised The Second Amendment Foundation was unwilling to assist ".. because helping me won't help to set a precedent." I suspect you'll see more of this and hope they get involved.

3. Lock your firearms in a safe. Don't give them any excuse should they enter your home.

4. Expect that the next time you sign a new lease that there will be language prohibiting firearms (if it doesn't exist now). Probably not since it's you're behavior cited. Start shopping for a new place to live and ask for their lease to read over.

This seems to be the new frontier. With victories in the courts, the right to carry will be infringed through private property rights (the age old rights vs rights battle). Seattle's "no guns" sticker campaign and Starbucks are examples. I'm currently reading "Emily Gets Her Gun" (http://www.nraila.org/news-issues/articles/2013/9/emily-gets-her-gun!.aspx) and am amazed at the obstacles she had to endure to exercise her right"

Best to you.

~Brian
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Parker_(captain)

Don't have money for a lawyer which is the reason I have not sued the city of Spokane in the past and cant sue the property management now. I will not comply just because I cannot afford a lawyer, I am sick of being screwed over by the "privileged" class. Just because I don't make enough money in life does not exempt my rights but that being said I know ill end up ****** anyways. I would rather be on the streets than give in. Give me liberty or give me, in this case, an evection notice.

bennie1986 said:

Don't have money for a lawyer which is the reason I have not sued the city of Spokane in the past and cant sue the property management now. I will not comply just because I cannot afford a lawyer, I am sick of being screwed over by the "privileged" class. Just because I don't make enough money in life does not exempt my rights but that being said I know ill end up ****** anyways. I would rather be on the streets than give in. Give me liberty or give me, in this case, an evection notice.

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In that case maybe we should have an open carry meet at your apartment?

Anyone thought of contacting Komo Problem Solvers? You never know they might scare the crap outta the landlord.

....Sent via Galaxy S4 in Hell....

spikedzombies said:

Anyone thought of contacting Komo Problem Solvers? You never know they might scare the crap outta the landlord.

....Sent via Galaxy S4 in Hell....

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Great idea if it wasnt the media. They generally hate us, but who knows, a diamond in the rough...

One can only hope.

....Sent via coyote 1.1 - 2.0 still in Alpha....

Coyote_VS_ACME said:

Great idea if it wasnt the media. They generally hate us, but who knows, a diamond in the rough...

One can only hope.

....Sent via coyote 1.1 - 2.0 still in Alpha....

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That's weird cause a few years ago they were willing to do a story about pierce County district court not having lock boxes for firearms..

....Sent via Galaxy S4 in Hell....

Coyote_VS_ACME said:

Great idea if it wasnt the media. They generally hate us, but who knows, a diamond in the rough...

One can only hope.

....Sent via coyote 1.1 - 2.0 still in Alpha....

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There was a case a few years ago were Jesse helped a woman with a gun issue, very positive.......get Jesse!..

Sorry you are going through this Bennie.

Grim is right, sadly the courts are not our friends especially if we lack money for a lawyer, which most people do they know this and rely on this.

Ben any idea what it would cost for a Lawyer to fight this? I would chip in the first $100 if others will donate.

Jeff Hayes said:

Ben any idea what it would cost for a Lawyer to fight this? I would chip in the first $100 if others will donate.

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+1 I'll help out a bit too.