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Political Correctness and Darwin

Brace

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Oct 1, 2013
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Horrible. Every argument is heavily interwoven with fallacies and the conclusions don't even follow. Darwinian evolution is long dead but only because it's been replaced with better models, which is how science works, so it isn't even attacking a valid target. Targets of opportunity are consistently attacked in place of the actual views of his contemporaries, and interspersed with all of this are a smattering of talking points which bear no relationship to each other except by way of the author's own person. It is just not very good at all. At least it consists of actual ideas though, and the prose is ok.
 

77zach

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Horrible. Every argument is heavily interwoven with fallacies and the conclusions don't even follow. Darwinian evolution is long dead but only because it's been replaced with better models, which is how science works, so it isn't even attacking a valid target. Targets of opportunity are consistently attacked in place of the actual views of his contemporaries, and interspersed with all of this are a smattering of talking points which bear no relationship to each other except by way of the author's own person. It is just not very good at all. At least it consists of actual ideas though, and the prose is ok.

Oh to be sure the specifics of the models change more frequently than the latest computer hardware specifications, but the theme is unchanged. My sister's college biology book, published in 2012, shows this. The examples change, but the theme is the same as in my book from 2004 from the same authors.
 

Mr Birdman

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Darwin

Oh to be sure the specifics of the models change more frequently than the latest computer hardware specifications, but the theme is unchanged. My sister's college biology book, published in 2012, shows this. The examples change, but the theme is the same as in my book from 2004 from the same authors.

Evolution is the worlds's most dumbest and most dangerous religion there ever was. It was Hitler's religion and look what a great peace lover he was. Darwin was not a scientist the only degree he ever got was a divinity degree. Darwin was a preacher who created his own religion called evolution. Everything they have EVER used for proof has been proven to be a lie.
What has this subject have to do with open carry any way?
 

Venator

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Evolution is the worlds's most dumbest and most dangerous religion there ever was. It was Hitler's religion and look what a great peace lover he was. Darwin was not a scientist the only degree he ever got was a divinity degree. Darwin was a preacher who created his own religion called evolution. Everything they have EVER used for proof has been proven to be a lie.
What has this subject have to do with open carry any way?
It's the social lounge and most anything can be discussed.

And evolution is a scientific fact. It is the best explanation for the diversity of life on earth. WAY better than, "I don't know, therefore a god did it."
 

Brace

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Oct 1, 2013
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Scientists call everything a theory. It's part of what makes them scientists.
 

jhfc

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Jun 10, 2013
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Vancouver, WA
From wiki, a *Scientific Theory" is:

A scientific theory is a coherent set of concepts, explanations, and/or predictions of a particular aspect of reality, which can be tested and supported through repeated observations and experiments. Scientific theories are used to explain and predict aspects of the physical universe or specific areas of inquiry (e.g. electricity, chemistry, astronomy) [1][2] A critical component of a scientific theory is that it is testable and falsifiable.
A scientific theory is the product of a well-substantiated hypothesis that has been adequately corroborated by way of the scientific method. Since the confirmation process of a scientific theory is inherently based on Inductive reasoning, a scientific theory cannot be known to be true with absolute certainty; however, the validity of a scientific theory can be inferred with great confidence.[3][4] As such, as scientists collect additional scientific evidence over time, a scientific theory may be entirely rejected and modified if it does not fit the new empirical findings. In certain cases, the less-accurate unmodified scientific theory can still be treated as a theory if it is useful (due to its sheer simplicity) as an approximation under specific conditions (e.g. Newton's laws of motion as an approximation to Special relativity at small velocities relative to the speed of light).

as opposed to I have some wild-assed guess about how something might work. "Goddidit" falls into the WAG camp: no coherent set of concepts, explanations and/or predictions of a particular aspect of reality. "Goddidit" is the antithesis of knowing anything whatsoever. It is the lazy man's way of "explaining" hard things and goes back to the "methods" we used in our dark, ignorant past.

Evolution is a fact, supported by *every* scientific discipline. If you choose to deny evolution you should also deny the other outputs of these same processes: gasoline, medicine, dentistry, computers and so on.
 

beebobby

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, ,

Brace

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Neither evolution nor creation can be falsified. See Karl Popper's The Logic of Scientific Discovery, wherein falsifiability is presented as the Demarcation Problem boundary between science and non-science. Gasoline, medicine, dentistry, computers and so on are products of technology that is faaar removed from science.

That quote pertains to psuedoscience which appropriated evolutionary rhetoric, not to evolutionary theory. By that same overbroad logic one could oppose science itself on the basis of the existence of psuedoscience.
 

Primus

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Here's why I go for Evolution. The scientific community pretty much has it nailed that our DNA comes from apes (and like 6 subspecies that evolved to us). Now I've had this discussion with a very religous gentleman I met in Infantry School. He was a devote Southern Baptist and a very intelligent man. Some how we got on the conversation of this in between training. He stated "How do you know the Scientists aren't wrong or lying?" "Carbon dating is fake and inaccurate". I simply replied that I believe in science because if I so chose, I could become a scientist and do these very same tests and get the very same results for my own eyes.

This type of argument can be used for anything.... One side says "look I have this evidence right here (bones, DNA, fossils, Chemistry) this is how it works". The other side says "No I refuse to believe you, it says here in this book how it works that's all I need."

I am not a scientist, so could they be wrong or lying to me about something? Sure. But I'm comforted in the fact that I can learn their field (if I wasn't so dumb) and test their theories myself. Also, scientists regularly call themselves out out on fishy or bogus science. They are like a pack of hounds on eachother to make sure they aren't using funny numbers. A guy in Wyoming comes up with a new chemical. Well a guy in China is promptly redoing his work to make sure he isn't wrong.

Religon (Creationism) is the exact opposite. If there are an opposing views in the field (such as other religons or even all of the books scrubbed from the bible that didn't fit) they get promptly squished and the people are usually killed who say it.
 

Brace

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So much for the Problem of Demarcation, with which the giants, on whose shoulders we stand, have so struggled.

Popper wrote ~800 pages on falsification as a boundary to the Problem of Demarcation - all whisked away with an internet bon mot. If it was so easy then every one might do it.

You have a strange reading of Popper, and an even stranger inability to click links.
 
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jhfc

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Vancouver, WA
And later, Popper himself recanted his position on the falsifiability of the theory of natural selection (not evolution itself):

I still believe that natural selection works in this way as a research programme. Nevertheless, I have changed my mind about the testability and the logical status of the theory of natural selection; and I am glad to have an opportunity to make a recantation. My recantation may, I hope, contribute a little to the understanding of the status of natural selection.

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CA/CA211_1.html
 

Beretta92FSLady

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Evolution is the worlds's most dumbest and most dangerous religion there ever was. It was Hitler's religion and look what a great peace lover he was. Darwin was not a scientist the only degree he ever got was a divinity degree. Darwin was a preacher who created his own religion called evolution. Everything they have EVER used for proof has been proven to be a lie.
What has this subject have to do with open carry any way?


Hitler believed in evolution? Seriously, read Mein Kampf; Hitler, is his own words, stated that he is "[...doing the work of the Lord...]" Who the F is the Lord Hitler is referring too?
 

Beretta92FSLady

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It's the social lounge and most anything can be discussed.

And evolution is a scientific fact. It is the best explanation for the diversity of life on earth. WAY better than, "I don't know, therefore a god did it."

Please, don't associate "the best explanation," with Fact, or Scientific Fact.

It's a Fact that your association is flawed.
 

Brace

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Verisimilitude is a formal scientific concept which basically means "the best explanation". It is at the heart of science.
 

eye95

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Fairborn, Ohio, USA
God has a plan and evolution is but one component of his plan.

Could well be. However, there isn't one whit of evidence that we evolved from apes, or that we evolved from a common ancestor with apes. I have little doubt that we evolved from ape-like versions of our species.

Intraspecial evolution has been observed. Interspecial evolution has not been.

Reminds me of a joke: The answer to whether or not the chicken or the egg came first depends on whether or not you accept evolution. If you believe in Creation, God created a chicken, and it laid an egg. If you believe in evolution, something else laid an egg, and out popped a chicken.

There is evolution that alters the nature of a species (through which it adapts if it will survive). The jury is still out on one species evolving from another. Personally, I find it unlikely to the point that happening even once is highly improbable, let alone happening millions of times.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk.

<o>
 

Rusty Young Man

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Árida Zona
Hitler believed in evolution? Seriously, read Mein Kampf; Hitler, is his own words, stated that he is "[...doing the work of the Lord...]" Who the F is the Lord Hitler is referring too?

You try to paint him as a conservative. I would suggest you take your own advice and you may realize that while he may have tried to do the work of the Christian God, he had already created his own anti-Semitic version of the Trinity.
“Any philosophy, whether of a religious or political nature - and sometimes the dividing line is hard to determine - fights less for the negative destruction of the opposing ideology than for the positive promotion of its own. Hence its struggle is less defensive than offensive. It therefore has the advantage even in determining the goal, since this goal represents the victory of its own idea, while, conversely,it is hard to determine when the negative aim of the destruction of a hostile doctrine may be regarded as achieved and assured. For this reason alone, the philosophy's offensive will be more systematic and also more powerful than the defensive against a philosophy, since here, too, as always, the attack and not the defence makes the decision. The fight against a spiritual power with methods of violence remains defensive, however, until the sword becomes the support,the herald and disseminator, of a new spiritual doctrine.”
Adolph Hitler, Mein Kampf

On topic, how do we know that evolution is just a natural mechanism for stability built into the framework of a divine Creator? And this is coming from someone who espouses the Theory of Evolution ("theory" being used in the scientific sense, not the more colloquial term which is roughly equivalent to the word "guess").
 
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