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Grapeshot

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Making the OC forum invisible to non-members is "standing in the way of OC." As far as your invitation goes, after OC becomes visible at that site, I will explore it as a non-member. After that, maybe I'd join. However, the clearly demonstrated attitude toward OC (making it invisible) keeps me from even looking.

I don't really feel the need to join anyway. I will continue to operate independently; that is true grassroots.


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<o>

Could not disagree more - requiring registration first in no way becomes a negative regarding OC. That is tantamount to saying that requiring registration is anti RKBA - absurd. Registration and their operating policies allow for much tighter control of the direction their organization takes w/o outside interference - that can be a decidedly good thing.

OCDO being a publicly read forum brings with it the problems associated with that free/unbridled access. We have been quoted out of context, attract spammers like fleas on a dog, and too often make our intentions known too soon, provide a blueprint for the antis. Such is the price of free access.

That some of their members might be critical of OC is not of major concern - haven't visited enough to determine that yet though. What is most important from the standpoint of OCDO's rules is what is the organization's official stand on OC. I have seen where OFCC has pushed for laws and such that have benefited both OC and CC. Is have seen nothing to indicate a stance by the organization to oppose OC.

Being a lone wolf activist is not in itself a bad thing, still it only multiplies the effort by one (1). It is not simply a trite expression when we say, "There is power in numbers." True grassroots (note that is plural noun) is a coming together of the common or ordinary people for a cause.

Registration is free on OFCC - costs a little time. Don't like it, don't go back.
 

eye95

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Couldn't disagree more. Hiding OC, while NOT hiding CC, shows a preference against OC, as if there is something to be hidden about it.

And registration costs more than time. It costs information. If they are going to hide information from me, I won't share any of mine with them.

OFCC shows a clear bias against OC.


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Grapeshot

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Couldn't disagree more. Hiding OC, while NOT hiding CC, shows a preference against OC, as if there is something to be hidden about it.

And registration costs more than time. It costs information. If they are going to hide information from me, I won't share any of mine with them.

OFCC shows a clear bias against OC.

Official ruling, called decision - no determined organizational bias against OC by OFCC known.

Eye you have made your personal opinion clear - guess where continued rants will go. There will be no repetitious "voting" or hammering of the point by one user out of approx. 31,000 registered users.

Yep, you live in a super secret bunker - however, anyone that wants to locate who and what you are can do so with relative ease: your real name, where you work, likely even where you live and even a picture of you. Much of that has been published on this open forum. So don't share it with them - in redneck phraseology, "It don't make me no never mind."
 

OC for ME

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Could not disagree more - requiring registration first in no way becomes a negative regarding OC.<snip>
With OFCC viewable to all without registration, except the OC sub-forum it seems, they have the same "problems associated with that free/unbridled access" that you decry. Anyway, any misquoters and out-of-contexters could register, read, and then misquote and out-of-context to their heart's desire. It is free to register.

OFCC giving access to OFCC's sub-forums, except the OC sub-forum it seems, indicates to me that they are little concerned with the potential of misquoters and out-of-contexters misquoting and out-of-contexting the viewable sub-forums.

We are about freedom. We are an advocate for all firearms related rights.

Ohioans for Concealed Carry, founded in 1999, is a grassroots political activist organization. When founded, the primary goal of OFCC was getting concealed carry passed into law in Ohio. With that accomplished, our mission became to refine the concealed carry law and to expand and preserve the rights of all gun owners in Ohio.

http://ohioccw.org/200907194553/what-were-about.html
Expand and preserve rights must be taken as explicit support of OC in OH it seems.
 

eye95

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With OFCC viewable to all without registration, except the OC sub-forum it seems, they have the same "problems associated with that free/unbridled access" that you decry. Anyway, any misquoters and out-of-contexters could register, read, and then misquote and out-of-context to their heart's desire. It is free to register.

OFCC giving access to OFCC's sub-forums, except the OC sub-forum it seems, indicates to me that they are little concerned with the potential of misquoters and out-of-contexters misquoting and out-of-contexting the viewable sub-forums.

Expand and preserve rights must be taken as explicit support of OC in OH it seems.

But, but, but, I am the only one out of 31,000 who feels that way. At least a certain "moderator" thinks I am and that 31,000 others have evaluated the situation. :eyeroll:


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<o>
 

Grapeshot

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Just took some time to look around OFCC's "Ohio Open Carry Discussions" and I can tell you I saw nothing there egregious or screeching against OC.

Some die hards are concerned about the negative public impact, but that you'll find anywhere. They do have OC practitioners and they schedule events where OC is the order of the day to make the point that good guys carry guns too. All in all, they are very much like the posters here - they want to keep themselves and their loved ones safe AND advance the cause of our RKBA.

I find no evidence of a concerted effort to suppress OC or limit the discussion thereof. I like the site and wish them well.
 

Grapeshot

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--snipped--

Expand and preserve rights must be taken as explicit support of OC in OH it seems.

No such quantum leap. They do not have to spend a certain minimum amount of time pushing for OC specifically. They are not even required to publicly endorse OC.

What the Forum Rule says is:

(12) NO BASHING OF OTHER GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS: Regardless of how convinced you are that another gun rights organization is not doing their job, this is not the place to air those concerns unless they are specifically related to an anti-open carry position taken by that organization. All other rants against other gun rights groups will be deleted or the thread locked.
 

MyWifeSaidYes

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I believe the Buy/Sell/Trade forums at OFCC are also hidden to unregistered users.

And as far as "registration" goes, it only requires a valid email address. No one said it has to be your primary address.
 

OC for ME

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No such quantum leap. They do not have to spend a certain minimum amount of time pushing for OC specifically. They are not even required to publicly endorse OC.

What the Forum Rule says is:

(12) NO BASHING OF OTHER GUN RIGHTS ORGANIZATIONS: Regardless of how convinced you are that another gun rights organization is not doing their job, this is not the place to air those concerns unless they are specifically related to an anti-open carry position taken by that organization. All other rants against other gun rights groups will be deleted or the thread locked.
First of all I did not bash OFCC. You dropping rule 12 on my post is, in my view, a insult.

Anyway, OFCC does not have to endorse OC and they haven't. OFCC has and does endorse CC. They have reached their goal of CC in OH, now it seems logical for them to endorse OC explicitly in keeping with their stated goal "...to refine the concealed carry law and to expand and preserve the rights of all gun owners in Ohio."

OFCC will not explicitly endorse OC, no big deal. You comparing OCDO to OFCC is also not a big deal, but it is apples to pears.
 

Grapeshot

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First of all I did not bash OFCC. You dropping rule 12 on my post is, in my view, a insult.

Anyway, OFCC does not have to endorse OC and they haven't. OFCC has and does endorse CC. They have reached their goal of CC in OH, now it seems logical for them to endorse OC explicitly in keeping with their stated goal "...to refine the concealed carry law and to expand and preserve the rights of all gun owners in Ohio."

OFCC will not explicitly endorse OC, no big deal. You comparing OCDO to OFCC is also not a big deal, but it is apples to pears.

My apolgies if it seemed as was criticizing you individually. That was not the intent, but I can see how you could reach that conclusion.

Your post just offered me the opportunity to shpw the difference between an organization that does not "explicitly" endorse OC and one that out right attacks the practice.

I don't think it is for me to tell OFCC how the should formulate their statements or policies.

This is not dissimilar to how when the Virginia Citizens Defense League was first formed - the goal was to advance the ability of legal, honest people in VA to get their concealed carry permits - the organization has grown and matured in many ways. Regarding how VCDL suggests people should carry? - We don't suggest or advise either way. We tell people that is a matter of personal choice, down to and including if they carry at all.

It is interesting to note though, that virtually all of the BoD, Executive Members and many of our membership do OC at meetings, picnics, dinners, et al, as well as daily as they go about their normal routine daily business.
 

Werz

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Just took some time to look around OFCC's "Ohio Open Carry Discussions" and I can tell you I saw nothing there egregious or screeching against OC.

Some die hards are concerned about the negative public impact, but that you'll find anywhere. They do have OC practitioners and they schedule events where OC is the order of the day to make the point that good guys carry guns too. All in all, they are very much like the posters here - they want to keep themselves and their loved ones safe AND advance the cause of our RKBA.

I find no evidence of a concerted effort to suppress OC or limit the discussion thereof. I like the site and wish them well.
And you would be welcome there; there are quite a few out-of-staters who post there. It is my understanding (not being a "hardcore insider") that the OC forum of OFCC was open and visible for about five years. A few people became dogmatic and disruptive, and some either flounced or were banned. When that type of situation arises, requiring registration reduces the volume of rampant sockpuppetry which is sure to follow ... or at least that's what many years on Usenet taught me.

Yes, a few people in OFCC have a general opposition to OC, but they are far outnumbered by those who support it, including many who very rarely OC but support it, anyway. Therefore, the OC opponents are usually pretty quiet.

Edit: And here is an official statement of an OFCC founder and director related to one reason why the OC forum requires a login.
 
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Werz

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Official ruling, called decision - no determined organizational bias against OC by OFCC known.

Eye you have made your personal opinion clear - guess where continued rants will go. There will be no repetitious "voting" or hammering of the point by one user out of approx. 31,000 registered users.

Yep, you live in a super secret bunker - however, anyone that wants to locate who and what you are can do so with relative ease: your real name, where you work, likely even where you live and even a picture of you.
Indeed, this open carry video contains quite a few images of OCDO-Ohio personalities, including three who have posted in this thread. I'm not shown because I'm behind the camera, but it does show ... guess who!
 

JediSkipdogg

Regular Member
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139
Location
Batavia
I believe the Buy/Sell/Trade forums at OFCC are also hidden to unregistered users.

And as far as "registration" goes, it only requires a valid email address. No one said it has to be your primary address.

I was just getting ready to post that. To all others, so does that mean we (OFCC) are against selling handguns? No.

We have to pick our battles wisely. The last I checked, OFCC stands for Ohioans for Concealed Carry. Our primary goal is concealed carry and therefore it's hard for us to hide our primary goal. Anything outside of our primary goal that could be used by the anti's or the media to hurt us we prefer to remain hidden from Google searches among many other searches.

However, we still stand up for the rights of everyone that wants to carry a firearm. If we didn't, we could care less about what we are asking for here. We could just tell our representatives that we know of no cases and therefore it's not an issue, so take it out of the bill. What has OC.org done for your gun rights in Ohio? If you don't want us to help us with your OC rights because we block OC, then let me know. If there's enough, then anytime something to do with OC comes up I'll be glad to tell our representatives that we don't care for the issue and they can contact OC.org for their opinion and see where that goes.

Oh, and OFCC is the only group actively suing Oberlin against their firearm ordinances. And if I recall, it was an OCer that started the whole case and we backed him up and then sued based on his story/research and our work. Quite a bit of money invested for an OCer instead of us just staying out of the matter.

Jedi Out.
 

Grapeshot

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I was just getting ready to post that. To all others, so does that mean we (OFCC) are against selling handguns? No.

We have to pick our battles wisely. The last I checked, OFCC stands for Ohioans for Concealed Carry. Our primary goal is concealed carry and therefore it's hard for us to hide our primary goal. Anything outside of our primary goal that could be used by the anti's or the media to hurt us we prefer to remain hidden from Google searches among many other searches.

However, we still stand up for the rights of everyone that wants to carry a firearm. If we didn't, we could care less about what we are asking for here. We could just tell our representatives that we know of no cases and therefore it's not an issue, so take it out of the bill. What has OC.org done for your gun rights in Ohio? If you don't want us to help us with your OC rights because we block OC, then let me know. If there's enough, then anytime something to do with OC comes up I'll be glad to tell our representatives that we don't care for the issue and they can contact OC.org for their opinion and see where that goes.

Oh, and OFCC is the only group actively suing Oberlin against their firearm ordinances. And if I recall, it was an OCer that started the whole case and we backed him up and then sued based on his story/research and our work. Quite a bit of money invested for an OCer instead of us just staying out of the matter.

Jedi Out.

OCDO is not opposed to OFCC and appreciate the organization.

Any negative comments or inferences seen here are soley the opinions of the poster and are subject to moderation.
 

BB62

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Well, one of the best stories of I've heard was published in detail in the OFCC forums, but it might be discredited if anyone learned that a shill called in the MWAG complaint.
I'd like to hear more about that story, because I'm pretty well tied in on open carry matters, and there has been no such incident involving a "shill calling in a MWAG complaint" that I'm aware of.

On the other hand, why sully "one of the best" stories you've heard of by asserting that the alleged presence of a "shill calling in a MWAG complaint" changes the bottom line of the story? I can understand your concern IF the person calling made up a story of concern where it didn't exist, but as I said, there is no such incident that I'm aware of.

Please fill us in, or alternately correct yourself.
 

MyWifeSaidYes

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I called in to the Bexley police department one day and asked about a guy I saw there. He was open carrying a holstered handgun. I asked the dispatcher if that was legal. She said it was. :D

I then asked her about the "no guns" signs on the entrance to the public park we were in. She said that private property owners are allowed to post such signs. :eek:

Oh, well.
 

Grapeshot

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I called in to the Bexley police department one day and asked about a guy I saw there. He was open carrying a holstered handgun. I asked the dispatcher if that was legal. She said it was. :D

I then asked her about the "no guns" signs on the entrance to the public park we were in. She said that private property owners are allowed to post such signs. :eek:

Oh, well.
Hey, she was batting .500 - in some leagues that is a major accomplishement.......especially in the pony leagues.
 

BB62

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I think you know exactly what I'm talking about, and you would be surprised at how much ambient conversation the stereo microphones of a video camera pick up.
No, I don't. I'll repeat it again: There has been no such incident involving a "shill calling in a MWAG complaint" that I'm aware of.

I suggest you look more deeply into the matter you're referring to by going to the source material of the alleged incident, then either enlighten us further or correct yourself.

Unless and until you have done so, I won't bother to respond further.
 
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