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Thread: Just got my CPL so do I still have to be a resident for 90 days to purchase a pistol?

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    Regular Member bebop4one's Avatar
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    Just got my CPL so do I still have to be a resident for 90 days to purchase a pistol?

    Hi guys so I've been researching this and can't seem to find an answer. I have been a resident of Washington State for about 2 1/2 months. I got my drivers license almost immediately when I first got here. I just recently got my CPL after a waiting period of 29 days. My question is do I need to be a resident for the full 90 days to purchase a handgun in this state if I have my DL and CPL? I already own several pistols so making someone wait 90 days seems illogical. Anyone familiar with the RCWs that can help a guy out?
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    I've never heard of this requirement in any state, though I am admittedly not an expert in WA. Hunting licenses usually have a residency time for resident licenses, but that has nothing to do with purchasing handguns, of course.
    "It's not important how many people I've killed. What's important is how I get along with the people who are still alive" - Jimmy the Tulip

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    Activist Member golddigger14s's Avatar
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    Go buy a gun!
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    Regular Member 509rifas's Avatar
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    You have to be a resident to buy a pistol, I believe it is 60 days. I'd quote it, but I'm on a fone I can't easily look it up. I know its in the requirements on the CPL application.
    If you have WA ID it should be fine. At gun shows they usually ask to see a WA ID to see if you are 18 and a WA resident, but don't always write it down.
    If you're gonna buy at a gun store they'll know for sure.
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    Regular Member 509rifas's Avatar
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    Ok so I looked it up.

    http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.090

    I can't copy and paste it, but it looks like as per statute, the waiting period doesn't apply if you have WA ID and CPL. You may wanna go over it more closely, I didn't read it close enough to see about where the question of residency and CPLs, but 90 days is the standard.
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    I am pretty sure you are good to go with the cpl, no more waiting three days for pistols purchased in state.
    Last edited by MattinWA; 10-11-2013 at 08:59 AM.

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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Having a Driver's License and CPL issued in WA State appears to fulfill the rule under GCA 68 that one "show an intent to reside in the state where you are present".

    Here's some reading on the topic http://www.justice.gov/olc/2012/ATF9...NAL1-30-12.pdf

    It's not complicated at all. Fill out forms, present D/L and CPL, wait for NICS approval, Pay your money, and leave with your new firearm.

    Then all you have to worry about is finding ammo for it
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

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    Regular Member bebop4one's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amlevin View Post
    Having a Driver's License and CPL issued in WA State appears to fulfill the rule under GCA 68 that one "show an intent to reside in the state where you are present".

    Here's some reading on the topic http://www.justice.gov/olc/2012/ATF9...NAL1-30-12.pdf

    It's not complicated at all. Fill out forms, present D/L and CPL, wait for NICS approval, Pay your money, and leave with your new firearm.

    Then all you have to worry about is finding ammo for it
    Awesome. I know that the application you fill out when purchasing a pistol here says something about being a resident for 90 days but good to know the CPL and DL take care of it.
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bebop4one View Post
    ...the application you fill out when purchasing a pistol here ...
    You guys have something beyond the ATF form?

    I would not have expected that from Washington State.
    Last edited by MAC702; 10-11-2013 at 11:50 AM.
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    Regular Member Squeak's Avatar
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    DO NOT listen to these guys! Just give me the money and I'll get the gun for you. I'll even let you decide what to buy.

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    The 90 Days to prove residency method on the state pistol transfer form is old data. Current law is 30 days. Once you've been here 30 days and you've made the effort to become a resident (have permanent address, DL and/or Voter Reg) then you're a resident and can purchase handgun and "other" firearms.

    *ETA

    http://access.wa.gov/topics/living/becomeresident

    https://wei.sos.wa.gov/agency/osos/e...uirements.aspx

    To register to vote in Washington State, you must be a resident of the state.

    You must establish your voting residency address at least 30 days before Election Day. You may specify a mailing address that is different from your residential address.
    *ETA

    The following are a few examples of actions you can take to become a resident of Washington:

    Last edited by sirpuma; 10-14-2013 at 10:06 AM.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirpuma View Post
    The 90 Days to prove residency method on the state pistol transfer form is old data. Current law is 30 days...
    You cited voting regulations; that does not necessarily apply outside of voting. As mentioned, hunting license (and college tuition) residency requirements are probably on a time-delay also.

    Is there a citation that shows handgun purchases require the same time-delay?

    I've been reading several of your forms on-line, but don't see it.
    Last edited by MAC702; 10-11-2013 at 12:15 PM.
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    Regular Member bebop4one's Avatar
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    I spoke to a guy on the phone from West Coast Armory in Bellevue and he said I have to wait 90 days even though I have a CPL and DL. He said anything less does not establish residency even with those licenses. The guy also said that the 90 day wait was both a state and federal regulation. He sounded really unsure at first and went back and forth a few times with "no you don't" and then "oh yeah you gotta wait". That doesn't sound too reassuring to me. I'm inclined to believe you gentleman before I take his word for it.
    Last edited by bebop4one; 10-11-2013 at 12:41 PM.
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    Campaign Veteran gogodawgs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bebop4one View Post
    I spoke to a guy on the phone from West Coast Armory in Bellevue and he said I have to wait 90 days even though I have a CPL and DL. He said anything less does not establish residency even with those licenses. The guy also said that the 90 day wait was both a state and federal regulation. He sounded really unsure at first and went back and forth a few times with "no you don't" and then "oh yeah you gotta wait". That doesn't sound too reassuring to me. I'm inclined to believe you gentleman before I take his word for it.
    Gun store employees barely know the law. Trust me, I used to run a gun store.

    You can buy a pistol with a WA ID and CPL.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bebop4one View Post
    I spoke to a guy on the phone from West Coast Armory in Bellevue and he said I have to wait 90 days even though I have a CPL and DL. He said anything less does not establish residency even with those licenses. The guy also said that the 90 day wait was both a state and federal regulation. He sounded really unsure at first and went back and forth a few times with "no you don't" and then "oh yeah you gotta wait". That doesn't sound too reassuring to me. I'm inclined to believe you gentleman before I take his word for it.
    I used to keep a list in Word of all the stupid things gun shop employees/owners have told me over the years some of it was pretty funny and some of it was actually dangerous both legally and physically. Always verify for your self google is your friend.

    Now down tot he good stuff whatcha buying????
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    I used to keep a list in Word of all the stupid things gun shop employees/owners have told me over the years some of it was pretty funny and some of it was actually dangerous both legally and physically. Always verify for your self google is your friend.

    Now down tot he good stuff whatcha buying????
    Would love to see this list if you didn't get rid of it. Start a new topic or PM it to me?

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    Regular Member bebop4one's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Hayes View Post
    I used to keep a list in Word of all the stupid things gun shop employees/owners have told me over the years some of it was pretty funny and some of it was actually dangerous both legally and physically. Always verify for your self google is your friend.

    Now down tot he good stuff whatcha buying????
    Ruger LCP. My Glock 23 is great in some situations but I need something smaller for when I'm wearing a suit at work. I know they aren't the most comfortable to shoot at the range but as it's for self defense I really don't mind.
    "I have a very strict gun control policy: if there's a gun around, I want to be in control of it."
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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bebop4one View Post
    ...both a state and federal regulation...
    Well now I know he is wrong because it is not a federal regulation. I'd never heard of it, and I used to work for an FFL selling guns in Nevada. I still can't believe it is a state regulation, and still waiting to see it in writing.
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    Regular Member 509rifas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gogodawgs View Post
    Gun store employees barely know the law. Trust me, I used to run a gun store.

    You can buy a pistol with a WA ID and CPL.
    That's the truth, I've had one try to tell me that it's a federal offense to carry remanufactured HPs, and claimed his knowledge was based on what happened to his buddy.
    I've found that a lot of gun store legal advice is based on urban legend. You know if you spray teflon on your bullets they go through bulletproof vests? That's why its a felony to spray cooking spray on your ammo.
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    Regular Member Vitaeus's Avatar
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    If you have a WA CPL you meet the requirement of (1)(a) to skip the waiting period, (a), (b), and (c) are or's as far as I read it.


    RCW 9.41.090
    Dealer deliveries regulated Hold on delivery.

    (1) In addition to the other requirements of this chapter, no dealer may deliver a pistol to the purchaser thereof until:

    (a) The purchaser produces a valid concealed pistol license and the dealer has recorded the purchaser's name, license number, and issuing agency, such record to be made in triplicate and processed as provided in subsection (5) of this section. For purposes of this subsection (1)(a), a "valid concealed pistol license" does not include a temporary emergency license, and does not include any license issued before July 1, 1996, unless the issuing agency conducted a records search for disqualifying crimes under RCW 9.41.070 at the time of issuance;

    (b) The dealer is notified in writing by the chief of police or the sheriff of the jurisdiction in which the purchaser resides that the purchaser is eligible to possess a pistol under RCW 9.41.040 and that the application to purchase is approved by the chief of police or sheriff; or

    (c) Five business days, meaning days on which state offices are open, have elapsed from the time of receipt of the application for the purchase thereof as provided herein by the chief of police or sheriff designated in subsection (5) of this section, and, when delivered, the pistol shall be securely wrapped and shall be unloaded. However, if the purchaser does not have a valid permanent Washington driver's license or state identification card or has not been a resident of the state for the previous consecutive ninety days, the waiting period under this subsection (1)(c) shall be up to sixty days.

    (2)(a) Except as provided in (b) of this subsection, in determining whether the purchaser meets the requirements of RCW 9.41.040, the chief of police or sheriff, or the designee of either, shall check with the national crime information center, the Washington state patrol electronic database, the department of social and health services electronic database, and with other agencies or resources as appropriate, to determine whether the applicant is ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a firearm.

    (b) Once the system is established, a dealer shall use the state system and national instant criminal background check system, provided for by the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act (18 U.S.C. Sec. 921 et seq.), to make criminal background checks of applicants to purchase firearms. However, a chief of police or sheriff, or a designee of either, shall continue to check the department of social and health services' electronic database and with other agencies or resources as appropriate, to determine whether applicants are ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a firearm.

    (3) In any case under subsection (1)(c) of this section where the applicant has an outstanding warrant for his or her arrest from any court of competent jurisdiction for a felony or misdemeanor, the dealer shall hold the delivery of the pistol until the warrant for arrest is served and satisfied by appropriate court appearance. The local jurisdiction for purposes of the sale shall confirm the existence of outstanding warrants within seventy-two hours after notification of the application to purchase a pistol is received. The local jurisdiction shall also immediately confirm the satisfaction of the warrant on request of the dealer so that the hold may be released if the warrant was for an offense other than an offense making a person ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a pistol.

    (4) In any case where the chief or sheriff of the local jurisdiction has reasonable grounds based on the following circumstances: (a) Open criminal charges, (b) pending criminal proceedings, (c) pending commitment proceedings, (d) an outstanding warrant for an offense making a person ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a pistol, or (e) an arrest for an offense making a person ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a pistol, if the records of disposition have not yet been reported or entered sufficiently to determine eligibility to purchase a pistol, the local jurisdiction may hold the sale and delivery of the pistol beyond five days up to thirty days in order to confirm existing records in this state or elsewhere. After thirty days, the hold will be lifted unless an extension of the thirty days is approved by a local district court or municipal court for good cause shown. A dealer shall be notified of each hold placed on the sale by local law enforcement and of any application to the court for additional hold period to confirm records or confirm the identity of the applicant.

    (5) At the time of applying for the purchase of a pistol, the purchaser shall sign in triplicate and deliver to the dealer an application containing his or her full name, residential address, date and place of birth, race, and gender; the date and hour of the application; the applicant's driver's license number or state identification card number; a description of the pistol including the make, model, caliber and manufacturer's number if available at the time of applying for the purchase of a pistol. If the manufacturer's number is not available, the application may be processed, but delivery of the pistol to the purchaser may not occur unless the manufacturer's number is recorded on the application by the dealer and transmitted to the chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county in which the purchaser resides; and a statement that the purchaser is eligible to possess a pistol under RCW 9.41.040.

    The application shall contain a warning substantially as follows:


    CAUTION: Although state and local laws do not differ, federal law and state law on the possession of firearms differ. If you are prohibited by federal law from possessing a firearm, you may be prosecuted in federal court. State permission to purchase a firearm is not a defense to a federal prosecution.



    The purchaser shall be given a copy of the department of fish and wildlife pamphlet on the legal limits of the use of firearms, firearms safety, and the fact that local laws and ordinances on firearms are preempted by state law and must be consistent with state law.

    The dealer shall, by the end of the business day, sign and attach his or her address and deliver a copy of the application and such other documentation as required under subsection (1) of this section to the chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county of which the purchaser is a resident. The triplicate shall be retained by the dealer for six years. The dealer shall deliver the pistol to the purchaser following the period of time specified in this section unless the dealer is notified of an investigative hold under subsection (4) of this section in writing by the chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county, whichever is applicable, denying the purchaser's application to purchase and the grounds thereof. The application shall not be denied unless the purchaser is not eligible to possess a pistol under RCW 9.41.040 or 9.41.045, or federal law.

    The chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county shall retain or destroy applications to purchase a pistol in accordance with the requirements of 18 U.S.C. Sec. 922.

    (6) A person who knowingly makes a false statement regarding identity or eligibility requirements on the application to purchase a pistol is guilty of false swearing under RCW 9A.72.040.

    (7) This section does not apply to sales to licensed dealers for resale or to the sale of antique firearms.

    [1996 c 295 8. Prior: 1994 sp.s. c 7 410; 1994 c 264 1; 1988 c 36 2; 1985 c 428 4; 1983 c 232 4; 1969 ex.s. c 227 1; 1961 c 124 7; 1935 c 172 9; RRS 2516-9.]

    Notes:
    Finding -- Intent -- Severability -- 1994 sp.s. c 7: See notes following RCW 43.70.540.
    Effective date -- 1994 sp.s. c 7 401-410, 413-416, 418-437, and 439-460: See note following RCW 9.41.010.

    Severability -- 1985 c 428: See note following RCW 9.41.290.

    Severability -- 1983 c 232: See note following RCW 9.41.010.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vitaeus View Post
    ...However, if the purchaser does not have a valid permanent Washington driver's license or state identification card or has not been a resident of the state for the previous consecutive ninety days, the waiting period under this subsection (1)(c) shall be up to sixty days....
    Did I miss anything else, or does a Washington driver's license all by itself also waive the 90-day residency requirement? Which would make sense, as a driver's license is clear documentation of intent to maintain residency.

    Looks to me like the mythical 90-day residency documentation would be if you were trying to use your utility bills to document residency, which is probably not even allowed anymore anyway!
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    Regular Member amlevin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 509rifas View Post
    That's the truth, I've had one try to tell me that it's a federal offense to carry remanufactured HPs, and claimed his knowledge was based on what happened to his buddy.
    I've found that a lot of gun store legal advice is based on urban legend. You know if you spray teflon on your bullets they go through bulletproof vests? That's why its a felony to spray cooking spray on your ammo.
    The one I like, and seem to hear the most from Gun Shop Employees, is "Concealed Means Concealed. Your license is for a Concealed Pistol so if you have one you have to carry it Concealed?"

    Like they say on TV "But WAIT, there's MORE!! It's not just Gun Store Employees but also a lot of so-called "Certified Handgun Instructors".
    "If I shoot all the ammo I am carrying I either won't need anymore or more won't help"

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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    You cited voting regulations; that does not necessarily apply outside of voting. As mentioned, hunting license (and college tuition) residency requirements are probably on a time-delay also.

    Is there a citation that shows handgun purchases require the same time-delay?

    I've been reading several of your forms on-line, but don't see it.
    If you notice, in order to register to vote, you have to be a resident and it indicates that to be a resident you have to be in state with an address for no less than 30 days and have a WA DL. And just so you could find the info in the link I shared, I also quoted their site on how to become a resident.

    But just to work with the text from the law that Vitaeus quoted.

    (c) Five business days, meaning days on which state offices are open, have elapsed from the time of receipt of the application for the purchase thereof as provided herein by the chief of police or sheriff designated in subsection (5) of this section, and, when delivered, the pistol shall be securely wrapped and shall be unloaded. However, if the purchaser does not have a valid permanent Washington driver's license or state identification card or has not been a resident of the state for the previous consecutive ninety days, the waiting period under this subsection (1)(c) shall be up to sixty days.
    So IF you have a valid WA Driver's License, then you are a resident and don't have to be in state for 90 days.
    Last edited by sirpuma; 10-14-2013 at 10:07 AM.

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    Campaign Veteran MAC702's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirpuma View Post
    If you notice, in order to register to vote, you have to be a resident and it indicates that to be a resident you have to be in state with an address for no less than 30 days and have a WA DL. And just so you could find the info in the link I shared, I also quoted their site on how to become a resident.

    But just to work with the text from the law that Vitaeus quoted.



    So IF you have a valid WA Driver's License, then you are a resident and don't have to be in state for 90 days.
    Just these two statements from you indicate there is a difference. The residency requirements for voting are different than the residency requirements for purchasing a pistol, and are probably different still than the residency requirements for a hunting license or college tuition.

    I thought we've already established that a WA ID is all you need to buy a pistol, exempting all time requirements. Whereas for voting, it does not.
    Last edited by MAC702; 10-14-2013 at 01:29 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MAC702 View Post
    Just these two statements from you indicate there is a difference. The residency requirements for voting are different than the residency requirements for purchasing a pistol, and are probably different still than the residency requirements for a hunting license or college tuition.

    I thought we've already established that a WA ID is all you need to buy a pistol, exempting all time requirements. Whereas for voting, it does not.
    The focus of my statements were not about voting but pointing out that to register to vote you must be a resident. I state what it takes to be a resident and provide links to definitions of resident. But I guess some folks can't ever get themselves past one little word to read the rest.

    And not everyone who comes here and gets a place to live with their stuff is immediately a resident. I've known more than one who live in another state but come here for long contracts. And though they get an apartment to live in and bring some of their stuff to make their stay more comfortable, in six or nine months or a year they're moving back because the work contract is up.

    The big one is getting the WA driver's license (one of the steps to establish residency per the state website I linked to). And since some don't like to click on links to read I'll quote from http://access.wa.gov/topics/living/becomeresident

    Become a Resident

    It's easy to become a Washington State resident; simply take some action that proves you intend to live in the state on more than a temporary or transient basis.
    The following are a few examples of actions you can take to become a resident of Washington:

    So both a DL and a Voter Registration card are valid proofs of residency (which is why I mentioned the voting bit). When I have customers come in, I have to have proof of residency in order to sell them a handgun. A CPL isn't proof of residency but is useable as a form of identification. I have to verify ID, address and residency of an individual in order to transfer a handgun or an "other". I can use more than one document but all documents must be government issued and at least one must be a photo ID. Documents I can use to verify identity are ID/DL, CPL, Voter Registration, Military Orders, Vehicle Registration. For non-WA CPLs to wave the waiting period they must be from a state that WA has reciprocity with. To verify residency I go by DL, Voter Registration, Military Orders. I have yet to have someone not have a WA DL or Military Orders come in claiming to be a resident in order to get a handgun.

    Getting a DL is the easiest method of becoming a resident but registering to vote is just as easy. You don't have to be here for 30 days, just that you have to be here for 30 days BEFORE the next voting cycle in order to vote. And the "voting residency" mentioned in the link for voter registration is defined here http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=29A.04.151

    RCW 29A.04.151

    Residence.
    "Residence" for the purpose of registering and voting means a person's permanent address where he or she physically resides and maintains his or her abode. However, no person gains residence by reason of his or her presence or loses his or her residence by reason of his or her absence:
    One thing I don't really like about our State Pistol Transfer form is that is has a block for "how long you've been a resident" with lines for years and months. For those here less than a month I end up just putting "1" in the month, even though it's not accurate. I suppose I could leave it blank but generally don't like to.
    Last edited by sirpuma; 10-15-2013 at 11:23 AM.

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